DISS and moving map delay

[bingbean]

Not sure what i doing wrong, but after cold start there is some delay to DISS and moving map start to work. I thought, there is some warm up time for DISS to go work correctly , so when i play some of my own mission, I am waiting on FARP a little bit more until i take off. However i just tried the new campaign and the AI leader just take off immediately after engine start, so i have to follow him and i am flying 1-2 minutes until the DISS and map start working.  So the map is completely out of right position. So is the mission design wrong or the DISS and map is wrong? Or do i miss something?

[admiki]

Calling @AeriaGloria, calling AG. AG, please respond.

[AeriaGloria]

2 hours ago, bingbean said:

Not sure what i doing wrong, but after cold start there is some delay to DISS and moving map start to work. I thought, there is some warm up time for DISS to go work correctly , so when i play some of my own mission, I am waiting on FARP a little bit more until i take off. However i just tried the new campaign and the AI leader just take off immediately after engine start, so i have to follow him and i am flying 1-2 minutes until the DISS and map start working.  So the map is completely out of right position. So is the mission design wrong or the DISS and map is wrong? Or do i miss something?

A few patches ago they implemented the DISS-15 taking 5 minutes to fully warm up. So I would suggest getting generators on as fast as possible and doing rest after. I have also been setting the map marker at a point in the flight path a few minutes away, then turning it on when I pass over it on F10, works pretty much just as well 

Edited November 18, 2023 by AeriaGloria

[YoYo]

On 11/18/2023 at 6:35 PM, bingbean said:

Not sure what i doing wrong, but after cold start there is some delay to DISS and moving map start to work. I thought, there is some warm up time for DISS to go work correctly , so when i play some of my own mission, I am waiting on FARP a little bit more until i take off. However i just tried the new campaign and the AI leader just take off immediately after engine start, so i have to follow him and i am flying 1-2 minutes until the DISS and map start working.  So the map is completely out of right position. So is the mission design wrong or the DISS and map is wrong? Or do i miss something?

The minimum waiting time is 3 minutes. However, after starting the genartors, immediately set the Greben switch up. Then keep making the rest of checklist. When the radar altitude needle wakes up, wait a moment and you can calibrate alignment (Geben Synchronize button). In such a case, the AI misses many things, if AI Hind actually starts too quickly, in my opinion the mission should be improved.

[randomTOTEN]

Interesting,

Is there any indication of when the DISS is ready for operation after this warm up?

[AeriaGloria]

52 minutes ago, randomTOTEN said:

Interesting,

Is there any indication of when the DISS is ready for operation after this warm up?

I have been looking for something but it’s difficult. I have been pressing the “Hover” hold button, and if it lights up then your good to go 

[christopher m]

AeriaGloria,

"A few patches ago they implemented the DISS-15 taking 5 minutes to fully warm up. So I would suggest getting generators on as fast as possible and doing rest after. I have also been setting the map marker at a point in the flight path a few minutes away, then turning it on when I pass over it on F10, works pretty much just as well"

i get that you place the Map Marker "ahead" on the planned flight path

please exactly what do you "turn on" ? is it the map?

Do you initiate the DISS right after the "Geben Synchronize button" is pressed? so as to warm it up?

THNX in advance

 

Edited December 12, 2023 by christopher m

[AeriaGloria]

12 hours ago, christopher m said:

AeriaGloria,

"A few patches ago they implemented the DISS-15 taking 5 minutes to fully warm up. So I would suggest getting generators on as fast as possible and doing rest after. I have also been setting the map marker at a point in the flight path a few minutes away, then turning it on when I pass over it on F10, works pretty much just as well"

i get that you place the Map Marker "ahead" on the planned flight path

please exactly what do you "turn on" ? is it the map?

Do you initiate the DISS right after the "Geben Synchronize button" is pressed? so as to warm it up?

THNX in advance

 

 

Picture is from Chucks guide, the power switch for the map is on the lower left side of the cartographic tablet, just right of vertical position adjustment knob. This switch couples the map to the DISS-15 or not. 
 

You want to turn on DISS as normal. As long as “Doppler Power” switch is on on left hand side in front of Rad Alt switch, and generators are on, the Doppler will warm up and turn on after 5 minutes. It doesn’t matter where you turn it on or what movement you have if you aren’t using the moving map or DISS navigation panel (below the map tablet) at the same time. 
 

The navigation panel for DISS-15 is separate. Pressing its on button only initiates the counting of movement on its panel. However, if you turn it on at same time as the cartographic map, they will be perfectly in sync as they work identically. 
 

It can be nice to have the Cartographic map as a visual indicator of your movement, and the DISS navigation panel telling you exactly in km how far along your route you are, or how far from takeoff/IP you are (if you turn it on with 000 course angle so it tells you movement east/west/north/south

I’m sure this is more detail then you wanted by including the navigation panel, but I wanted to avoid misunderstandings to make sure you know it’s separate from the map, and the cool way they can work together.   
 

Also make sure you never turn on airspeed to doppler. It will work automatically if Doppler fails, in which case movement on map is decided by airspeed And heading 

[christopher m]

i have chucks guide and have studied it pretty intensely, 

so we have to turn on the Map and the DISS-15 at the same time?

OR would it work to have the DISS-15 powered up and then just flick on the Map when you fly over a reference point that the Map Marker is fixed to?

i really like to use the DISS-15 and the Map in my personal PVE missions along with Auto-Pilot Route following just wish the Maps had better FUNCTIONALITY

attached is a link to a Description and Usage Guide for the DISS-15 by couple of GUY's that i translated, it has some interesting info on how to integrate Radio and Doppler Navigation

and use them together for complicated flights where one of the systems is insufficient for correct Navigation.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1H_CmM3D8N1kXuQgGZemPBjSjJmgKrwfw/view?usp=sharing

the original post on DCS World User Files is here:

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3328257/

 

 

 

 

[AeriaGloria]

1 hour ago, christopher m said:

i have chucks guide and have studied it pretty intensely, 

so we have to turn on the Map and the DISS-15 at the same time?

