Russian planes interrupt U.S.-Japan exercise

[Geskes]

No that is true :)

 

But apparently it send shockwaves trough the US Navy community and it caused them to rethink their tactics because they said themselves they didnt see it coming.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-492804/The-uninvited-guest-Chinese-sub-pops-middle-U-S-Navy-exercise-leaving-military-chiefs-red-faced.html

[GGTharos]

That's exactly what I'd say if I wanted to keep my passive sonar capabilities secret, too.

 

All I'm saying is that I have no idea whether they genuinely snuck in, or if they think they can sneak in but would have gotten nailed by half a dozen Mk48's trying to attempt it ... I can see either one being true. :)

 

Some sources pointed out the Song is fairly noisy some time ago ... if that Carrier had submarine escorts or helis on the hunt ... who knows.

 

Edit: I was thinking of the wrong sub. The Song could stay pretty quiet, but there is a trade-off for this lurking ability.

Edited December 9, 2010 by GGTharos

[Geskes]

Yes, and that is why I confirmed that I don't know if they actually did sneak in but that the us navy said they did.

 

I know nothing about current naval warfare technology so I wouldn't be able to give input on whether it would have been possible.

[GGTharos]

It's a diesel-electric sub. If they go electric, they're about the quietest thing under the surface you can run into, but they can't go too fast or too far.

[Geskes]

Oh then maybe I am not that far behind, I remember something like catterpillar drive from the hunt for red october?

[GGTharos]

I don't think that's a huge factor - the point is that there is no need to operate water pumps to cool a nuclear reactor, so that noise is removed.

[EtherealN]

The caterpillar drive in Hunt For Red October is, as far as I know, just fiction. I've always regarded it as a plot tool, not a serious technology.

 

With a diesel-electric running on battery you have seriously reduced the amount of moving parts (so to speak), and the ones that remain are basically just the drive shaft and propeller and they are obviously there in the SSN's as well. Obvious drawback of the diesel-electric is it's severely reduced submerged endurance, and I'm unsure how the AIP/Stirling systems being deployed by swedish, german and russian (and others I suspect, but I aven't looked at french etc) subs go for the whole sound thing. They claim they are rediculously silent, but I'd suspect that that is meant as a comparison to running the diesels, not compared to running on the batteries.

[Jinro]

PS, the Chinese have done things like this before too, they have recently surfaced a submarine in the middle of a US Navy exercise, being able to get within torpedo range of the carrier at the center of the formation of ships sneaking trough all security.

I figured it would sink from all the lead :hehe:

 

It was probably detected and mistaken for a friendly sub until it surfaced...

[Geskes]

Well I thought the idea in hunt for red october was based on real technology, a magnetic hydrodynamic drive, thought it was called something like that. Not sure.

 

So I thought maybe by now they had it fully implemented :)

 

edit: found on wikipedia, was almost right... its called magnetohydrodynamics.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetohydrodynamics

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetohydrodynamic_drive

 

but it also says it is not stealth as the movie suggest :)

 

"The film adaptation of The Hunt for Red October popularized the magnetohydrodynamic drive as a "caterpillar drive" for submarines, an undetectable "silent drive" intended to achieve stealth in submarine warfare. In reality, the current traveling through the water would create gases and noise, and the magnetic fields would induce a detectable magnetic signature. In the novel, of which the movie was an adaptation, the caterpillar was a pumpjet."

Edited December 9, 2010 by Geskes

[leafer]

Now we shift gear to submarine tech. What's next? Two-stroke engines on Harley Davidson bikes? I love you guys. :D

[BoneDust]

This thread should be removed becuase it is too political in nature and could cause a shit storm of you suck comments

 

The thread should be removed.

[EtherealN]

Bonedust, if you feel a post is objectionable in any way, feel free to use the "Report Post" button and we will look at it. That is not something that can or should be discussed within threads.

[Demokrator]

All U.S. ASW are equipped with a MAD (magnetic anomaly detector), so they just took it as friendly i guess.

[Groove]

I don't think that's a huge factor - the point is that there is no need to operate water pumps to cool a nuclear reactor, so that noise is removed.

 

That's new to me ;) Besides you don't want to go into littoral waters with a nuclear sub.

 

German U-212A can stay several weeks submerged.

[GGTharos]

Which part is news to you? Diesel-electrics having no nuclear reactors and thus not needing to cool them? ;)

[Groove]

the point is that there is no need to operate water pumps to cool a nuclear reactor

 

that's new for me - i don't see any diesel in your statement :D

[GGTharos]

That would be because you didn't follow the discussion! :D

[MoGas]

What's the chances of a Boeing 747 flying over an active training excercise?

 

Russian military aircrafts are not respawning in the training area, they need to get there. Today we have much more civil traffic around the world then in the 70-80's, today it is quit dangerous to fly without comms or transponder's, but some I guess don't care about it lol.