resolved F18 suddendly starts rolling to the LEFT

[Skip365]

HI everyone,

Hope I am in the right section, if not, I apologize.

I am new to the DCS world, so I am trying to train myself for the F18.

I own an old Saitek x52 pro that I used to fly more then 10 years ago with lock on, so I don't know if it is a problem of this controller, of the game, or simply there is some settings in the F18 that I am missing out.

When I fly the training mission, training campain etc.. the plane after a while starts rolling to the left, this make for me impossible to finish the mission.

I have checked the axises of the controller in game , in the  game option of the windows and the controller seems fine to me.

I uploaded a video to better show you what happens.

Hope you can help me to get to the bottom of the problem.

It could be the hotas but before buying a new one I want to be sure of it.

Thank you to you all

Edited May 11, 2024 by Skip365

[razo+r]

Looks like wake turbulence. Did you enable that setting in the options?

[Skip365]

honestly I don't even know where that option is. It happens also in the training mission of the F18 included in the module, also when I start a fresh mission it works fine for a while so I don't think is this the problem. But if you could tell me where to look for this option I can check.

I forgot to mention that I have also reinstalled DCS but the problem still there.
Thank you 

Edited May 11, 2024 by Skip365

[razo+r]

21 minutes ago, Skip365 said:

honestly I don't even know where that option is.

Options/Settings -> Gameplay probably

21 minutes ago, Skip365 said:

 

It happens also in the training mission of the F18 included in the module, also when I start a fresh mission it works fine for a while so I don't think is this the problem.

Does it happen when you fly behind an aircraft only?

 

[Richard Dastardly]

Is there a fuel or stores imbalance? wake turbulence is both in options->gameplay & a mission setting but it's not really as smooth as that anyway. I hadn't flown the Hornet for 4 years until a couple of weeks ago & it's still rolling right as it used to, I just trim it out & forget it.

[Skip365]

14 minutes ago, razo+r said:

Options/Settings -> Gameplay probably

It wasn't checked.

 

Does it happen when you fly behind an aircraft only?

It also happens when I fly a solo mission.

For exemple it happend when I tryed the basic training mission for landing, there I was in SOLO and even if often happend the problem there was a few time where it did do the problem and sometime where the problem was with minimun roll , not sudden and pronaunced like in the video

 

 

[razo+r]

Just now, Skip365 said:

 

In that case please attach a short track.

You can save a track by: fly the mission, showcase the issue as quickly as possible, and after you are done flying, you have the option to save replay/track in the debriefing screen. Save it and upload it here.

[Czar66]

1 hour ago, Skip365 said:

HI everyone,

Hope I am in the right section, if not, I apologize.

I am new to the DCS world, so I am trying to train myself for the F18.

I own an old Saitek x52 pro that I used to fly more then 10 years ago with lock on, so I don't know if it is a problem of this controller, of the game, or simply there is some settings in the F18 that I am missing out.

When I fly the training mission, training campain etc.. the plane after a while starts rolling to the left, this make for me impossible to finish the mission.

I have checked the axises of the controller in game , in the  game option of the windows and the controller seems fine to me.

I uploaded a video to better show you what happens.

Hope you can help me to get to the bottom of the problem.

It could be the hotas but before buying a new one I want to be sure of it.

Thank you to you all

 

Looks like asymmetric loadout. Controls are fine, don't throw your stick out of the window yet, and the aircraft has not been trimmed judging by the lower left control output overlay.

What's the mission? I can test it out.

Edited May 11, 2024 by Czar66

[Skip365]

18 minutes ago, Czar66 said:

Looks like asymmetric loadout. Controls are fine, don't throw your stick out of the window yet, and the aircraft has not been trimmed judging by the lower left control output overlay.

What's the mission? I can test it out.

 

It is this one in this case.

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3302808/

But it also happens with the others mission included in the module of the F18, the training mission.

23 minutes ago, razo+r said:

In that case please attach a short track.

You can save a track by: fly the mission, showcase the issue as quickly as possible, and after you are done flying, you have the option to save replay/track in the debriefing screen. Save it and upload it here.

