Landing the Mosquito

[Doc3908]

3 hours ago, Holbeach said:

The landing gear is less compliant than it use to be, which makes it more susceptible to damage on touchdown, as you proved on your last landing.

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"Stiffer" and "more susceptible to damage" are not necessarily correlated. The LG may indeed have been stiff, but I can't imagine that the real aircraft was all that fragile given the rigors of war and the brief training of the average ww2 pilot...

But my beef is with how irritating taxiing is now. You can't really make it out in the video, but with the VR headset on, it's very annoying. It's understandable that the stiff LG would make taxiing more bumpy, but in the real aircraft your whole body was bouncing around while, in VR, my body stays comfy in my chair but my eyesight is being subjected to a rapid vibration. It seems more pronounced on harder surfaces than on grass (which makes sense). I'm not sure if there's something they can do about it if it's realistic systems modeling they are after...

[Ala13_ManOWar]

On 3/26/2024 at 6:56 PM, Bozon said:

@Ala13_ManOWar I think you are correct about the back side of the power (required) curve. 

The Mosquito feels like it has a lot of induced drag and a fairly steep reversed slope for that curve around ~120 mph and below. If I use engine power to hold the speed, and then cut it for the flare, my speed drops fast, the drag shoots up, and I immediately sink and hit the runway hard at the bottom of the flare. It is a matter of practice I know.

Just easier for me to come faster, steeper and power off all the way. Less stuff to manage and the longer float gives my poor flying skills just the time I need to stabilize a 1 meter floating till a gentle touch down.

Yep, totally seems so about the power curve. In simulation it's always harder to assess that compared to RL since we're just in front of a screen with no feelings at all.

[Ala13_ManOWar]

On 3/29/2024 at 12:18 PM, VH-Rock said:

I think the thing here is that if you were landing with the proper technique before, the new landing gear code hasn't made much of a difference. If you were on the limit before, you'll now find it more challenging. There's some great advice in here that should help people overcome the new challenge

Totally this .

 

P.S.: hi Rock, how're you doing? being a long time. Nice to read you around here

[Holbeach]

landing at heavy weights.

Indicator panel included.

 

Land with near full fuel (100% at T/O) and tail wheel breakage becomes a big thing.

Landing at Halden (93% fuel) was made easier with 18 deg flap instead of full), but higher speed (96kt stall speed) and less drag meant more braking required.

Landing at Senaki with 30% fuel, was dead easy in comparison.

 

 

 

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Edited April 3, 2024 by Holbeach

[Charley]

I think watching your videos has helped me, Holbeach. I can do at least half- way decent landings now , over half the time , although I'm starting to realize that in real life the RAF might not have granted me 2 or 3 hundred airplanes to crash while I got the technique down. I think one of the problems I had was flaring too high, misjudging my height over the runway & then having the plane drop out of the air with not enough speed. I haven't tried landing a heavily loaded Mosquito yet, but now I'm trying to slowly introduce a crosswind. This will be a test of the landing gear. The gear seems like it might be modeled to be really  too fragile, but I'll never know . Anyway, I appreciate everyone's  discussion here.

Edited April 1, 2024 by Charley

[VH-Rock]

On 3/30/2024 at 12:55 PM, Ala13_ManOWar said:

Totally this .

 

P.S.: hi Rock, how're you doing? being a long time. Nice to read you around here

Good to see you bud! All good here, how about you? - I haven't done much flying for a little while (real life getting in the way), but I've slowly started getting back to it. 

[Ala13_ManOWar]

55 minutes ago, VH-Rock said:

Good to see you bud! All good here, how about you? - I haven't done much flying for a little while (real life getting in the way), but I've slowly started getting back to it. 

Same all, not bad but not flying as much as I'd like, didn't even plug the controls since I can't remember now. Glad to hear from you mate .

[Skewgear]

On 3/31/2024 at 9:03 PM, Holbeach said:

Land with near full fuel and tail wheel breakage becomes a big thing.

Max landing weight in the Mosquito FB.VI is 20,500lbs. Max takeoff weight is 22,300lbs.

If you land overweight, you're going to damage the aircraft...

Edited April 2, 2024 by Skewgear
typo

[Bozon]

2 hours ago, Skewgear said:

Max landing weight in the Mosquito FB.VI is 20,500lbs. Max takeoff weight is 22,300lbs.

If you land overweight, you're going to damage the aircraft...

 

Hey, I was already overweight when I got on the plane and I doubt this can change before I land it.

[Holbeach]

13 hours ago, Skewgear said:

Max landing weight in the Mosquito FB.VI is 20,500lbs. Max takeoff weight is 22,300lbs.

If you land overweight, you're going to damage the aircraft...

 

Max T/O weight is 20,500 lb. plus 1500 lb disposable load (RL).

