Trying to get optimal graphic settings for SP and MP?

[Gil80]

Hi everyone,

I'm trying to get optimal settings for Single Player and Multiplayer mode in DCS but I'm unsure if I have set things in an optimal way, and I'd appreciate your advice based on my PC hardware and graphic settings.

The hardware is:

1. CPU: Intel Gen11 Core i9
2. GPU: Asus TUF 4070 Ti Super (16GB) OC
3. RAM: 64GB DDR4 3600MHz
4. Oculus Quest 3 using Link cable with OpenXR

These are my graphic setting:

Quest Device

 

Oculus Tray Tool:

 

DCS Settings:

Nvidia Control Panel:

[The_Nephilim]

set "Textures" to medium as they really make VRam go out of control.. and try too use Quadviews..

[Gil80]

17 hours ago, The_Nephilim said:

set "Textures" to medium as they really make VRam go out of control.. and try too use Quadviews..

Even with 16GB of Vram?

[The_Nephilim]

well it used to be a memory leak but you can try it out and see if it eats all your 16gb memory. I seen it eat all 12gb of mine test it out.

[Qcumber]

18 hours ago, The_Nephilim said:

set "Textures" to medium as they really make VRam go out of control.. and try too use Quadviews..

I am seeing much better VRAM control since the last update. It used to reach my 12Gb limit very often. Now I often run at about 8-9Gb. 

[The_Nephilim]

1 hour ago, Qcumber said:

I am seeing much better VRAM control since the last update. It used to reach my 12Gb limit very often. Now I often run at about 8-9Gb. 

even with textures set to high? it used to have a memory leak when set Textures to high, is this not the case anymore?

 

well I just tested it real quick and when I had Textures on High it allocated right up to my vram limit and went over probally only for a millisecond here is a screenshot on MSI Afterburner look for GPU Memory:

 

 

 

 

 

 

and when I put the Textures to Medium it stayed under and a little over at 1 point at max setting. it used to go way over maybe the leak is fix as this is just allocated memory and not in use I guess it has been fixed a bit as wehen I used to set it on medium it would drop the total allocation by 2-3gbs VRam.. guess that is not the case anymore.. I am going to try and run textures on High nect mission I fly and see what happens over and hour or so in the MP Mission.. here is the screenshot of the Textures on med:

 

 

 

 

Edited November 4, 2024 by The_Nephilim

[Qcumber]

1 hour ago, The_Nephilim said:

even with textures set to high? it used to have a memory leak when set Textures to high, is this not the case anymore?

 

well I just tested it real quick and when I had Textures on High it allocated right up to my vram limit and went over probally only for a millisecond here is a screenshot on MSI Afterburner look for GPU Memory:

 

 

 

 

 

 

and when I put the Textures to Medium it stayed under and a little over at 1 point at max setting. it used to go way over maybe the leak is fix as this is just allocated memory and not in use I guess it has been fixed a bit as wehen I used to set it on medium it would drop the total allocation by 2-3gbs VRam.. guess that is not the case anymore.. I am going to try and run textures on High nect mission I fly and see what happens over and hour or so in the MP Mission.. here is the screenshot of the Textures on med:

 

 

 

 

 

Yes. Texture set to high. I suspect this depends on the module, map and assets. However, comparing the situations a fly in the VRAM use doesn't max out all the time. I need to test it more. I'll try to post screen shot of MSI afterburner monitor in different situations. 

 

Edited November 4, 2024 by Qcumber

[slughead]

I think your settings are about right for your hardware. If you want to get more, consider foveated rendering (periphery of vision rendered with lower resolution), which is a bit of a downer for the Quest 3 with its edge-to-edge clarity or drop your render resolution to 1.1 or 1.0. I know you don't want to do that, but it's really the only way to get more performance by trading visual quality for frame time.

Your only other option is to upgrade to a 4090 and a newer-gen CPU. Of course, you need a new motherboard to go with that and maybe new RAM, too.

On the other hand, what motherboard are you running? Does it support PCIe 4.0, and if so, have you set it to that? If not, you're not getting the full memory bandwidth/speed that a 40 series video card can do. Also, is your memory speed set to XMP in the bios? Not setting to XMP can make a big difference.

I would also enable ASW. It will only drop into it when needed. Without it, the whole image will be a judder fest when your machine can't keep up with the frame time. Yes, you will see some ghosting of fast-moving aircraft; it's a trade-off.

