Dogfighting vs MiG-21Bis?

[PhantomHans]

Was just messing around with the F-15C against some AI MiG-21Bis and...

I have to say I expected getting a guns kill on a MiG-21 in an F-15 to be easier, not for the MiG-21 to be apparently faster and more maneuverable. 

 

What's the best way to handle the F-15 in close?  I'm coming from having mostly flown the F-14B and apparently they're very different when going for guns kills.

[Volator]

The AI generally sucks because it overperforms in terms of aerodynamics and thrust. Against a human-flown enemy things are usually much easier in that regard. 

[PhantomHans]

4 hours ago, Volator said:

The AI generally sucks because it overperforms in terms of aerodynamics and thrust. Against a human-flown enemy things are usually much easier in that regard. 

Perhaps that's it then.  I kept getting him on my nose but finding myself unable to get set up for a guns kill and unable to hang with him, eventually he'd slip me and we'd wind up turning fighting for advantage again.

[draconus]

On 5/18/2024 at 8:48 PM, PhantomHans said:

I kept getting him on my nose but finding myself unable to get set up for a guns kill and unable to hang with him, eventually he'd slip me and we'd wind up turning fighting for advantage again.

Seems like you have no problem getting on his six just that he jinks and don't cooperate with your aim. That's fine. IRL training you'd call "Guns guns guns" and you win. In a combat mission you'd use Fox2 and be done with it.

[Pavlin_33]

AI has super-natural powers. I could barely get a guns solution against an AI Su-25T and that thing can't pull more than 4G.

[draconus]

20 hours ago, Pavlin_33 said:

AI has super-natural powers. I could barely get a guns solution against an AI Su-25T and that thing can't pull more than 4G.

No, just tried, quick and easy.

[Pavlin_33]

1 hour ago, draconus said:

No, just tried, quick and easy.

Really?

I had quite a rade in full blower against an AI Frogfot in a two-circle. Sure I had bags on, but still.

[Tango3B]

So, the OP was talking about MiG-21 AI behavior and I agree. In my opinion, the DCS MiG-21 AI is probably the worst offender regarding a vastly overperforming AI flight model. Unless you restrict said AI flight model from jettisoning tanks and/or using AB it will even rate an F-16 at around 520 kts and a sustained 8.5 G. That´s basically borderline insane since the 21 irl is supposed to loose speed like a mofo after its first good turn. Not in DCS AI, though. So yeah...we have to talk about AI being a T-1000 in certain cirumstances...no way denying that...

[The Stick]

Fishbeds are deadly opponents and nothwithstanding virtual expectations, have been known to pull off the impossible.

https://theaviationgeekclub.com/iaf-mig-21s-vs-paf-f-16s-the-dogfight-details-revealed-for-the-first-time/