DummyCatz Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 Just a minor bug in the CAT I Limiter. The blended AOA feedback bias used in the g-command system is not correct for the FLCS version we had. According to Figure 3.1 Longitudinal Control Block Diagram from the DTIC paper 'F-16 Simulator for Man-in-the-Loop Testing of Aircraft Control Systems (SIMTACS)' (https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/citations/ADA189675), the AOA bias used for an initial g-command reduction should be 15.8, but not 15.0 as currently is in DCS. This results in a lower AOA limit than expected. The figure is also backed up by the publicly available FLCS flashcard (https://quizlet.com/309832047/flcs-flash-cards/), which states that the G command system decreases available G when AOA > 15.8 (CAT I). The current 15.0 bias is seems to be used by a very old version of FLCS. 16CM g-command should not be reduced until 15.8 AOA.trk 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DummyCatz Posted August 16 Author Share Posted August 16 (edited) Hi, in case it's forgotten I'd like to mention that this is not fixed as we're currently at 2.9.7. For other proof check CM-1 manual circa 2007 (not CJ-1), which the FLCS flashcard based its answer on. Edited August 16 by DummyCatz 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stroke 3 Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 What does this mean exactly? does it mean its not pulling enough aoa? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stroke 3 Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 @BIGNEWYWill this be addressed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yaga Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 (edited) 10 hours ago, Stroke 3 said: What does this mean exactly? does it mean its not pulling enough aoa? As I understand it, it means the jet won't let you pull max G as quickly if it results in AOA exceeding a threshold that is set too low in our F-16. In a very general sense, pulling would initially feel more sluggish at lower speeds with a low AOA bias and more twitchy at higher speeds as AOA bias is increased. The FLCS cares about this because stall speed increases in proportion to the square root of load factor. Edited August 17 by Yaga 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stroke 3 Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 ok thankyou. Hope this is fixed not sure if it would improve a lot in bfm or general handling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yaga Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 (edited) It would make the jet feel more responsive, so i think it would help in a lot of places. Logically, you'd want to set the FLCS threshold and curve for AOA bias so that it keeps the jet just shy of departing. Edited August 17 by Yaga 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DummyCatz Posted August 17 Author Share Posted August 17 (edited) 1 hour ago, Stroke 3 said: ok thankyou. Hope this is fixed not sure if it would improve a lot in bfm or general handling. ITR would get slightly increased at the AOA limit. Think of a 9.3g pull. As you're bleeding speed, your AOA increases as well. As soon as the AOA exceeds 15.8 (currently 15.0) degrees, the FLCS begins to reduce your g-command (all the way to 1g) as a function of AOA, so you can no longer command 9.3g. This 15.8 acts like a threshold where your stick input starting to get reduced. BTW if you're wondering why CJ-1 manual shows 9.0g limit and 15.0 threshold, because it's the wrong manual for our CM aircraft. Edited August 17 by DummyCatz 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stroke 3 Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 Got it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yaga Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 (edited) The flashcards @DummyCatz linked are great for demystifying the FLCS, even if our F-16 doesn't agree with them in more than a few spots. One such example is our F-16's stick trim being functional (often required, even) with A/P engaged. Edited August 17 by Yaga 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stroke 3 Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 Im surprised that this hasn't been looked at yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkman222 Posted August 19 Share Posted August 19 Everything concerning the FLCS should be looked at while DCS F16 is coming closer to the end of early access. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stroke 3 Posted August 19 Share Posted August 19 (edited) It basically is already the end of early access, just missing the sniper xr atp. Edited August 19 by Stroke 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkman222 Posted August 19 Share Posted August 19 Yeah. But the Sniper is just an addition to the F16 compared to the FLCS and the flight model thats always present. Also the slow speed handling characteristics which still produce oscillations at some configurations is something that could be related to the FLCS and should be looked at again. Not sure how many efforts to improve the flight model will be done after early access. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DummyCatz Posted August 19 Author Share Posted August 19 2 hours ago, darkman222 said: Yeah. But the Sniper is just an addition to the F16 compared to the FLCS and the flight model thats always present. Also the slow speed handling characteristics which still produce oscillations at some configurations is something that could be related to the FLCS and should be looked at again. Not sure how many efforts to improve the flight model will be done after early access. Yeah you remind me. I'll keep an eye on the slow speed handling. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stroke 3 Posted August 20 Share Posted August 20 I feel like this is being ignored idk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tholozor Posted August 20 Share Posted August 20 The thread is tagged as 'investigating.' 1 REAPER 51 | Tholozor VFA-136 (c.2007): https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3305981/ Arleigh Burke Destroyer Pack (2020): https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3313752/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stroke 3 Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 It took a bit of time since January, glad this is being investigated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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