[Gil80]

19 hours ago, slughead said:

I think your settings are about right for your hardware. If you want to get more, consider foveated rendering (periphery of vision rendered with lower resolution), which is a bit of a downer for the Quest 3 with its edge-to-edge clarity or drop your render resolution to 1.1 or 1.0. I know you don't want to do that, but it's really the only way to get more performance by trading visual quality for frame time.

Your only other option is to upgrade to a 4090 and a newer-gen CPU. Of course, you need a new motherboard to go with that and maybe new RAM, too.

On the other hand, what motherboard are you running? Does it support PCIe 4.0, and if so, have you set it to that? If not, you're not getting the full memory bandwidth/speed that a 40 series video card can do. Also, is your memory speed set to XMP in the bios? Not setting to XMP can make a big difference.

I would also enable ASW. It will only drop into it when needed. Without it, the whole image will be a judder fest when your machine can't keep up with the frame time. Yes, you will see some ghosting of fast-moving aircraft; it's a trade-off.

Thank you for your detailed response.

I don't want to drop the render resolution below what I currently have because it will render to cockpit unreadable.

I did try QuadView and I hate it. I still use it, but I set it to a point where I can barely feel it, as I tend to look down on the AMPCD in F18 without moving my head down.

 

My motherboard is Gigabyte Z590I AORUS ULTRA. It supports PCIe 4.0 and I have Resizable BAR enabled.

Based on GPU-Z:  in my BIOS I have the option for Auto, X8 X8, or X8 X4 X4. It is currently set to X8 X8.

RAM is set to X.M.P in BIOS.

 

All the youtube videos I've seen about setting up Quest 3 with DCS show to use OpenXR's Turbo Mode which breaks AWS, hence my settings are as they are at the moment. I'm really thought the 16GB Vram of the 4070Ti Super will able to keep up at 72fps with the Quest 3  

 

 

[slughead]

Hmm. I don’t think turbo mode completely breaks AWS. Have you tried with it on? I have it on and it switches into AWS when necessary.

[Qcumber]

27 minutes ago, slughead said:

Hmm. I don’t think turbo mode completely breaks AWS. Have you tried with it on? I have it on and it switches into AWS when necessary.

ASW works fine with turbo for me too. It wasn't always that way but for the last few months/updates it works very well. 

32 minutes ago, Gil80 said:

I'm really thought the 16GB Vram of the 4070Ti Super will able to keep up at 72fps with the Quest 3

The harsh reality is you can't run a Q3 with your GPU without some compromise. The main reason I switched to the QP is for the eye tracking so I could make best use of QVFR. It is annoying that Meta have not released another headset with eye tracking. 

[Gil80]

On 11/6/2024 at 7:48 PM, Qcumber said:

The harsh reality is you can't run a Q3 with your GPU without some compromise. The main reason I switched to the QP is for the eye tracking so I could make best use of QVFR. It is annoying that Meta have not released another headset with eye tracking. 

What headset and GPU are you running?

I upgraded from RTX 3070, which has 8GB Vram, to the 4070Ti Super 16GB Vram... I was expecting a big boost in performance for the Q3, but that wasn't the case. Also upgrading from 32GB RAM to 64GB didn't do much.

Quite disappointed that the 4090 is out of reach.

[The_Nephilim]

20 minutes ago, Gil80 said:

What headset and GPU are you running?

I upgraded from RTX 3070, which has 8GB Vram, to the 4070Ti Super 16GB Vram... I was expecting a big boost in performance for the Q3, but that wasn't the case. Also upgrading from 32GB RAM to 64GB didn't do much.

Quite disappointed that the 4090 is out of reach.

what |Frame Time are you getting for your GPU?? maybe your UEFI Settings are misconfigured.. do you use quadviews?

Edited November 7, 2024 by The_Nephilim

[kksnowbear]

On 11/6/2024 at 12:15 PM, Gil80 said:

My motherboard is Gigabyte Z590I AORUS ULTRA. It supports PCIe 4.0 and I have Resizable BAR enabled.

Based on GPU-Z:  in my BIOS I have the option for Auto, X8 X8, or X8 X4 X4. It is currently set to X8 X8.

Why do you have it set for x8x8?  Do you have some sort of expansion card in the second PCIe slot?  If you set it x8x8, it's bifurcating the lanes, half each to the two PCIe slots (check the manual).  If you don't have another card there, you need to set the BIOS for Auto, so it will go to x16 (based on your GPU).

