New to the Hog ..some questions

[pauldy]

I'm just transitioning to the A-10. After being used to fast movers i know this flying gatling gun is different..

 

-At what airspeeds the A-10 usually flies? especially when on ground attack missions.

 

-How do Hog drivers defend themselves against air defenses like SAMs & AAAs?

Back in the Hornet (c/o Jane's F-18 ) i usually jink with speed & acceleration. I believe that's not the case in the A-10 since it's a lot slower

 

-Does the A-10 approach like an airliner?

I mean nose low about 0-2 degrees.. back in the F-15, i focus on the AoA and usually land at higer nose attitudes.

 

My current landing technique is to approach at 0-2 degrees then flare passing 25 feet above the runway with nose attitude at 5 degrees. I wonder if i'm doing the correct thing.

 

 

 

a more of program stuff:

How do i fix these? The sidewinder's rear is missing and it's ignition is way off..

 

Also it seems that the Walmis F-15 skins were reduced when i installed the simmod A-10. I followed the install order: F-15->Walmis Weapons->A-10->A-10+F-15+weapons compatibility pack. How do i fix this?

 

Thanks for any help~

[littlejohn1959]

http://www.flankertraining.com

lots of great info there .

cheers .

[Moa]

I'm just transitioning to the A-10. After being used to fast movers i know this flying gatling gun is different..

 

-At what airspeeds the A-10 usually flies? especially when on ground attack missions.

 

-How do Hog drivers defend themselves against air defenses like SAMs & AAAs?

Back in the Hornet (c/o Jane's F-18 ) i usually jink with speed & acceleration. I believe that's not the case in the A-10 since it's a lot slower

 

-Does the A-10 approach like an airliner?

I mean nose low about 0-2 degrees.. back in the F-15, i focus on the AoA and usually land at higer nose attitudes.

 

My current landing technique is to approach at 0-2 degrees then flare passing 25 feet above the runway with nose attitude at 5 degrees. I wonder if i'm doing the correct thing.

 

 

 

a more of program stuff:

How do i fix these? The sidewinder's rear is missing and it's ignition is way off..

 

Also it seems that the Walmis F-15 skins were reduced when i installed the simmod A-10. I followed the install order: F-15->Walmis Weapons->A-10->A-10+F-15+weapons compatibility pack. How do i fix this?

 

Thanks for any help~

 

Q: -At what airspeeds the A-10 usually flies? especially when on ground attack missions.

 

A: It flies around 300 kts when fully loaded. Since the A-10 has a turbofan there is no reason (within the game) not to run it continuously at 100%.

 

Q: -How do Hog drivers defend themselves against air defenses like SAMs & AAAs?

Back in the Hornet (c/o Jane's F-18 ) i usually jink with speed & acceleration. I believe that's not the case in the A-10 since it's a lot slower

 

A: Stay low and use the terrain. A shallow gully is all the cover you need if you are low. Unlike chaff and flare your supply of terrain is inexhaustable. If you are attacking an IR SAM drop pre-emptive flares before they launch. Remember that SAMs will fly to 'where you will be' not 'where you are', so if you descend slightly early enough the SAMs will impact the ground before you do. Try and avoid approaching air defences over flat terrain or sea - instead approach from hills if you can. Slow speed gives you time to line up your shots. Use longer-ranged AGM-65D (rather than K) on short ranged IR and AAA air defences. Then come in under 30 feet altitude and drop cluster bombs on tracking radars (they can't track you in the ground clutter under 30 feet). When you are close to a radar guided SAM they can't hit you (even at slightly higher altitudes). Once the tracking radars are down an entire S-300 battery are good for target practice.

 

Whatever you do: Don't hit the ground, and don't run out of fuel!

 

Q: -Does the A-10 approach like an airliner?

I mean nose low about 0-2 degrees.. back in the F-15, i focus on the AoA and usually land at higer nose attitudes.

