[NO BUG] MCB breaker (F14A) bug

[Elliot]

Bug: Hello. I would just like to submit a report that the Mid Compression Bypass breaker pull keybind in the F14A Tomcat is not functional.

 

Can I reproduce it 100%: Yes

 

How to reproduce:

 

 Step 1: Open the fuel probe

 Step 2: Pull the breaker

 Step 3: Throttle up to mil power

Step 4 : Switch to the RIO seat and do the MCB circuit tests, + check power output

 Result: Both of the lights will stay lit, indicating the circuit is still functioning. In addition, no thrust is returned.

 

DCS Version: OpenBeta 2.8.6.41363

 

System Specs:

CPU: Ryzen 9 5900X

GPU: NVIDIA Geforce RTX 4080

RAM: 64GB 3600MHZ DDR4 (quad 16gb sticks)

SSD: Samsung 980 Pro (iirc)

OS: Windows 11 Pro

 

Peripherals:

 

Joystick: Thrustmaster TM16000M

Throttle: Thrustmaster TM16000M

Pedals: None (slider used on throttle)

Others: None

 

Headtracker: VR (rare occasions)

 

Mission File: Instant action freeflight (also doesnt work anywhere else, including multiplayer)

 

Log: see attached

 Track: see attached

 Video/ Screenshots: see link

https://streamable.com/vb86yv

 

 Mods: Core sounds mod (Echo19)

**I tested it both on ST and MT, no luck for either of them

also sorry for the blinking in the video, it's likely just a thing for me (it doesnt happen ingame, only out of tab and during videos)

dcs.log bug.trk

Edited June 26, 2023 by Elliot
slight additions + corrections

[Silhou]

Hey @Elliot! Thank you very much for your detailed report. I tracked it internally as DCSF14-471 for the dev team to look at.

[fat creason]

I think I'm just going to remove the MCB keybind and code, no one used this in real life anyway.

[Elliot]

9 hours ago, fat creason said:

I think I'm just going to remove the MCB keybind and code, no one used this in real life anyway.

if so, will the test switch remain functional or will you make it unclickable (as it will no longer have a use) 

also, instead of plain out removing it, could we have a vote on removing it? it kinda feels unfair just to break the news right as i wanted it fixed

Edited June 28, 2023 by Elliot
additions

[sLYFa]

I dont understand why people wanted it in the first place. There is that one (probably partially made up) story of it being used in a training engagement but the MCB is there for a very good reason. The last thing you want is one engine quitting in a low speed/high AoA situtation that will almost guarantee a departure from controlled flight. In all other situations, the MCB will be closed anyway so there is no point in having the CB modelled.

[fat creason]

35 minutes ago, sLYFa said:

I dont understand why people wanted it in the first place. There is that one (probably partially made up) story of it being used in a training engagement but the MCB is there for a very good reason. The last thing you want is one engine quitting in a low speed/high AoA situtation that will almost guarantee a departure from controlled flight. In all other situations, the MCB will be closed anyway so there is no point in having the CB modelled.

[Elliot]

16 minutes ago, fat creason said:

I'll take my second question as a no then, but what about the test switch? will it remain functional or will it become unclickable as it won't have a use

[Elliot]

1 hour ago, sLYFa said:

The last thing you want is one engine quitting in a low speed/high AoA situtation that will almost guarantee a departure from controlled flight.

that is true, however, the only time i ever seem to get a compressor stall in the A is when i yank back on the stick at idle and really slow, or duing rapid AOA transitions, but if it's a constant AOA, nothing usually happens. if you ask me, i'd happily exchange some of that engine stability for my thrust back.

 

and at the end of the day, if the breaker stays modelled, we could always turn it back on to prevent such issues from happening

Edited June 28, 2023 by Elliot

[Hayrake YE-ZB]

That’s because the MCB system is working and preventing engine stalls. Turn it off, and you’ll get the same lethal engine problems that the TF30 P-412A had in the early Cats, after HB spends resources modeling it.

Fly the B if you want more thrust. The GE motors in the A+/B was the Navy’s solution, yours is going backwards. 