If you do have another card in the other PCIe slot then you either have to move the other card or live with the x8 lanes you're getting now.  BTW I'm not sure whether a 4070 TI Super can saturate those 8 lanes, but it seems possible TBH.  I'd have to look into it more to know.

Edited November 8, 2024 by kksnowbear

[slughead]

That should get him a huge uplift and his rig will be a rocking beast!

[LucShep]

@Gil80 Please try "Terrain Textures" at LOW and "Terrain Shadows" at OFF.  That will imediately aleviate things a bit.

DCS has three major problems (among others, I presume) for a long time now, still to be addressed:

1) The clouds system, how they're rendered - comparing Clouds setting "LOW" and "ULTRA", imediately one notices a considerable performance difference.
Maybe also try Clouds at "LOW" see if it helps?  Anything above "Standard" is a no-no for VR. (and I don't care if those contradicting have a NASA system, it shouldn't be like that)
One of the main reasons for so many disgruntled VR users when version 2.7 came out (when the new clouds were introduced), still to be addressed.

2) The shadows for terrain objects are also a problem because, while it "beautifies" the image at distance, it does put a heavy toll on the hardware - even if set at "Flat".
Shadows are still intensive tasks in any game, and in DCS with them at such long distances, for a gazillion of trees, bushes and etc, it can be a problem.  
If you're one of those that "can not live without Terrain Shadows!" then all I can suggest is the Shadows mod in my signature (it may or not help, do not hope for a miracle).

3) The exaggerated usage of high res formats in textures.
@The_Nephilim is right in that, reducing textures settings does help in VR, even if you have 16GB VRAM. It is so, because too many are too big, and how often DCS swaps.
Most of the textures are stored in compressed .ZIP format. The bigger the texture size, the longer DCS will take to extract from the .ZIP file and then swap, for Core, Modules and Maps. In VR the issue gets even more exarcebated because every little tiny wee I/O interference is imediately noticed, more so than in 2D.
So, for the Maps, and because these have their own separate "LOW" textures (Core and Modules do not, they use single set), it instantly helps.

After over four years with this issue exposed in these forums inumerous times, I start losing hope that a fix for this will come.
Taz presented a solution but isn't maintaining it anymore, unfortunately. His mod is/was an absolute must (yes, it did/does break IC for those focusing in MultiPlayer):

 

Edited November 8, 2024 by LucShep

[kksnowbear]

33 minutes ago, slughead said:

That should get him a huge uplift and his rig will be a rocking beast!

Awfully funny.  In reality, not so funny when people buy high-end expensive hardware but have zero idea how to use it.

On 11/6/2024 at 12:15 PM, Gil80 said:

Based on GPU-Z:  in my BIOS I have the option for Auto, X8 X8, or X8 X4 X4. It is currently set to X8 X8.

OP:  I looked up the board/manual briefly; TBH I can't even see there's another slot (it's an ITX board, which I hadn't noticed earlier)...so I'm not sure why they'd even have bifurcation in the BIOS, since there appear to be no other PCIe slots to share the 16 lanes.  I did check to see if it's related to the storage slots, but didn't find anything related and that really shouldn't matter regardless as those lanes are provided separately of the PCIe lanes to the first couple slots.

In any event, pretty sure this needs to be set to Auto else it's going to split the lanes as I described earlier and per the manual.  And since there don't apperlar to be other PCIe slots anyway, that would be wasting half the CPUs 16 lanes - whether the 4070ti Super needs/uses them or not.

Edited November 8, 2024 by kksnowbear

[Qcumber]

7 hours ago, Gil80 said:

What headset and GPU are you running?

I upgraded from RTX 3070, which has 8GB Vram, to the 4070Ti Super 16GB Vram... I was expecting a big boost in performance for the Q3, but that wasn't the case. Also upgrading from 32GB RAM to 64GB didn't do much.

Quite disappointed that the 4090 is out of reach.

Quest Pro with 4070. QVFR is my compromise which allows me to get good performance. 

[sleighzy]

10 hours ago, LucShep said:

Taz presented a solution but isn't maintaining it anymore, unfortunately.

@LucShep there’s a script here for generating optimized textures from your current game files (similar to Taz’s already optimized textures). 