 

My current landing technique is to approach at 0-2 degrees then flare passing 25 feet above the runway with nose attitude at 5 degrees. I wonder if i'm doing the correct thing.

 

A: The key to any landing is a good approach. Line up with the runway with an altitude of around 1000 feet and half-flaps (press F). I use a 3 degree descent and an approach speed of around 120 kts dropping to 105 just above the runway threshold (that's for the A-10, for the F-15 your speeds would be around 150 and 120 kts respectively). Your nose should be slightly above the horizon, not below it. This keeps you nice and slow. The rule for landing is:

* pitch controls approach speed

* throttle controls touchdown point (that is, descent rate).

 

The 3 degree descent is easy do do as you do the following:

* Fly level at 1000 feet and 150 kts. Flaps (F) and landing gear (G) out.

* Line up with the runway. The runway is lined up when it is a vertical strip in your HUD (not diagonal).

* Once you're lined up with the runway press SHIFT+F to extend your flaps fully.

* Press \ F6 F3 to ask tower for landing permission. It'll let you know if

someone else has permission to land instead (they may be on approach ahead of you)

* Press CTRL+L so other aircraft can see your navigation lights.

* Once the runway is 3 degrees below the horizon in your HUD you reduce throttle to descend.

* Keep making small throttle adjustments to keep your flight path marker on the close end of the runway.

* Keep an eye on airspeed so you don't get too slow or too fast. You must control your airspeed.

* Once you cross the runway threshold throttle back and raise your nose slightly until the flight path marker is on the far end of the runway.

* Hold the flight path marker there until you touch down.

* Once you are down clear the runway as soon as you can so other aircraft can land.

* Taxi to your parking spot and do engine shutdown, lights off, canopy open.

 

You shouldn't need speed brakes during the descent. Use them *before* you start your approach to get your speed under control then close them.

 

Also practice landing in cross-winds and with one engine. Often you'll have end up with a single working engine if you've been engaging AAA (hint, use the rudder to compensate). You should also be calculating fuel usage in flight (not just how much is left, how much you'll need for the remainder of your journey). If you get a fuel leak from AAA you'll need to work out whether you'll get home or need to find a straight bit of road to land. A successful mission is bringing yourself and your aircraft back, anything else is a failure. It doesn't matter how many SAMs you kill if you don't bring your bird home.

 

Another hint: when using the cannon don't 'spray n pray'. Get close (0.3 - 0.5 nm) to your target and fire an aimed burst instead. Your rounds are a lot more accurate that way. Don't get too close and always consider how you'll exit the target before you start your (shallow) gunshot dive.

 

Get the Simmod A-10 package and install with ModMan. Simmod is outstanding and really improves the experience with the aircraft (many thanks Simmod crew).

 

Hope this helps and enjoy the Hog. It is a different world when everyone above and below is shooting at you.

Edited May 11, 2009 by Moa

[littlejohn1959]

good awnsers moa mate .

you just taught me lots . :thumbup::thumbup:

cheers mate .

[Moa]

You're very welcome littlejohn1959.

 

Thanks for posting the flankertraining link, that is also a great site.

[pauldy]

Thank your very much for the advice Moa~ I'll keep those points in mind :)

 

Although i already installed the Simmod A-10 & the proper compatibiliy packs.

 

Now i'm asking how to fix the mess it did to the Walmis F-15 & 3D weapons as pictured in my very 1st post ;)

[Case]

Q: -How do Hog drivers defend themselves against air defenses like SAMs & AAAs?A: Stay low and use the terrain.

I beg to differ. I think it is better to stay above SHORAD and AAA and be able to spot launches and dive accordingly than to stay low and give you no room to manouver without losing speed and getting in an even bigger mess...

 

Then come in under 30 feet altitude and drop cluster bombs on tracking radars (they can't track you in the ground clutter under 30 feet). Once the tracking radars are down an entire S-300 battery are good for target practice.