Max T/O @ full fuel is 20,300 lb so I'm well within my max landing weight of 20,500 lb.

 

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Edited April 3, 2024 by Holbeach

[Slippa]

10 hours ago, Bozon said:

Hey, I was already overweight when I got on the plane and I doubt this can change before I land it.

Get yourself in a chase with a 109, fly through a couple of hangars, you’ll lose a couple of pounds in sweat. 

If a pilot had to go around after taking off, say emergency landing or something, would they have to dump fuel IRL so as not to break the aircraft? I can’t see it being like it is in DCS, especially since the bounce buggery update. 

Holbeach, cheers for the cheeky Rochester airport video. I was trying it myself for a bit after seeing that a year or so back. Nicely done. 

[Holbeach]

23 hours ago, Slippa said:

 

If a pilot had to go around after taking off, say emergency landing or something, would they have to dump fuel IRL so as not to break the aircraft? I can’t see it being like it is in DCS, especially since the bounce buggery update. 

Holbeach, cheers for the cheeky Rochester airport video. I was trying it myself for a bit after seeing that a year or so back. Nicely done. 

Funnily enough,

I made a video this morning with a max weight T/O of 22,252 lb, full fuel plus 4 500 lb bombs, from High Halden, with a medical emergency go round and landing at about 22,000 lb. There's no method for dumping fuel. Bombs were routinely brought back during wartime and placed in store, rather than dump them on the locals.

Rochester was a mission I made to depict the early war attack by Dorniers on the Stirling factory at Rochester and Chatham Dockyard.

It uses 7 x 4 Ju 88 bombers and about 4 squadrons of defending Spits From 4 airfields.

AAA batteries are placed accurately from wartime records

Great fun.

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Edited April 4, 2024 by Holbeach
Added info.

[Holbeach]

T/O from High Halden with full fuel and 4 500 lb bombs.

Ginger, the navigator has conked out. Medical emergency declared. Bomb jettison is not approved.

Go round and return to H H with full load. Wind is dead ahead at 16 kts.

.

Indicator included.

 

 

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Edited April 3, 2024 by Holbeach

[berniRTX720]

I had lots of trouble landing until I kept flaps fully retracted and now I nail most of my landings.

[Munin]

In the film 633 Squadron they always wheel land with full flaps.

 

Edited May 2, 2024 by Munin
typo

[Slippa]

Flying the Mossie in MP one Sunday, 633Sqn happened to come on the telly and I left it on in the background while I flew.

Mrs Slippa came in the room at one point. She took one look at me with my trackIR cap on, looked at the telly, then back at me, shook her head and went back out of the room. 

I’ve been using full flaps lately on landing. (With nav lights so as not to be rude) Take-offs I learnt with no flap at all but almost always drop 10deg now.

[Holbeach]

6 hours ago, Munin said:

In the film 266 Squadron they always wheel land with full flaps.

 

Ahh the good old 633 Squadron, back in '64.

8 Mossies used in this film, all ex target tugs, sold into civilian use.

All were stripped of military gear, guns etc, and are therefore very lightweight. One was sacrificed for the cause.

With a long runway, (Inverness Airport), and a dramatic film to produce, a wheelie was the best choice, as are the museum pieces at airshows.

Some good shots of the gear struts though.

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[Munin]

Found the full movie:

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x8wvhqe

Edited May 3, 2024 by Munin

[Holbeach]

DCS, Mossie landing, Biggin Hill 3 point.

landing.. For my record.. v.2.9.4.53990..

 

 

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Edited May 9, 2024 by Holbeach

[Holbeach]

This was supposed to be the last video to round off my bug report, but the thread was locked, so I'll put it here.

Landing at Deanland grass airfield, to show main gear strut deflection after a successful update. Also T/O using the Deanland hump, which gives a very nice, instant full travel of the gear strut. For my reference. Version 2.9.5.55300. .

 

 

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[Ala13_ManOWar]

Beautiful landing mate .

[Yo-Yo]

 

[Bozon]

I can confirm that the bounce situation has significantly improved. I did some testing with rough touchdowns. They did bounce, as should be, but it was very moderate and manageable. A soft landing with little or no bounce is pretty easy now. No tail wheels were broken.

I only did 3 points landings.

Edited June 23, 2024 by Bozon

[Tea-Pig]

This.......

[Slippa]

18 hours ago, Tea-Pig said:

This.......

Yeah!

Came here because I tried the Mossie again last night after installing the carnage update. As soon as I started rolling I thought it was better. Then I rolled out more. It’s spongy which is fair enough but the silly juddering mess seems, and I say it tentatively til more testing, to be fixed.

I really hope so. I’ll check around a few maps later but I’m more hopeful now than I have been for months about it. If this is fixed I’ll forgive the update carnage elsewhere.

More testing then…