[Elliot]

that's the thing though, i kinda prefer the A because of how much she makes you work for your kill, whereas the B is just boom and zoom

not to mention the A begins to go zoom at high speeds, inlet ramps go brr

Edited June 28, 2023 by Elliot

[Elliot]

15 minutes ago, Hayrake YE-ZB said:

TF30 P-412A had in the early Cats, after HB spends resources modeling it.

speaking of that, is there any news on when that is coming out?

[draconus]

On 6/27/2023 at 11:29 PM, fat creason said:

I think I'm just going to remove the MCB keybind and code, no one used this in real life anyway.

Seems like going backwards since the code is already there. DCS is full of different than RL behaviors and situations... because we can.

[fat creason]

I could leave it if you guys really want, but I'm not going to dedicate any more time to it than I already have. There are no plans to add sounds or other indications it's been pulled or tests for it, it's just not worth the time, the current situation is as far as I'm willing to entertain it. 

[Elliot]

does that include not fixing the breaker? or will it be the last time you ever touch it after fixing it

Edited June 29, 2023 by Elliot

[fat creason]

4 minutes ago, Elliot said:

does that include not fixing the breaker? or will it be the last time you ever touch it

You can pull it right now and it disables MCB, that's all the functionality that was ever planned for it.

Edited June 29, 2023 by fat creason

[Elliot]

6 minutes ago, fat creason said:

You can pull it right now and it disables MCB, that's all the functionality that was ever planned for it.

 

oh, so it's been fixed? many thanks, i was unaware until now

[fat creason]

It was never broken to begin with so there was nothing to fix?

[Elliot]

2 minutes ago, fat creason said:

It was never broken to begin with

i tried pulling it a while back but the MCB test switch always showed the circuit as working, and plus, there was no difference in terms of compressor stalls

i'll test it again though

Edited June 29, 2023 by Elliot

[fat creason]

Yeah the test will not be implemented. Like I said, the "tactic" of pulling the MCB CB is silly in the first place, I don't plan to spend any more time on extraneous things like the MCB test. As for the compressor stalls, it's not a guarantee they'll happen. Our pilot SME had one incident in 2500 hours of flight, and that was due to a mistake. They're unlikely to happen if you keep the throttles in MIL or Zone 5, which I assume you're doing anyway because you seem concerned about thrust. There isn't a surefire way to trigger a compressor stall, there are just regimes where they're more likely to happen, it's not a boolean or IF THEN type logic.

Edited June 29, 2023 by fat creason

[Elliot]

8 minutes ago, fat creason said:

Yeah the test will not be implemented.

that makes sense, i wondered why there was no change. so i'm assuming the 'test' is more of an aesthetic feature rather than a functional one

anyhow thanks creason, you helped alot

Edited June 29, 2023 by Elliot

[draconus]

2 hours ago, fat creason said:

It was never broken to begin with so there was nothing to fix?

How can one check if it's working?

[fat creason]

35 minutes ago, draconus said:

How can one check if it's working?

There is no indicator to know when it's active, it's not something aircrews worried about. The test will not be implement as stated above, or at least it won't be implement any time soon. It won't tell you when MCB is active regardless.

Edited June 29, 2023 by fat creason

[draconus]

1 hour ago, fat creason said:

There is no indicator to know when it's active, it's not something aircrews worried about. The test will not be implement as stated above, or at least it won't be implement any time soon. It won't tell you when MCB is active regardless.

You said it's not broken so how do you know it works?

[fat creason]

45 minutes ago, draconus said:

You said it's not broken so how do you know it works?

You can't really, which is just another reason to get rid of it IMO. All it does it spawn question threads like this and it just isn't worth the time for what it is. Realistically I should have just never implemented the CB pull in the first place. The whole thing is based on a story that's clearly made up; You can't even see the CB in the RIO pit, let alone pulling it from the front seat like a certain pilot claimed he did. Not knowing the state of the CB is arguably realistic since you can't even see it from a normal seated position in the RIO seat. Every pilot we've talked to agrees pulling this CB would be absurd. I don't plan to waste any more development time on this breaker when there are so many other things to work on.

Edited June 29, 2023 by fat creason

[draconus]

I remember the story and simple plan behind it, but please, let me understand, you made a code for pulling a special CB, that does nothing in game, we can't tell if it even works, you don't seem to know either, yet you've put it in the patch notes then, described what it should do and made a key binding available. I don't use it or want it but if there is some function in the study sim you can expect users to test and check it.

Edited June 29, 2023 by draconus