This is more a bug than a realistic feature, especially since it is set at 10m exactly... It is even more unrealistic to engage a S300 site in an A-10. I'd say killing Osa's and Tor's with A-10's is already pushing the limits of reality.

 

The challenge in flying A2G is not knowing what you are up against. Take a nice column of vehicles with one or two SHORADs... When you find the column you don't know which are the guys that'll shoot you. So you have to ID these first before you can use the gun on the soft targets. Killing trucks with Mavericks is just a waste. So either use the TV to ID the unit or, if you really like a challenge, spiral in slowly and ID the SHORAD the moment it fires at you.

[GGTharos]

Killing Osa's with an A-10 is feasible. A TOR ... that's a bit of a different story.

 

In any case, a real CBU has to be dropped from several thousand feet of altitude typically so that the cannister can open and spread the munitions. If you're doing 30' runs with cluster bombs in LO (like everyone, I suppose) you'll pay for it in DCS: Hog since the weapon won't work that way ;)

[Dusty Rhodes]

Also of note on landings, not to burst anyone's bubble, but approach is important but the landing is scripted in LOMAC. If you fly a decent approach and not do something whacked, you will land with three on the ground every time because of the scripting of the landing. Now I wouldn't try that in DCS A-10 when it comes out though. You will actually have to learn how to land the thing from approach to final shut down. :D

[Moa]

In the high threat (Warsaw Pact vs Nato) scenario Hogs (and indeed almost all tactical aircraft) would routinely fly at 100 feet. They might pop-up in the target area. The USAF realised it was suicide to fly any higher against an IADS. That's the reason for moving the B-52 from high bombing to low-level peneratration, and the raison d'etre for the B1. SHORAD and AAA are dangerous so you keep an eye out for them (and never overfly them), but they're less dangerous than a SA-10 at 50 km.

 

To develop the reflexes to be effective at low level you must practice down there constantly, so I do my warting at low-level exclusively. Plus you stay off enemy fighter radar for much longer at low level (and fighters are far more dangerous than any SAM).

 

In fact, the fact that Su-25 bomb sights are designed to be used in a dive from medium level is a very major flaw in my opinion. Those Frogs would not last long against a competent opponent (but do well against tribesmen), even the realtively poorly armed Georgians recently did far more damage than they ought to to their opposing Frogfoot squadrons (ironic, since most Frogfoots were manufacturered near Tblisi).

 

In Desert Storm the Hogs could fly higher, but that was because there were several carrier air, F-16, F-117, and F-15 wings doing SEAD for them. In most LockOn missions no one cares about the attack aircraft enough to set this up for them. Whether a Hog can deal with Osas or Tors is moot in real life, since thats what Wild Weasel crews do (just as Hogs on Flankers is moot, since thats a job for the knuckleheads [fighter jocks]). In not-real-life the hogs gotta deal with them, and they can if they stay low when near enemy air defences.

 

Yes, you must be higher to use cluster bombs. The reason I use cluster bombs down there is because I can't get ballute retarded bombs. Otherwise I'd be using those. There is a major bug in LockOn that you can drop a Mk-84 below 2000 feet without fragging yourself. What's with that?

 

Thanks for pointing out the landing is scripted. Please note the landing technique I mentioned is correct (pitch controls airspeed, throttle controls descent rate, and airspeed should be at a particular value [unless you're an F15 with one wing :)]). Should work in DCS provided you are wings-level at touchdown.

[159th_Viper]

.....A TOR ... that's a bit of a different story.....

 

I Sincerely Hope that it is going to be a bit more difficult in DCS:A-10.....As things stand atm in LockOn the Tor is the proverbial Sitting Duck: Two run-ins and then a Simple Mop-Up with the cannon. A real pity.... :huh:

[GGTharos]

It all has to do with AI 'smarts' at this point. We'll see how it goes. I figure a little lessened visibility, a silent, datalinked radar and you might get quite a 'pop up' at some point ;D

[pauldy]

 

There is a major bug in LockOn that you can drop a Mk-84 below 2000 feet without fragging yourself. What's with that?

