Pico 4 + Streaming Assistant: How to set ASW / Motion Reprojection?

[Lange_666]

Since i can't keep 90 FPS (or 72 even) all the time in VR, i like to keep it at half the refresh rate (like with ASW on). I never get a smooth gameplay when the FPS is not fixed (not in 2D either). I just notice every fluctuation in FPS.

If i use Virtual Desktop ASW/Motion Reprojection (think it's called SSW in there) works just fine.
With 90Hz in the Pico 4 and ASW enabled, it drops to 45 FPS and stays there like it should.

Not so in Streaming Assistant: There i can't seem to set ASW. I just get the FPS cap that i set in the NVidia Control Panel for when running in 2D. If that is set to 60 then i get 60 FPS in VR when streaming through Streaming Assistant (wired and wireless). If i set it to 30, i'll get 30 FPS in VR.
The Motion Reprojection setting in SteamVR doesn't seem to do anything here (nor does it in a Virtual Desktop stream).

Anybody any clue how to set Streaming Assistant so ASW / Motion Reprojection works with Pico's Streaming Assistant?
And if not, how to make it work in SteamVR if it is already set to on there?

 

Edit: I found a post on Reddit (https://www.reddit.com/r/virtualreality/comments/yfrisz/pico_4_pcvr_tips_how_to_make_the_pico_streaming/ ) where the topic starter writes: I also like going into the gear for "advanced settings" and turn on ASW, which does a pretty decent job interpolating frames when needed without adding noticeable latency.
I don't have any advanced settings so turning on ASW is not an option.
There is a setting called "Frame Interpolation" but set on or off doesn't make any difference.

 

Edited May 7, 2023 by Lange_666

[SebastianR]

Pico's Streaming assistant 9.4.7.1 has asw option. Also has a sharpening option to get a better definition image

[Lange_666]

I'm running 9.7.4.1 so i guess ASW is called Frame Interpolation then?
It's turned on but it doesn't really work.
Whatever refreshfrequency i set in the Pico, 72 or 90Hz, when running Streaming Assistant it will default to the cap framerate i've set in the NVidia Control Panel.
Oculus on my Rift-S and Virtual Desktop for the Pico don't do that, they don't care about the NVidia setting and drop to half the refreshrate when the initial refreshrate can't be reached or always to half the refreshrate when set to On instead of Auto.

null

Edited May 8, 2023 by Lange_666

[Lange_666]

Just tried every combination with Streaming Assistant and SteamVR regarding ASW:

- NVidia CP FPS set to unlimited.
- SteamVR: Motion Smoothing OFF in both global and DCS settings
- Streaming Assistant: Frame Interpolation ON
Test: Caucasus: F-18: Free Flight: FPS starts at 90 but PC can't keep that up, FPS starts to fluctuate into the high/low 80's. ASW doesn't kick in. Lots of stutter when FPS is below 90.

- NVidia CP FPS set to unlimited.
- SteamVR: Motion Smoothing ON in global and OFF in DCS settings
- Streaming Assistant: Frame Interpolation ON
Test: Caucasus: F-18: Free Flight: FPS starts at 90 but PC can't keep that up, FPS starts to fluctuate into the high/low 80's. ASW doesn't kick in. Lots of stutter.

- NVidia CP FPS set to unlimited.
- SteamVR: Motion Smoothing ON in global and OFF in DCS settings
- Streaming Assistant: Frame Interpolation OFF
Test: Caucasus: F-18: Free Flight: FPS starts at 90 but PC can't keep that up, FPS starts to fluctuate into the high/low 80's. ASW doesn't kick in (so SteamVR setting is not taken into account). Lots of stutter

- NVidia CP FPS set to unlimited.
- SteamVR: Motion Smoothing ON in and ALWAYS ON DCS settings
- Streaming Assistant: Frame Interpolation OFF
Test: Caucasus: F-18: Free Flight: FPS starts at 90 but PC can't keep that up, FPS starts to fluctuate into the high/low 80's. ASW doesn't kick in. Lots of stutter

- NVidia CP FPS set to 45.
- SteamVR: Motion Smoothing OFF in both global and DCS settings
- Streaming Assistant: Frame Interpolation OFF
Test: Caucasus: F-18: Free Flight: FPS stays at 45 constantly but really bad ghosting (even with ASW on there is far less ghosting in Virtual Desktop). Almost no stutter.

- NVidia CP FPS set to 45.
- SteamVR: Motion Smoothing ON in both global and DCS settings
- Streaming Assistant: Frame Interpolation OFF
Test: Caucasus: F-18: Free Flight: FPS stays at 45 constantly but really bad ghosting (even with ASW on there is far less ghosting in Virtual Desktop). Almost no stutter.

