Hook for carrying loads

[petsild]

Hi,

In the Kiowa feature description, a hook is possible for carrying loads up to 2,000lb.

Is this option included or will it be added later, thank you. Pet

[Ramsay]

3 hours ago, petsild said:

In the Kiowa feature description, a hook is possible for carrying loads up to 2,000lb.

Do you have a link to that description, as it sounds incorrect - AFAIK (TM 1-1520-248-10, 2001) the structural limit of the hook is 1300lb

3 hours ago, petsild said:

Is this option included or will it be added later

Not AFAIK - the hook was rarely used i.e. none of the SME's had used it and the "hook release button" was rewired to fire the M3P's IZLID laser pointer (perhaps 2009?).

Perhaps it's a loadout option when configuring a unarmed Fort Rucker OH-58D training variant ?

Unfortunately no one asked about sling loads in Polychop's Kiowa AMA but I imagine it's along way down the feature list compared to the data link or getting an effective AI CPG.

Edited May 27, 2024 by Ramsay

[Yurgon]

As much as I love sling loading, the KW is kind of the last helicopter that I'm interested in doing it in. Especially with the Chinook not too far away now. Be neat if it was implemented but certainly not a loss if it never is.

[petsild]

7 hours ago, Ramsay said:

Do you have a link to that description, as it sounds incorrect - AFAIK (TM 1-1520-248-10, 2001) the structural limit of the hook is 1300lb

Not AFAIK - the hook was rarely used i.e. none of the SME's had used it and the "hook release button" was rewired to fire the M3P's IZLID laser pointer (perhaps 2009?).

Perhaps it's a loadout option when configuring a unarmed Fort Rucker OH-58D training variant ?

Unfortunately no one asked about sling loads in Polychop's Kiowa AMA but I imagine it's along way down the feature list compared to the data link or getting an effective AI CPG.

 

It's written Kiowa helicopter missions and roles:

https://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/oh-58d-kiowa-warrior/?cf-view

I like cargo hauling missions with the UH-1 and having another little carrier was cool.

[Coota0]

15 hours ago, petsild said:

It's written Kiowa helicopter missions and roles:

https://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/oh-58d-kiowa-warrior/?cf-view

I like cargo hauling missions with the UH-1 and having another little carrier was cool.

That website is incorrect. The max gross weight of the aircraft is only 5200 lbs. a 2000 lbs sling load would not happen. There is not button in a KW (post 1980s) to release a sling load. I believe the article is confusing the OH-58A/C and the OH-58D. The same article you site also says that a KW can carry two litters, a KW is in not way capable of doing that either. It is a poorly researched article. The fact that speeds and weights alternate between imperial and metric indicates that this article was merely copied from multiple resources with little or no actual research done to ensure it was correct.

[cgrxman]

In the very early days of the KW (1992ish), we did have the hook.  It was part of the larger MPLH (Multi-Purpose Light Helicopter Package).  When the aircraft were delivered I remember they did ship with them.  It attached to the bottom of the aircraft with quick-release pins.  I believe the release was a manually operated pull handle.  I never flew with one because I don't think we had tasks developed for our Aircrew Training Manual.  The litters were also envisioned to mount on the side of the aircraft in similar fashion.  I never saw the litters or plank seats. 

Maybe off topic (sorry), but couple of other cool KW development footnotes...

- The Prime Chance AH-58D could mount guns on both sides with ammo cans of 800 rounds.  The right side ammo can blocked the refuel port, so it was not implemented in the production KW. 

-The larger can developed adverse airflow conditions over the horizontal stabilizer and once caused the left side stab to break off at the weaker folding hinges we had on the PC birds.  Result: much beefier hinges on the KW and a smaller can with better aerodynamic profile (hence 500 rounds).

- We often flew the AH-58D at 5500 lbs.  IIRC, this was the initial design requirement for the KW, but during testing, autorotational performance was deemed unsafe above 5200 lbs.  Perhaps they were planning on using the extra 300 lbs as useful load during the MPLH development?

- We only had 6 waypoints available in the first CDS software.  That changed pretty quickly though.

I really enjoyed my time in the 58D.  It remains my favorite aircraft of the many types I flew across 20 years, 2 military services, and the airlines.  I'm so pumped about getting back in the KW!  Thanks, POLYCHOP.

Edited May 29, 2024 by cgrxman

[crispy12]

Thanks Polychop, not Razbam

[Kinkkujuustovoileipä]

Wow. Razbam? Disappointed 

[dahui]

On 5/27/2024 at 3:45 PM, Ramsay said:

Do you have a link to that description, as it sounds incorrect - AFAIK (TM 1-1520-248-10, 2001) the structural limit of the hook is 1300lb

Not AFAIK - the hook was rarely used i.e. none of the SME's had used it and the "hook release button" was rewired to fire the M3P's IZLID laser pointer (perhaps 2009?).

Perhaps it's a loadout option when configuring a unarmed Fort Rucker OH-58D training variant ?

Unfortunately no one asked about sling loads in Polychop's Kiowa AMA but I imagine it's along way down the feature list compared to the data link or getting an effective AI CPG.

 

where can i find that TM? I tried to goolge it, but without luck

[cgrxman]

ooops, talk about a party foul.  Corrected. 

[petsild]

On 5/28/2024 at 5:39 PM, cgrxman said:

In the very early days of the KW (1992ish), we did have the hook.  It was part of the larger MPLH (Multi-Purpose Light Helicopter Package).  When the aircraft were delivered I remember they did ship with them.  It attached to the bottom of the aircraft with quick-release pins.  I believe the release was a manually operated pull handle.  I never flew with one because I don't think we had tasks developed for our Aircrew Training Manual.  The litters were also envisioned to mount on the side of the aircraft in similar fashion.  I never saw the litters or plank seats. 

Maybe off topic (sorry), but couple of other cool KW development footnotes...

- The Prime Chance AH-58D could mount guns on both sides with ammo cans of 800 rounds.  The right side ammo can blocked the refuel port, so it was not implemented in the production KW. 

-The larger can developed adverse airflow conditions over the horizontal stabilizer and once caused the left side stab to break off at the weaker folding hinges we had on the PC birds.  Result: much beefier hinges on the KW and a smaller can with better aerodynamic profile (hence 500 rounds).

- We often flew the AH-58D at 5500 lbs.  IIRC, this was the initial design requirement for the KW, but during testing, autorotational performance was deemed unsafe above 5200 lbs.  Perhaps they were planning on using the extra 300 lbs as useful load during the MPLH development?

- We only had 6 waypoints available in the first CDS software.  That changed pretty quickly though.

I really enjoyed my time in the 58D.  It remains my favorite aircraft of the many types I flew across 20 years, 2 military services, and the airlines.  I'm so pumped about getting back in the KW!  Thanks, POLYCHOP.

 

You have written so much important information, thank you very much.

If I understand correctly, the Kiowa with the help of a fast external set had the ability to tow cargo.

Developers in theory, adding such an option shouldn't be difficult?

[dahui]

Found it

see Attachment

 

[aviation] - [manuals] - TM 1-1520-248-10 - Technical manual Operator`s manual for army OH-58D (1).pdf