 

[LucShep]

11 minutes ago, sleighzy said:

@LucShep there’s a script here for generating optimized textures from your current game files (similar to Taz’s already optimized textures). 

 

I know mate but, while that's valid, I'm hoping for the author to improve it (it's still not there IMO).
 

Edited November 8, 2024 by LucShep

[Gil80]

11 hours ago, slughead said:

That should get him a huge uplift and his rig will be a rocking beast!

 

11 hours ago, kksnowbear said:

Why do you have it set for x8x8?  Do you have some sort of expansion card in the second PCIe slot?  If you set it x8x8, it's bifurcating the lanes, half each to the two PCIe slots (check the manual).  If you don't have another card there, you need to set the BIOS for Auto, so it will go to x16 (based on your GPU).

If you do have another card in the other PCIe slot then you either have to move the other card or live with the x8 lanes you're getting now.  BTW I'm not sure whether a 4070 TI Super can saturate those 8 lanes, but it seems possible TBH.  I'd have to look into it more to know.

 

you were all correct.

I set it to Auto and now GPU-Z is showing: 

I wonder if this will help alleviate the jittering I experience when I do a flyover next to the supercarrier.

 

I don't know what are my frametimes, but I'll do a MP game and report back.

 

Lastly, is the script of script of generating optimized textures actually makes a difference in Vram usage when setting is HIGH?null

[kksnowbear]

2 hours ago, Gil80 said:

you were all correct.

I set it to Auto and now GPU-Z is showing: 

I wonder if this will help alleviate the jittering I experience when I do a flyover next to the supercarrier.

Pretty sure that other comment was a sarcastic jab at me, given my signature comments.  Whatever...proof of the pudding, as they say (I could be wrong and will apologize if so). 

Thank you for acknowledging my sincere effort to help as you requested.  Nice to get the feedback to confirm my suggestion was accurate.

I actually don't know much about VR, but I try to help with what I do know.  I do hope it actually helps; if nothing else, anyone who reads this later on could also benefit.

I doubt honestly that the change will correct all the performance issues DCS can exhibit at times.  With that said, however, there are many "PCIe scaling" tests published online, which usually indicate that a high-end card will not 'saturate' the bus width of the bus it runs on natively - for example a 4090 will not saturate a PCIe 4.0 x16 bus.  The tests usually go on to run the card at lower bus widths and/or PCIe versions, in order to determine where the card saturates the bus and performance is affected.  So, for example, the same 4090 might be tested at PCIe 3.0 x16 or PCIe 4.0 x8 - both of which essentially cut the interface bandwidth in half.

Typically, the result is that the highest-end cards can saturate the halved bandwidth and performance is impacted, although not by a lot.  There might be small difference, say 2-3% - but it does vary, and it can vary a lot more.  It depends on not only the game itself and your settings, but also the resolution you're running at.

Obviously a 4070Ti Super is not a 4090, thus it would be much less likely to saturate even the lower PCIe 4.0 x8 you were using.  However - and this is significant:

- It can't hurt.  As far as I can tell, after looking over your board's documentation, I don't find any way those other 8 lanes can even be used by anything else, because there are no physical slots to add anything that would use them.  So, as I said, if you set it to bifurcate the CPU's 16 lanes, they're just wasted.  TBH I feel it's very bad programming by Gigabyte to even have that option in the BIOS.  To me, it seems sort of obvious this happened because they've 'reused' BIOS code on different models.  Motherboard manufactures do this, nothing inherently wrong with it, but it's downright lazy to leave a setting that has no purpose *and* can cause problems if set wrong.  Incidentally, have you updated the BIOS on your motherboard?  It is possible it was changed in a later BIOS version - the most recent on the Gigabyte website is dated December 19 2023.

- It might actually help.  While the scaling tests I mentioned typically find that even high end cards only suffer 2-3% loss at half the bandwidth, some of the same tests found that in certain games/settings/resolutions, the loss was a lot greater.  VR is very demanding, and you're using a card that is not top-end, so it's working harder than a 4090 would (for example).  Maybe the little bit of extra 'breathing room will make a difference.  You certainly don't need anything making matters worse.  Moreover, you have absolutely nothing to lose by having it set to Auto, and as you can see, the board now properly assigns/utilizes the full 16 lanes that the GPU is built to run on.

Easiest thing to do is try it and see - keeping in mind that (IMHO) no amount of high-end hardware is capable, at least currently, of eliminating all the issues DCS has, especially in VR.