 

 

i noticed that too. Back in F-18 there's that frag bar on the bomb fall line that i must take not of when dropping stuff or else i'll end up getting damage by my own bombs.

 

and here i am having a reflex of suddenly pitching up away whenever i drop an Mk-82 or Mk-84.. well it's for the better i guess

Edited May 12, 2009 by pauldy

[Udat]

Learn what the shapes of Strelas, Tunguskas and Shilkas looks like compared to tanks/APCs/trucks/artillery/etc trough your AGM-65 crosshairs. Even more; learn to be extremely paranoid, and that your biggest nemesis will probably be igla-armed soldiers. Very hard to spot, even with the AGM-65D seekers, and you need visual of the launch to even know it's coming. And if you do, you normally only have 2-3 seconds to flare and evade. Do like case said, learn to ID your targets, and ALWAYS scan around for IR launches. Oh, and learn to study the briefing map before clicking fly, checking headings and distances between target zones and relative to waypoints.

[104th_Crunch]

Also, very noteworthy when it comes to the Hog and A2G

Hog Basics: RAF Bentwaters Tactics Guide, 1982

Mavericks, Rockets, and the Gun

Edited May 13, 2009 by Crunch

[topol-m]

Pretty useful guides, Crunch.

[pauldy]

Thanks for the links Crunch~ I never knew these were at simHQ

 

oh yah~ I think i'm already having fun with mud moving~ :)

 

but it's still a long way to go for me~

Edited May 13, 2009 by pauldy

[HitchHikingFlatlander]

You and me both, I knew SimHQ had a lot of articles but theres lots of treasure to be found! Thanks for the links Crunch.

[pauldy]

Sorry for resurrecting this topic but can someone tell me what is the flare height for the a-10?

 

if i just rely on threshold crosses, my flare heights would be quite in consistent.

 

I'm also thinking 120 knots wouldn't be applicable to all weight configs

 

i tried approaching @ 120 knots on a lightly loaded hog, i was like floating longer than it should.

 

And i'm confused.. the tutorial in game says 150-160 knots of approach speed.

[Moa]

Sorry for resurrecting this topic but can someone tell me what is the flare height for the a-10?

 

if i just rely on threshold crosses, my flare heights would be quite in consistent.

 

I'm also thinking 120 knots wouldn't be applicable to all weight configs

 

i tried approaching @ 120 knots on a lightly loaded hog, i was like floating longer than it should.

 

And i'm confused.. the tutorial in game says 150-160 knots of approach speed.

 

The 150-160 is at the start of finals (you should be at around 1000 feet altitude in a 3-5 degree nose-high descent). Once you're lined up with the runway make sure you land with full flaps (SHIFT + F) rather than half-flaps.

 

You can use the split airbrakes as well but if you have:

* full flaps

* gear, and

* idle throttle

then you should find you don't need them.

 

I generally cross the threshold around 100-110 kts and then usually get the stall warning (at 95 kts) just as I flare. This means I don't float for long.

 

It's great to hear you are practicing your landings. Many virtual pilots seem great at killing each other but a bit soft on basic airmanship like landings. Don't forget to also learn and practice single-engine, flameout, and two-engine no-hydraulics landings as well (I often find I have to do these on the 169 server after getting sloppy and getting pinged by the Avengers there).

[joey45]

should really pratice run in and brakes..

[topol-m]

A question guys: how many mavericks can be guided at different targets at the same time, in reality and in the game if there is any difference? I launched 3 missiles at 3 targets (2 of them moving) and destroyed all the 3. Is this realistic?

[Case]

Since Mavericks are fire-and-forget you can fire as many as you have...

[topol-m]

Since Mavericks are fire-and-forget you can fire as many as you have...

 

Thanks. I thought one of the maverick versions used by the A-10 is fire and forget and the other not. My mistake.

[GGTharos]

There is one type that is not fire and forget but you cannot use it: The AGM-65E. It is laser guided.