Thank you,

I will post the file as soon as I get the chance to Fly again later this evening (writing from EU/Italy)

[Czar66]

1 minute ago, Skip365 said:

It is this one in this case.

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3302808/

But it also happens with the others mission included in the module of the F18, the training mission.

I've found the mission on your video and the loadout is symmetric.

Can you tell me which training mission? There are several.

Please, post a track of the flight when this happens. You can save a track on the debrief screen and put the track file attached here on the forum.

[Skip365]

5 minutes ago, Czar66 said:

I've found the mission on your video and the loadout is symmetric.

Can you tell me which training mission? There are several.

Please, post a track of the flight when this happens. You can save a track on the debrief screen and put the track file attached here on the forum.

It happend randomly in all of the training missions, that involves flying, of the F18 and also happend when I tried the free module TF-51D that comes for free with DCS world.

 

I will post the file as soon as I get the chance to Fly again later this evening.

 

Thank you to you all for the help

[Czar66]

Just now, Skip365 said:

It happend randomly in all of the training missions, that involves flying, of the F18 and also happend when I tried the free module TF-51D that comes for free with DCS world.

 

I will post the file as soon as I get the chance to Fly again later this evening.

 

Thank you to you all for the help

Propeller planes tend to roll because of its propulsion method. Try to restrict to jets for the diagnostics.

It can be weight related with fuel, it can be autopilot mismanagement. There is a master caution warning on your video, but I can't read what it is on the bottom left of left MFD after "ADV -".

[fagulha]

Are you carrying in station 4 the TGP/ATFLIR, or dropped ordenance? you need to trim the airframe.

[Czar66]

3 minutes ago, fagulha said:

Are you carrying in station 4 the TGP/ATFLIR, or dropped ordenance? you need to trim the airframe.

He wasn't. Default loadout was 2x wingtips Aim-9 and center tank.

Is better to look at a track.

[fagulha]

14 minutes ago, Czar66 said:

He wasn't. Default loadout was 2x wingtips Aim-9 and center tank.

Is better to look at a track.

Yes the ideal is to take a look at a track. With so little info there´s no point on guessing here what is the issue.

[Skip365]

I did try it again and I recorded a clip + the track file.

This time there was less rolling then the last video I have posted, but still there. As shown in the briefing there should be no wind and the problem appeared after 5/8 minutes after taking off.

I mabe noticed some rolling at the beginning, and even in the runway the plane was going to the left instead of going straight, but did it for a small amount of time, then it looked fine till started again in the air.

let me know if from the video and the track file can get to the problem.

Thank you and sorry, I am sure that at the and will be I mistake a make  :D.

 

rolling_left.trk

Here it is the video

 

[Skip365]

reviewing the video I have noticed that the RMP of the left engine are 1 point lower then the right one. 84/85.

Could be it the problem?

[Drevin]

I'm a newbie, so I'm just throwing random ideas around:

1. Next time maybe raise the flaps and then do the FCS reset. Also, do an FCS BIT test after the reset. And only afterwards set flaps to half and do the T/O trim. Maybe it makes a difference, maybe it doesn't.

2. Does this happen on any other flight? Just start another mission and see if anything changes.

Also, other thoughts:

1. You should disengage the NWS after your plane reaches 70-80kts on the runway. Otherwise, your steering at that speed will be too sensitive. Also, if I align my plane correctly on a runway, I usually don't need to touch the rudder at all.

2. You can press STG HDG while doing the alignment, to speed up the process to ~90secs. Then put the INS switch to IFA, not NAV.

[Skip365]

1 minute ago, Drevin said:

I'm a newbie, so I'm just throwing random ideas around:

1. Next time maybe raise the flaps and then do the FCS reset. Also, do an FCS BIT test after the reset. And only afterwards set flaps to half and do the T/O trim. Maybe it makes a difference, maybe it doesn't.

2. Does this happen on any other flight? Just start another mission and see if anything changes.

Also, other thoughts:

1. You should disengage the NWS after your plane reaches 70-80kts on the runway. Otherwise, your steering at that speed will be too sensitive. Also, if I align my plane correctly on a runway, I usually don't need to touch the rudder at all.

