Meta Quest 3, DCS and slight stuttering looking out the sides of the Apache..

[The_Nephilim]

Hey Guys,

 

I, recently purchaseda Meta Quest 3 and had it since thrusday and been steady tweaking watching videos and tweaking some more. I near got it perfect and have just a slight stutter ervery once in a while looking out the side in VR in the Apache.

 

I, will show pics of my settings and DCS Log of the last mission I tried with the current settings in DCS and the Q3.. Now I previously had a Reverb G2 and had that near perfect never had much issue with it. but with the Q3 I am finding it hard to get over that final hump..

 

Now sure what else to try and say but here are my pics of my settings and such for the Q3.. my PC specs are in my sig and should be current. I have Win 11 23H2 on a seperate drive from my games a 500GB M.2 Drive. my games drive is on a 2TB Samsung 980.. I also have the swap file on a seperate M.2 drive so I have 3 M.2 drives in total.

 

Now that I see it that was could there be a taking away of PCIe lanes to the GPU from having 3 M.2 drives? IF you need more infop let me know or want me to run a test I am all ears and game for whatever to get this solved..

 

 

 

dcs.log

DxDiag.txt

Edited December 9, 2024 by The_Nephilim

[sleighzy]

Some quick thoughts on your settings:

• Your headset is at 72 so change your DCS Max FPS to 75
• Could drop your preload radius to 100000 (or even lower) so you're not loading a bunch of stuff you don't need
• Change "Res. of Cockpit Displays" to 1024 to make your MFDs more readable.
• Performance wise it's a better option, up to you, but I'd flip it so that textures are high and terrain textures are medium. Although in saying that the visual difference in the textures between medium and high in the Apache is next to nothing. EDIT: meh, you're flying low and detail is nice so leave those for now and revisit later if you want to try.
• Forest visibility is a perf hit as well, this one you can alter while flying so can quickly get feedback if decreasing helps anything
• Any reason for the 0.9 render resolution setting in the Meta link app? Are you modifying this somewhere else, e.g. DCS PD?

You're using both Quad-Views-Foveated and OpenXR Toolkit. Is Quad Views enabled in the DCS VR settings? What settings are you using in Quad Views and the Toolkit? Debug mode enabled in both (it's on by default in Quad-Views-Foveated)? Resolution being increased in those, e.g. Quad-Views-Foveated is 1.1 by default?

I don't use the Meta Link app (I use Virtual Desktop) so somebody else will need to weigh in on your Oculus Debug Tool settings. The Encode Bitrate might be a bit high, have you tried with lower values, or even default?

Edited December 9, 2024 by sleighzy

[The_Nephilim]

2 hours ago, sleighzy said:

Some quick thoughts on your settings:

• Your headset is at 72 so change your DCS Max FPS to 75---- I had tried that but it seemed worse at some points during the flight..
•  
• Could drop your preload radius to 100000 (or even lower) so you're not loading a bunch of stuff you don't need... Yes I can drop it what would be a good balance??
•  
• Change "Res. of Cockpit Displays" to 1024 to make your MFDs more readable.---- I will try that but do not see much difference...
•  
• Performance wise it's a better option, up to you, but I'd flip it so that textures are high and terrain textures are medium. Although in saying that the visual difference in the textures between medium and high in the Apache is next to nothing. EDIT: meh, you're flying low and detail is nice so leave those for now and revisit later if you want to try.------ I will experiment with these but they usually only take up vram..
•  
• Forest visibility is a perf hit as well, this one you can alter while flying so can quickly get feedback if decreasing helps anything---- I will also experiment with this setting but at max they do not pop in during flight ..
•  
• Any reason for the 0.9 render resolution setting in the Meta link app? Are you modifying this somewhere else, e.g. DCS PD?----- well I read it in a post it could possibly help, I will set it back to the reccomended setting..

You're using both Quad-Views-Foveated and OpenXR Toolkit. Is Quad Views enabled in the DCS VR settings?---- Yes QV is enabled in settings VR and I do use it..

 

What settings are you using in Quad Views and the Toolkit?---- I will post the QV Settings here..

 

Debug mode enabled in both (it's on by default in Quad-Views-Foveated)?--- where is that setting does it affect performance??

 

Resolution being increased in those, e.g. Quad-Views-Foveated is 1.1 by default?-------- not sure what you are saying here??

I don't use the Meta Link app (I use Virtual Desktop) so somebody else will need to weigh in on your Oculus Debug Tool settings. The Encode Bitrate might be a bit high, have you tried with lower values, or even default? I just read it would be best with a higher setting? what is the default value? I can experiment with this too..