OR would it work to have the DISS-15 powered up and then just flick on the Map when you fly over a reference point that the Map Marker is fixed to?

i really like to use the DISS-15 and the Map in my personal PVE missions along with Auto-Pilot Route following just wish the Maps had better FUNCTIONALITY

attached is a link to a Description and Usage Guide for the DISS-15 by couple of GUY's that i translated, it has some interesting info on how to integrate Radio and Doppler Navigation

and use them together for complicated flights where one of the systems is insufficient for correct Navigation.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1H_CmM3D8N1kXuQgGZemPBjSjJmgKrwfw/view?usp=sharing

the original post on DCS World User Files is here:

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3328257/

 

 

 

 

You never have to turn both on. They are completely independent 

But let’s say I am taking off. I have an assigned route to follow that I plugged into DISS-15 nav panel, and I want the moving map and the nav panel to show the same thing. It has been five minutes since generators were on so DISS-15 is working. I want to have them both turned on and working before takeoff so they can count any movement. It doesn’t matter if I have one turned on significant before the other, as long as both are on and work from the moment of takeoff/taxxiing. 
 

If I need to takeoff fast (before DISS warms up) and want to use a reference point after takeoff for best moving map/nav panel position accuracy, I will want to

- input the needed route data in the panel for starting from reference point

-move moving map marker to reference point

-then turn both of them on at the same time over the reference point.  Since any difference In time will cause them to match less as you fly with speed. 
 

If you are not using Nav panel for DISS-15, it is of no matter.  

Edited December 13, 2023 by AeriaGloria

[LuseKofte]

On 11/19/2023 at 11:55 PM, YoYo said:

AI Hind actually starts too quickly, in my opinion the mission should be improved

I currently fly pandemic campaign. And you have to start up pretty quick in order to follow the rest. I have noticed the delay also. 

[christopher m]

21 hours ago, AeriaGloria said:

You never have to turn both on. They are completely independent 

But let’s say I am taking off. I have an assigned route to follow that I plugged into DISS-15 nav panel, and I want the moving map and the nav panel to show the same thing. It has been five minutes since generators were on so DISS-15 is working. I want to have them both turned on and working before takeoff so they can count any movement. It doesn’t matter if I have one turned on significant before the other, as long as both are on and work from the moment of takeoff/taxxiing. 
 

If I need to takeoff fast (before DISS warms up) and want to use a reference point after takeoff for best moving map/nav panel position accuracy, I will want to

- input the needed route data in the panel for starting from reference point

-move moving map marker to reference point

-then turn both of them on at the same time over the reference point.  Since any difference In time will cause them to match less as you fly with speed. 
 

If you are not using Nav panel for DISS-15, it is of no matter.  

 

OK i got it, for the DISS-15 to be "in sink" with the MAP flight plan you need simultaneous initiation of the MAP and DISS-15

then the data read-out on the DISS-15 will be in sink with the MAP flight plan or from the point of initiation when using MAP Marker as a starting point

check'

we really need that MAP FUNCTIONALITY to be FLESHED-OUT for some increase in IMMERSION (wink-wink to TPTB)

[AeriaGloria]

Be careful asking for immersion, would you like to have to place a new map manually when your beginning map is out of bounds and line it up perfectly with some landmark or reference point

What map functionality do you mean? My only wish is to draw on it 

[christopher m]

20 hours ago, AeriaGloria said:

Be careful asking for immersion, would you like to have to place a new map manually when your beginning map is out of bounds and line it up perfectly with some landmark or reference point

What map functionality do you mean? My only wish is to draw on it 

Maps that accurately reflect (in both scales) all the DCS Maps, not having to re-position the Map Marker when switching scales, and yes we need to be able to "mark it up"

 

[AeriaGloria]

34 minutes ago, christopher m said:

Maps that accurately reflect (in both scales) all the DCS Maps, not having to re-position the Map Marker when switching scales, and yes we need to be able to "mark it up"

 

In my experience the misplaced map marker between scales always happens after you adjust it. Sometimes I feel turning it off and doing the adjustments while it’s off work best, or sometimes it seems like only if I make the adjustments before the first time I turn it on does the map marker work properly between the two scales 

[YoYo]

6 hours ago, christopher m said:

Maps that accurately reflect (in both scales) all the DCS Maps, not having to re-position the Map Marker when switching scales, and yes we need to be able to "mark it up"

 

But I would like to remind you that we do not live in an ideal world  and never have, especially with Soviet, not electronic equipment. Personally, I think that what we have works great anyway and I can always find my way. Additionally, it is worth remembering that DISS-15 itself is not a perfect thing like GPS, but mechanical calculations, just like a marker on a map. In some situations, it works by memory and not with real data collected during the flight. All this causes some errors and shifts. So there is no situation here that everything is 1:1. No, it's a mechanical device that sometimes doesn't show perfect data. I think it was done very decently and I don't have any problems with it as much as in real life. It should also be added that the map pad was not used very often and I dare say that in most cases it was an empty space during flights which is no secret. The only thing I would like are maps that are better and match each other. Nowadays, sometimes we have a conglomeration of different formats, which consist of squares and can even differ in colors. However, this is a matter of the DCS map itself and its content, not the Hind module.