2. You can press STG HDG while doing the alignment, to speed up the process to ~90secs. Then put the INS switch to IFA, not NAV.

Thank you for taking your time to help me.

It happens also in other missions where the F18 starts directly in the sky so I don't think the problem is the cold start sequence I do.

[Drevin]

Then as long as you don’t have an unbalanced load (and you don’t seem to), it could be your stick. In the game’s controller settings put a stupid deadzone, like 10 or 20, and try another flight. If it solves the problem, then lower it to maybe 4 or 5. Also maybe post a screenshot of your roll axis tune.

[Skip365]

Here I recorder another mission that comes with the hornet training and starts in the sky.

Lesson 10-Case I Carrier Landing

I had to repeat the mission 4 times becouse the first three times it was fine and didn't do the rolling to the left, but the fourth time after flying around the carrier for I while it did the problem.

 

 

Lesson 10-Case I Carrier Landing.miz_11052024_22-51.trk

Edited May 11, 2024 by Skip365

[rob10]

Do you have "Simplified Flight Model" ticked in the OPTIONS/GAMEPLAY menu?  It often does not work well.

[Skip365]

3 minutes ago, rob10 said:

Do you have "Simplified Flight Model" ticked in the OPTIONS/GAMEPLAY menu?  It often does not work well.

No,  it isn't ticked.

[Czar66]

@Skip365

Your joystick is slightly pulling to the left (very tiny bit), I'm almost certain 99%. This can be countered by aileron trim as it is very tiny deviation, or a physical recalibration of the joystick.

On the Nevada mission, the loadout is asymmetric, with an ACMI pod on the right wingtip and a captive Aim-9M on the left making the phenomenon worse. Based on the first video, it seemed something more drastic than this. Perhaps your stick calibration is oscillating while using it. I took control of the plane on that track and it was flying fine as far as I could tell.

Have a look on the Axis Tune Panel under Controls in Options for the roll commands. See if you have an 'In' value of 0 (zero) like in the image bellow.

Other than that, expect to use a lot of aileron trimming in DCS on these jets, as usually their center of mass is not in their lateral center. So even with a perfect centered stick and fly by wire trimming will be needed.

Good news is that this amount of deviation from the center is close to meaningless as DCS simulates asymmetric load and aero efficiency through different speeds, so players will be trimming the ailerons anyways.

Hope it helps.

Edited May 12, 2024 by Czar66

[Skip365]

9 hours ago, Czar66 said:

@Skip365

Your joystick is slightly pulling to the left (very tiny bit), I'm almost certain 99%. This can be countered by aileron trim as it is very tiny deviation, or a physical recalibration of the joystick.

On the Nevada mission, the loadout is asymmetric, with an ACMI pod on the right wingtip and a captive Aim-9M on the left making the phenomenon worse. Based on the first video, it seemed something more drastic than this. Perhaps your stick calibration is oscillating while using it. I took control of the plane on that track and it was flying fine as far as I could tell.

Have a look on the Axis Tune Panel under Controls in Options for the roll commands. See if you have an 'In' value of 0 (zero) like in the image bellow.

Other than that, expect to use a lot of aileron trimming in DCS on these jets, as usually their center of mass is not in their lateral center. So even with a perfect centered stick and fly by wire trimming will be needed.

Good news is that this amount of deviation from the center is close to meaningless as DCS simulates asymmetric load and aero efficiency through different speeds, so players will be trimming the ailerons anyways.

Hope it helps.

 

Thank you for the answer.

this si my setting on that axe:

It seems strange to me that i sjust about the trimming, sometimes also on the ground in the taxi the airplane turns slightly on the left. And in the air even if rarely the plane starts spinning on itself like crazy.

about the calibration I am not sure that the saiteck x52 pro has a software that does it. I can find any calibration on mine.

If anyone knows if it is possible to calibrate it let me know.

Thank you

Edited May 12, 2024 by Skip365