Best of luck to you

Edited November 8, 2024 by kksnowbear

[slughead]

1 hour ago, kksnowbear said:

Pretty sure that other comment was a sarcastic jab at me, given my signature comments.  Whatever...proof of the pudding, as they say (I could be wrong and will apologize if so). 

Thank you for acknowledging my sincere effort to help as you requested.  Nice to get the feedback to confirm my suggestion was accurate.

I actually don't know much about VR, but I try to help with what I do know.  I do hope it actually helps; if nothing else, anyone who reads this later on could also benefit.

I doubt honestly that the change will correct all the performance issues DCS can exhibit at times.  With that said, however, there are many "PCIe scaling" tests published online, which usually indicate that a high-end card will not 'saturate' the bus width of the bus it runs on natively - for example a 4090 will not saturate a PCIe 4.0 x16 bus.  The tests usually go on to run the card at lower bus widths and/or PCIe versions, in order to determine where the card saturates the bus and performance is affected.  So, for example, the same 4090 might be tested at PCIe 3.0 x16 or PCIe 4.0 x8 - both of which essentially cut the interface bandwidth in half.

Typically, the result is that the highest-end cards can saturate the halved bandwidth and performance is impacted, although not by a lot.  There might be small difference, say 2-3% - but it does vary, and it can vary a lot more.  It depends on not only the game itself and your settings, but also the resolution you're running at.

Obviously a 4070Ti Super is not a 4090, thus it would be much less likely to saturate even the lower PCIe 4.0 x8 you were using.  However - and this is significant:

- It can't hurt.  As far as I can tell, after looking over your board's documentation, I don't find any way those other 8 lanes can even be used by anything else, because there are no physical slots to add anything that would use them.  So, as I said, if you set it to bifurcate the CPU's 16 lanes, they're just wasted.  TBH I feel it's very bad programming by Gigabyte to even have that option in the BIOS.  To me, it seems sort of obvious this happened because they've 'reused' BIOS code on different models.  Motherboard manufactures do this, nothing inherently wrong with it, but it's downright lazy to leave a setting that has no purpose *and* can cause problems if set wrong.  Incidentally, have you updated the BIOS on your motherboard?  It is possible it was changed in a later BIOS version - the most recent on the Gigabyte website is dated December 19 2023.

- It might actually help.  While the scaling tests I mentioned typically find that even high end cards only suffer 2-3% loss at half the bandwidth, some of the same tests found that in certain games/settings/resolutions, the loss was a lot greater.  VR is very demanding, and you're using a card that is not top-end, so it's working harder than a 4090 would (for example).  Maybe the little bit of extra 'breathing room will make a difference.  You certainly don't need anything making matters worse.  Moreover, you have absolutely nothing to lose by having it set to Auto, and as you can see, the board now properly assigns/utilizes the full 16 lanes that the GPU is built to run on.

Easiest thing to do is try it and see - keeping in mind that (IMHO) no amount of high-end hardware is capable, at least currently, of eliminating all the issues DCS has, especially in VR.

Best of luck to you

 

Not a jab. It’s called humour/fun/joke/whatever.

[kksnowbear]

20 minutes ago, slughead said:

Not a jab. It’s called humour/fun/joke/whatever.

Right.  Interesting that my sig is actually directed at specific terms, which you used exactly.  Very thinly veiled, IMO.  Just sayin'.

Humor, indeed.  As I said:  In reality, not so funny when people buy high-end expensive hardware but have zero idea how to use it.

Proof in the pudding re: My advice concerning the OP's BIOS settings, which may have an effect on the issue he requested help with.  Even if it doesn't change his problem, it won't hurt anything, and he's better off.  Plus, odds are fair it might help another reader (who may or may not ever even ask).

Edited November 8, 2024 by kksnowbear

[slughead]

Just now, kksnowbear said:

Right.  Interesting that my sig is actually directed at specific terms, which you used exactly.  Very thinly veiled, IMO.  Just sayin'.

Humor, indeed.  As I said:  In reality, not so funny when people buy high-end expensive hardware but have zero idea how to use it.

Proof in the pudding re: My advice concerning the OP's BIOS settings, which may have an effect on the issue he requested help with.  Even if it doesn't change his problem, it won't hurt anything, and he's better off.

If you want to take it personally and have a bad day over it crack on. I’m going to move on and get on with my day.