Thnx for the help and here is my QV Settings:

 

 

 

[Mr_sukebe]

3 hours ago, sleighzy said:

Some quick thoughts on your settings:

• Your headset is at 72 so change your DCS Max FPS to 75
• Could drop your preload radius to 100000 (or even lower) so you're not loading a bunch of stuff you don't need
• Change "Res. of Cockpit Displays" to 1024 to make your MFDs more readable.
• Performance wise it's a better option, up to you, but I'd flip it so that textures are high and terrain textures are medium. Although in saying that the visual difference in the textures between medium and high in the Apache is next to nothing. EDIT: meh, you're flying low and detail is nice so leave those for now and revisit later if you want to try.
• Forest visibility is a perf hit as well, this one you can alter while flying so can quickly get feedback if decreasing helps anything
• Any reason for the 0.9 render resolution setting in the Meta link app? Are you modifying this somewhere else, e.g. DCS PD?

You're using both Quad-Views-Foveated and OpenXR Toolkit. Is Quad Views enabled in the DCS VR settings? What settings are you using in Quad Views and the Toolkit? Debug mode enabled in both (it's on by default in Quad-Views-Foveated)? Resolution being increased in those, e.g. Quad-Views-Foveated is 1.1 by default?

I don't use the Meta Link app (I use Virtual Desktop) so somebody else will need to weigh in on your Oculus Debug Tool settings. The Encode Bitrate might be a bit high, have you tried with lower values, or even default?

+1 on the above, all good suggestions.

Some additional thoughts/ideas to try:

• If you have an Nvidia GPU, try using DLAA for the Anti-Aliasing.  Don't enable DLSS upsampling.  It's also worth downloading DLSS 3.8.10, though you'll need to manually paste it into the BIN-MT folder of DCS
• Disable heatblur and lens effect
• If you're not getting a fairly solid 72fps, have a play with ASW whilst in game.  I've found the visuals a bit jerky at times when I'm not at 72fps.  Using ASW seems to smooth things out nicely
• If you don't already do this, install the empty VR hangar.  There's a link somewhere in the forums.  It's does what the name suggests, i.e. the hangar you normally see on opening DCS is empty and just black.  Apparently that saves some VRAM, and might help
• Have a dig around about the use of upsampling with OTT or similar.  I use x1.3 with my Quest Pro and it significantly improves the legibility of flight gauges and similar.  Sorry, don't know what the multiplier should be for a Quest 3

[kksnowbear]

8 hours ago, The_Nephilim said:

Now that I see it that was could there be a taking away of PCIe lanes to the GPU from having 3 M.2 drives?

Nah, it doesn't work that way   The usage/assignment of PCIe lanes is covered in your motherboard manual, p 15-16

The M2s (with one exception) use the chipset PCIe lanes which are not shared with CPU lanes.  The GPU uses CPU  lanes, as indicated, as does the M2_1 slot.  The 12700K you're using provides 20 "user-accessible" PCIe lanes, 16 for the GPU and 4 for the M.2.

Although some boards will bifurcate the 16 CPU PCIe lanes when populating two PCIe slots (eg x8x8), they don't do this with the 4 CPU M2 lanes.

The chipset M2 slot lanes are sometimes shared with PCIe slots, but an (admittedly quick) look at the manual doesn't indicated any of this type sharing.

I believe it is accurate to say that chipset lanes are never shared with CPU lanes, and vice-versa.  At least, I don't think I've ever seen it done that way, and I don't think it's possible with motherboards' design as it is now.

Also, using Samsung's magician software will show you PCIe lanes used by the M2 drive (or other mfr utils for other drives)., while GPU-Z will show you lanes being used by the GPU.  All of this is reliable information, no need to wonder if it's accurate (assuming, of course, you understand what to look at).  This makes it fairly easy to spot if anyone's not getting the lanes they should.

HTH

[The_Nephilim]

3 hours ago, Mr_sukebe said:

+1 on the above, all good suggestions.

Some additional thoughts/ideas to try:

• If you have an Nvidia GPU, try using DLAA for the Anti-Aliasing.  Don't enable DLSS upsampling.  It's also worth downloading DLSS 3.8.10, though you'll need to manually paste it into the BIN-MT folder of DCS---- I used DLAA it looked real good will do further testing.. about the DLSS 3.8.10 there was a program used to get version F of the DLSS that made the ghosting go away..
•  
• Disable heatblur and lens effect---- I had disabled those are they that much of a hit on the PC?
•  
• If you're not getting a fairly solid 72fps, have a play with ASW whilst in game.  I've found the visuals a bit jerky at times when I'm not at 72fps.  Using ASW seems to smooth things out nicely---- Yes I tried ASW but sometimes it lags and looks like I am under water very wierd effect.. I have this turned off ASW..
• \
• If you don't already do this, install the empty VR hangar.  There's a link somewhere in the forums.  It's does what the name suggests, i.e. the hangar you normally see on opening DCS is empty and just black.  Apparently that saves some VRAM, and might help----- Yes I have that mod it helps I guess..
•  
• Have a dig around about the use of upsampling with OTT or similar.  I use x1.3 with my Quest Pro and it significantly improves the legibility of flight gauges and similar.  Sorry, don't know what the multiplier should be for a Quest 3--- I bumped up the SS to 1.3 and it looked much better. will continue to test with that setting upsampled..

