Separate Mission Editor that can run side-by-side with DCS Engine and attach to 'live' missions with Debug Views and Script Injection

[TEMPEST.114]

It should also be able to render the map/units in the Mission Editor in a live way in the Game Engine (mission not running) just like has been able to be achieved by the 3rd party Web Designer, until it can be rendered in full 3D within the mission editor alone. 

We need to be able to view all the states of the triggers, conditions and flags LIVE as a mission is being played out (even a replay by track) and we need to, in the event of being attached to a 'live' mission, be able to inject or change any of these 'on-the-fly'.

Forcing the ME to be either / or with the game is massively limiting and slows down mission/campaign creation by a huge factor; this has not be the way with proper game engines for over 20 years.

[SkateZilla]

WebEditor is also on the way.

[Pikey]

+1 for a Mission Editor 3D environment with Lua interpreter and code execution box.

So sad to see FSFIan hasnt come back since 2020, he was a visionary, its been ten years since using WItchcraft and the offline web page for mission editors. Witchcraft was a fantastic project. Maybe it even still works? https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x21d3ac

Until then, you can have a basic way to run scripts  whilst the environment is running using the video I posted many years back;

 

Edited April 22 by Pikey
dailymoption url gets autovideod then breaks?

[TEMPEST.114]

1 hour ago, SkateZilla said:

WebEditor is also on the way.

I know; it's not what I was pitching or needing.

[winghunter]

there is dcsfiddle.pages.dev by our co-developer, its a modernised witchcraft

Edited April 24 by winghunter

[TEMPEST.114]

As I've said many, many times, web apps are NEVER the solution to anything.

I took a look at your 'co-dev's' site. It's broken - which is typical of web apps. The link to documentation opens a new tab of the same page and you don't get any documentation.

Web dev is never the answer but especially when you need to hook into a game engine.

This needs to be a proper programming language solution built by real software engineers, not self-taught bedroom 'web devs' and architected properly using good Software Engineering principles. 

Hence, only ED - or a team ED subs out to - can do it.

Edited May 5 by TEMPEST.114

[winghunter]

10 hours ago, TEMPEST.114 said:

As I've said many, many times, web apps are NEVER the solution to anything.

I took a look at your 'co-dev's' site. It's broken - which is typical of web apps. The link to documentation opens a new tab of the same page and you don't get any documentation.

Web dev is never the answer but especially when you need to hook into a game engine.

This needs to be a proper programming language solution built by real software engineers, not self-taught bedroom 'web devs' and architected properly using good Software Engineering principles. 

Hence, only ED - or a team ED subs out to - can do it.

 

[Mike64]

10 hours ago, TEMPEST.114 said:

As I've said many, many times, web apps are NEVER the solution to anything.

I took a look at your 'co-dev's' site. It's broken - which is typical of web apps. The link to documentation opens a new tab of the same page and you don't get any documentation.

Web dev is never the answer but especially when you need to hook into a game engine.

This needs to be a proper programming language solution built by real software engineers, not self-taught bedroom 'web devs' and architected properly using good Software Engineering principles. 

Hence, only ED - or a team ED subs out to - can do it.

 

Do you, mean the site that was built in a few days?
By a Principal Software Engineer.
In their spare time.

According to your bio, you are an Airline Pilot (Captain) for UK regional airline. 
And we know you know nothing about software engineering because you think ED is good at it.
 

[TEMPEST.114]

1 hour ago, Mike64 said:

Do you, mean the site that was built in a few days?
By a Principal Software Engineer.
In their spare time.

According to your bio, you are an Airline Pilot (Captain) for UK regional airline. 
And we know you know nothing about software engineering because you think ED is good at it.
 

When did I ever say ED was good (or bad) at it? Just that it should be first party not third. If anything from the warnings I've had from Bignewy and Nineline, they'd say I was firmly in disagreement with your fallacious claim?

But I see I've touched a nerve despite you not being the web dev in question. 

Edited May 6 by TEMPEST.114

[cfrag]

11 hours ago, TEMPEST.114 said:

web apps are NEVER the solution to anything.

That's an interesting take, and one I'm not sure everyone agrees on. To me, the distinction between 'web apps' and 'apps' is an artificial, and not necessarily meaningful one, as it encapsulates the delivery method (web) with the solution (app). I know of a lot of active, deployed and productive apps that are using the web as delivery method, i.e. they are 'web apps'. There are really big organizations(Amazon, Entertainment Industry, Google, Microsoft, Apple, most big banks, insurances, HR consulting and many government agencies in Europe) that deploy web apps to support and or generate their business. "Web apps" are a class of client/server apps that will dominate the software industry (and in some parts already do) for at least the coming decade, and you ignore them at your own peril.

So I think that with "web apps" you are thinking of apps that are those that are created and maintained by hobbyists, i.e. non-organizational, unfunded and likely amateur-created apps (no shade on amateur intended, they pour their life-blood into their creations!). These tend to use a web-based deployment method because web browsers allow these apps to run on all OS, usually with a minimum of preconditions, and the toolchain required to design, develop, debug, document and deploy an app is free, and freely available. So, yes, there will be a lot of failures in this space: time runs out, the authors lose interest, or other mishaps. The app loses maintenance and dies. In hobby space that happens a lot, yes. But I think your generalization is perhaps off the mark.

Let me put it this way: imagine ED develop and release a web-based Mission Editor for DCS: It integrates fully with their User Files and allows players to discover other contributor's work. Mission creators can publish, and update their missions to the User Files from within that web app, and you can edit a mission in your browser while DCS runs a copy of that mission at the same time (meaning that any changes require DCS to reload the mission). Oh, and the web editor gives a full 3D view of your mission.

I'd say that above dream is a solution to some of my requests, and since it's funded and developed by ED it would also be professionally maintained (well, let's say as well as ED is maintained today...). So, web apps can very well be very good solutions. It's not the delivery method that breaks our current selection of alternatives: it's the fact that they require a lasting support, a lot of engineering (which puts a good solution out of the reach of most non-professionals), and incredible dedication. So unless ED throw their support behind such a beast, I suspect that it won't get all that far. We know that the DCS Web editor exists, and to me it seems promising indeed. In many aspects it already outshines what we have in DCS. Keeping that project running is an impressive feat and the people who contribute deserve our unadulterated respect and support. Claiming their efforts are for naught simply because it is web-based seems unfair und a bit undeserving to me.