M02 Break Collision

[DaleHawerchuk]

I'm not sure if I encountered a bug or not but at the end of the formation flying in M02, 2 Arrows collided together during the break. I don't think it was caused by me as if I understood correctly, Ford & Matrix are supposed to continue straight away and climb, which is what I was doing. Did anybody else experienced this? No mods installed except Vaicom but it is only installed, I am not using it for now. I only tried it once for now.

Anyway, not posting this to bring down the campaign, just to help Badger out. M01 went smoothly. I'm very much looking forward to finish the rest of the campaign. I learned flying the Hornet with Badger's campaigns.

https://imgur.com/a/kiF6dRo

[Badger633]

Hi @DaleHawerchuk

As long as you exited the break straight ahead to the left of red1 you wouldn’t  have caused this. Not had this before, and it’s not been highlighted by the testers.
That should never happen anyway as the AI should avoid each other, but we are dealing with the AI here. 
Thanks for the pics, looks  like the left red arrow has not entered the break correctly?
If you get a chance can you run it again and if it happens again send me the track? that would really help. Also let me know if it doesn’t happen again. 
Glad you have enjoyed the campaigns so far and thanks for the heads up,  they really help me plug any issues. 

Edited May 22, 2024 by Badger633

[DaleHawerchuk]

Thanks for the feedback. And yes I know DCS AI can be janky I edit as well, not blaming you. 

So you are saying I should stay on Arrow 1's left side? like in close formation going up? This part confused me as I wasn't sure if I needed to stay with him (going up) or straight ahead (level). 

I went slightly up and not quite as close to Arrow 1 the 1st time, maybe that was the problem. I'll try again tomorrow and send you the track if it happens again. 

[Badger633]

@DaleHawerchuk To be honest don’t think it is you.
The instruction Ford gives, if I remember, is to break climbing to the left of Red 1, Matrix will follow you. You don’t need to be really close to Red 1 just between him and the Red to his left. 
Thanks. 
 

Edit: Checked it through and Reds did not crash this end. Fly it again to see if it was just a one off AI glitch. 

Edited May 25, 2024 by Badger633

[DaleHawerchuk]

I finally had a second shot at it, no problem this time, so seems like it was just the AI that went crazy the first time.

[Badger633]

Hi @DaleHawerchuk

Yes its a strange one. Who said AI is going to take over the world.

Enjoy the campaign. 

[PawlaczGMD]

Also just happened to me. Reds crashed on the first turn after phoenix formation. I got an instant fail for "crashing into them". Debrief showed that they crashed.

[Badger633]

Hi @PawlaczGMD

 Can you give it a second try in case it was a strange glich and not a new AI bug. If you get it again can you send me the track of the mission. Where were you when this happened exactly not saying this was the case but did your position have an impact on their ability to move? 
Thanks

Edited July 29, 2024 by Badger633

[PawlaczGMD]

55 minutes ago, Badger633 said:

Hi @PawlaczGMD

 Can you give it a second try in case it was a strange glich and not a new AI bug. If you get it again can you send me the track of the mission. Where were you when this happened exactly not saying this was the case but did your position have an impact on their ability to move? 
Thanks

 

I saved the track but it's too big to send.

Edit: https://zippyshare.day/UD95EHZ8JTq8Tzl/file

I was flying a decent turn behind the guy to the left of center, as expected. It looked like the entire left half of the AI formation just spazzed out and went all over the place. Seemed like more of an AI bug than me influencing them. The only thing is that I could have been too close to them, but I don't think AI would try to avoid that.

Edited July 29, 2024 by PawlaczGMD

[Badger633]

@PawlaczGMD Has this happened a second time? Thanks for the track.

 

Edited July 29, 2024 by Badger633

[Badger633]

@PawlaczGMD Just run it this end. EDs AI do get a bit erratic at that particular turn in phoenix because they are laterally closer than in arrow but they did not crash. Can you run again it should be ok then. Thanks.

[Razor18]

Hay Badger,

they ram me when turning in arrow too. Watch the end of the attached TacView file.

Tacview-20240818-171536-DCS-SYRIA M2 IT IS TAKEN AS RED.zip.acmi

[Badger633]

Hi @Razor18

Thanks for the track. Yeah it shouldn't happen like that, the red arrow on the left totally lost the plot. I know this is DCS AI but when the mission was created all the aircraft kept formation very well. I had worked long and hard to achieve it. I have seen them getting more and more erratic over the last six months of DCS updates. Will have to let ED know. Have you tried more than once as it doesn't happen every time, it's never happened to me. I will fly it through again. 

EDIT: Just ran it through and it did not happen this end? All reds stayed in formation, allowing for the the DCS AI inaccuracies. As I said try a second time and see if you get the same problem.

 

Edited August 18, 2024 by Badger633

[Razor18]

I will too fly again, and let you know. And I guess if you stay back a little more, it can not happen. Judt doesnt look that cool .

[Badger633]

@Razor18 agreed but the DCS AI is the only one we got to work with. 

[eFirehawk]

Hi there,

Same issue happened to me. On the first try, one of the Reds rammed me from the left. Tried again, then Reds L2 and L3 collided with each other. Same thing on the 3rd attempt. Maybe with more attempts it would work but I'll skip this mission for now and might come back to it on a later date (at this point saved games/checkpoints would be wonderful to have. Lookin'at you ED). I've attached 3 Tacview files just to show what happened. Not sure if they'll be of any use but they're here anyhow.

I understand completely we have to make it work within DCS' AI limitations here. I hope at some point ED gives it some attention.

Other than that, loving the campaign's start so far Badger! Thanks

Tacview-20241229-235503-DCS-SYRIA M2 IT IS TAKEN AS RED.zip.acmi Tacview-20241229-231820-DCS-SYRIA M2 IT IS TAKEN AS RED.zip.acmi Tacview-20241229-205309-DCS-SYRIA M2 IT IS TAKEN AS RED.zip.acmi

[Badger633]

Thanks for the Tacview files @eFirehawk have you got a track. 
When the mission was first put together it worked fine but over various AI updates have noticed their ability to keep in formation has got worse and worse. 
I will look to see if there is any more I can do by easing the turns and also report it to ED. 
Also wondering if processor speed has anything to do with it. What cpu do you have?

Thanks, so frustrating when previously it worked fine.