 

43 minutes ago, kksnowbear said:

Nah, it doesn't work that way   The usage/assignment of PCIe lanes is covered in your motherboard manual, p 15-16

The M2s (with one exception) use the chipset PCIe lanes which are not shared with CPU lanes.  The GPU uses CPU  lanes, as indicated, as does the M2_1 slot.  The 12700K you're using provides 20 "user-accessible" PCIe lanes, 16 for the GPU and 4 for the M.2.

Although some boards will bifurcate the 16 CPU PCIe lanes when populating two PCIe slots (eg x8x8), they don't do this with the 4 CPU M2 lanes.

The chipset M2 slot lanes are sometimes shared with PCIe slots, but an (admittedly quick) look at the manual doesn't indicated any of this type sharing.

I believe it is accurate to say that chipset lanes are never shared with CPU lanes, and vice-versa.  At least, I don't think I've ever seen it done that way, and I don't think it's possible with motherboards' design as it is now.

Also, using Samsung's magician software will show you PCIe lanes used by the M2 drive (or other mfr utils for other drives)., while GPU-Z will show you lanes being used by the GPU.  All of this is reliable information, no need to wonder if it's accurate (assuming, of course, you understand what to look at).  This makes it fairly easy to spot if anyone's not getting the lanes they should.

HTH

Yes I seen that but it appeared to be a little confusing but I guess since I reread it appears they lanes are not shared..

[kksnowbear]

18 minutes ago, The_Nephilim said:

Yes I seen that but it appeared to be a little confusing but I guess since I reread it appears they lanes are not shared..

I would readily concede that the manuals leave a lot to be desired at times

But again, don't underestimate the information that can be gleaned from utilities like GPU-Z and the manufacturer's SSD software.

Edited December 9, 2024 by kksnowbear

[Koziolek]

5 hours ago, The_Nephilim said:

Thnx for the help and here is my QV Settings:

 

 

 

Are you sure these are your actual QV settings? I read somewhere that QV companion only works with dynamic foveating. Better check the qv config file. I used to use the companion but l noticed that changes in it did not reflect the values in file. Now I have to change them manually. 

 

Edited December 9, 2024 by Koziolek

[The_Nephilim]

53 minutes ago, Koziolek said:

Are you sure these are your actual QV settings? I read somewhere that QV companion only works with dynamic foveating. Better check the qv config file. I used to use the companion but l noticed that changes in it did not reflect the values in file. Now I have to change them manually. 

 

yes they were the same so it is working correctly.. thnx for the heads up..

[sleighzy]

18 minutes ago, The_Nephilim said:

yes they were the same so it is working correctly.. thnx for the heads up..

The horizontal and vertical focal area in the Companion app do not control the fixed horizontal and fixed vertical section values that you will be using in your Quest 3 (the app only supports eye-tracked headsets for those values). By default they are 0.5 and 0.45 unless you modified manually in the settings file. 

[sleighzy]

Also on Windows 11:

• Disable game mode
• Disable Hardware GPU scheduling
• Disable core isolation
• Disable core parking

[The_Nephilim]

52 minutes ago, sleighzy said:

The horizontal and vertical focal area in the Companion app do not control the fixed horizontal and fixed vertical section values that you will be using in your Quest 3 (the app only supports eye-tracked headsets for those values). By default they are 0.5 and 0.45 unless you modified manually in the settings file. 

well I deleted QV so I guess no need to worry about that anymore.. it seems to run about the same and looks better..

 

17 minutes ago, sleighzy said:

Also on Windows 11:

• Disable game mode
• Disable Hardware GPU scheduling
• Disable core isolation
• Disable core parking

yes I had done those as well. I will double check core isolation tho..

[Roosterfeet]

I also just got a Quest 3. I'm running a 4070 with a 5800x3D. I'm shooting for 36 fps with ASW on. Turning on Turbo in Quadviews is the only thing that gets rid of the judder when I look to the side.