- NVidia CP FPS set to 45.
- SteamVR: Motion Smoothing ON and ALWAYS ON DCS settings
- Streaming Assistant: Frame Interpolation ON
Test: Caucasus: F-18: Free Flight: FPS stays at 45 constantly but really bad ghosting (even with ASW on there is far less ghosting in Virtual Desktop). Almost no stutter.

Also played around with Frame Buffering: no effect.

Edited May 8, 2023 by Lange_666

[SebastianR]

Why don't you use it in 72hz and try to keep the 72fps constant?

[Lange_666]

That's not an option on certain maps in multi-player and depending on the unit count and ongoing actions. If the FPS then dips below 72 stutter is my deal and then it's over and done.
The low to higher 80's on Caucasus are in the free flight mission, nothing going on there.
I like to have a general setting for everything apart from the already different setup for 2D.

[SebastianR]

Have you tried ALVR?

[Lange_666]

Gave it one shot but with the default setting it was just poor. Need to look into it more, will be something for the next few days. Lots of settings to try.

Edited May 8, 2023 by Lange_666

[Lange_666]

ALVR is by far the worst of the 3 for the moment. It's choppy, stuttery, ghosting is even more extreme the with SA to a point where it's just unplayable.
Where SA and VD get to 90 FPS, ALVR has throuble to get even over 60 and then giving even a lot lower visual quality.
ASW is nowhere to be seen and just like in SA, the SteamVR one is overridden.
Ran the latest stable and nightly version, both perform the same.
Maybe it's down to a few tweaks in the ALVR settings but for what i've tried for now, it's not good.
Thing is: what settings to change to make it better?

[VirusAM]

I returned the Pico 4 just for this reason.

I was not able to use ASW (SSW really) both  in VD and not in Streaming Assistant

[Lange_666]

In VD it works fine (for me), in SA and ALVR it doesn't.

[kerlcat]

On 5/9/2023 at 5:36 PM, VirusAM said:

I returned the Pico 4 just for this reason.

I was not able to use ASW (SSW really) both  in VD and not in Streaming Assistant

Now ASW working well in VD, we got similar PC setup, you should be able to see 90 fps quite often if not always if partial high setting with graphics, if you still had it. I guess you purchased it too early before it's getting mature.

[VirusAM]

Now ASW working well in VD, we got similar PC setup, you should be able to see 90 fps quite often if not always if partial high setting with graphics, if you still had it. I guess you purchased it too early before it's getting mature.

I was not able to get 72fps..the problem was that with streaming assistant motion reprojection was not working at all.
And with virtual desktop it was reported enabled but i had the same stuttering as it was off.
I returned the hmd just a couple of weeks ago after many trials and tests.
Maybe my 3090 is a fake one I don't know what to say.

[Lange_666]

On 5/11/2023 at 7:13 PM, kerlcat said:

Now ASW working well in VD.

It does work but not as good as it did with the Rift-S. When the frametime starts to show little spikes it is less smooth. I did not had this with the Rift-S and i directly noticed the difference. Terrain then shows a little wave effect if you move your head quickly until the frametime flattens out again, then the effect is gone. FPS does stay fix at this point.
I also discovered that if there is an FPS cap set, either manually in the NVidia CP or by setting a monitor refreshrate like 60Hz and then VSync on, the FPS in the headset is also limited to this value and doesn't reach 72 or 90 when ASW is disabled. If ASW is enabled in this case it's just not playable. Not smooth.
The Rift-S with its Display Port didn't do that, there the FPS cap was overridden and it's own frequency was used.
I "guess" this comes by the fact that the video is streamed.

But if there is no FPS cap set in the NVidia CP (or the monitors refresh is higher then the refresh of the headset) and ASW is disabled, it's a smooth experience.
But a headset with a display port is better although i believe streaming is the way the scene is moving to... 

Edited May 12, 2023 by Lange_666

[kerlcat]

@VirusAM @Lange_666 I only use VD w/ ASW on. fps maintained at 70-90 while latency is pain in ass which barely maintaining a bit below 60ms. Stuttering is almost gone after I used MT(but someone reported MT didn't make that better). Clarity is obviously better than my previous Rift S. But still bottlenecked by the capped tething transfering rate at poor 150Mbps. Do miss Rift-S which is plug&play but I still keep Pico and sold that in a week. Pico4 is nothing more than a transitional headset until next gen became reachable. Curious Apple's XR in a few weeks. Won't be something for DCS while could potentially shake up the whole VR industry. Also waiting for actual users' feedback on Crystal. Won't pull the trigger till it became mature. Aero ... way too expensive and dislike stations. And of coz, Quest3, but no like to come with DP support. So... same bottleneck it will have. Let's see. 

Edited May 12, 2023 by kerlcat