[sleighzy]

7 hours ago, Mr_sukebe said:

though you'll need to manually paste it into the BIN-MT folder of DCS

Should paste it into bin and bin-mt as DCS now runs entirely multithreaded so shortcuts pointing to bin directory will still run MT so the dll will need to exist there as well for folk using that executable.

[The_Nephilim]

Well upto this point I tried all the suggestions and I ust reinstalled Process Lasso and I still get ever so slight stutter when looking out the side. I did have a test mission where it was just the apache in syria taking off from Alleppo and I still had the stuitter.

 

Now I am guessing this is from DCS but what is wierd I did not have this happen with my G2 when I had it running. I am just stumped at this point but will continue to dig.. I am pretty sure this should be fixable but maybe it is the limitation of the USB 3.1 Gen 1 slot in the Q3.. I am really mad they decided to go with that older connection and not the newer gen 2 port..

 

I sure hope they fix that in the Q4.. I may write the president of Meta..

[Roosterfeet]

Maybe give air link a try just to see if it stutters. I keep seeing that some people lock a frame rate under 72 without ASW and I can't figure out how they do that without severe stutters. Air link is about the only thing I haven't tried and I'm pretty sure my wifi can't handle it.

[sleighzy]

If you're going to go with a wireless solution then have a look at Virtual Desktop. Really easy to setup with good results. Recommendation is to have your router (preferably dedicated) plugged into your PC via ethernet and within your play space. There are also USB ethernet adaptors that some folk use.

[The_Nephilim]

Well the 6ghz capable Router is about 15' away and I am getting only a Good signal from where I am to it.. I really not sure I want to go wireless, wouldnt that be even slower then the USB Cable I currently use??

EDIT: I just checked and they want 25bucks for VD.. OH my

Edited December 9, 2024 by The_Nephilim

[The_Nephilim]

22 hours ago, The_Nephilim said:

Well the 6ghz capable Router is about 15' away and I am getting only a Good signal from where I am to it.. I really not sure I want to go wireless, wouldnt that be even slower then the USB Cable I currently use??

EDIT: I just checked and they want 25bucks for VD.. OH my

Well I sent back the Meta Cable it was way too much and I found a good replacement that will keep it charged while I play as the Link cable did not do that well enough to have long game sessions for my settings..

 

I will be trying out the Wireless tonight while gaming. I dont think the battery will last long enough but either way it is not a long term solution as I have no cable long enough to make it work temporarily.. so I will order the new cable tomorrow along with a few more things and I guess I have tweaked about all I can. I do beleieve the fault with DCS..

 

 

[Panzerlang]

On 12/10/2024 at 6:03 AM, The_Nephilim said:

Well upto this point I tried all the suggestions and I ust reinstalled Process Lasso and I still get ever so slight stutter when looking out the side. I did have a test mission where it was just the apache in syria taking off from Alleppo and I still had the stuitter.

 

Now I am guessing this is from DCS but what is wierd I did not have this happen with my G2 when I had it running. I am just stumped at this point but will continue to dig.. I am pretty sure this should be fixable but maybe it is the limitation of the USB 3.1 Gen 1 slot in the Q3.. I am really mad they decided to go with that older connection and not the newer gen 2 port..

 

I sure hope they fix that in the Q4.. I may write the president of Meta..

Go from page 2 in this thread. Core Parking and Core Isolation, disable Process Lasso, huge improvement on my rig.
 

 

 

[The_Nephilim]

45 minutes ago, Panzerlang said:

Go from page 2 in this thread. Core Parking and Core Isolation, disable Process Lasso, huge improvement on my rig.
 

 

 

Yes I did all those except disable Process LAsso. I have followed your thread and seen all in there. I have either done or already knew about those tweaks.. I will try again with PL Disabled I will just uninstall it I guess..

Edited December 10, 2024 by The_Nephilim

[Tomcat388th]

@The_Nephilim  I have no idea if this will help or not whether I'm using link connection or Virtual desktop I'm set at 90hz but I use openxr toolkit to lock my frame rate at 45. This is with ASW disabled. I do not have the apache I mainly fly the hornet and tomcat in VR. If I look to the side I will see a little skip here and there but you really have to look for it.  This is with the quest pro and eye tracking.

[The_Nephilim]

Well I tried setting a few different ways but currently I have the Q3 set @120Hz with ASW On and the initial looking of it seemed to have looked like the least amout of stutter out the sides.. I will try this setting if we fly tonight and let you all know how it goes..

[The_Nephilim]

for some reason when I went in the MP Mission the FPS were jumping around and not staying on half the refresh rate of 120. Not sure why ASW did not seem to work.

[The_Nephilim]

OK Small Update, I had given up on the Q3 and I am sending it back.. Gonna have to save up and try the Pimax CL no other way that I see.. thnx tho.