slimheli Posted December 21, 2011 Posted December 21, 2011 (edited) I happened upon a Situational Awareness Trainer for an A-10A. The owner said I could turn it into a sim and he would pay for all the supplies. Attached is a pic of the center panel. I have a hunch that I'm better off putting in the work to make this an A-10C as the old-style weapons systems will require an incredible amount of sorting around. Budget is not an issue with this project. Limited time and experience will using my hands is more the issue. I have a good handle on programming and technology, but I'm all thumbs when it comes to modifying and so forth. I'm trying to sort out how best to simulate the instruments, I'm pretty sure it's going to be best to use an LCD screen for the engine instruments, but the NAV instruments...?? not so sure. Thoughts? Edited December 22, 2011 by slimheli
Deadman Posted December 22, 2011 Posted December 22, 2011 (edited) IMHO I would suggest using real or simulator instruments in the big 5 HSI,ADI, ALT,Airspeed,and VVI to maintain the stair step realistic offsets of the Main instrument panel. You have said money is not a problem so I would take the same realistic approach on the engine indicators and other parts as well as well. Sticking an LCD in the cockpit would just create a conflict with what you have there all ready. If the Owner is interested in Real control Panels please have him contact me I still have a few. Edited December 23, 2011 by Deadman Spelling https://forum.dcs.world/topic/133818-deadmans-cockpit-base-plans/#comment-133824 CNCs and Laser engravers are great but they can't do squat with out a precise set of plans.
Gadroc Posted December 22, 2011 Posted December 22, 2011 Also you will have problems finding LCDs to fit a real front panel. There are not exact LCDs available to consumers for these dimensions and you'll have to cut the frame to hell and back. When you see home made cockpits they usually have fudged the dimensions a little bit (a quarter inch here... an 1/8th inch there) to accommodate the LCD displays or home made instruments and panels. Retro fitting this to be a A-10C is no small task, especially if as you say you're all thumbs. Fabricating this type of stuff is an acquired skill (I'm just starting to learn it). I'm not sure I'd start off my first project with this. I'd highly encourage you not to start just ripping things apart and modifying. This is going to take you a long time and you should do a few panels and things out side that very nice SA Trainer to learn first.
rocketeer Posted December 23, 2011 Posted December 23, 2011 I think you are sitting on a gold mine. To me the A model is 90% similar to the C version. Most of us spend a lot of time just sourcing for realistic looking knobs alone, then hunt for appropriate switches, then make the panels, cutting, engraving etc. of course everyone has to do the wiring at the end. But having the A trainer saves so much time and effort on the knobs, switches, panel sourcing and preparation. You just have to handle a few new panels. This is a pit builder's wet dream come true. We have great experienced people here to assist you. Deadman and Red are using real panels. They'd have to sort out the wiring for their panels like everyone else. I see Red has done a nice job with some already. some people have experience with real gauges. And we have Oakes the open cockpit expert. We have Gadroc the Helios guy. Since you have 90% real parts, you should push to make the whole pit as real as possible, esp. if money is not an issue (which excludes most of us). Then to make it even more ultimate after having a almost 100% replica of the C model, top it off with a big CURVED screen with projectors like that done by BHawthorne. Then put it on a big D-box motion platform like the one for Blackshark demo. With real parts, even a cockpit frame, giant screen, motion platform, it'd be good to be put in a museum and charge dollars for joy rides should you need to recoup the investment. Or better yet get the museum to sponsor the pit conversion. Whatever time and experience you lack can be made up with money resource that you have anyway. So making this the most ultimate realistic A-10C cockpit is very possible. I for one would pay for the joy ride. Just like dimebug and Ice are collaborating, maybe you can find some other simmers near you to chip in help. Where are you located? My A10C cockpit thread
slimheli Posted January 7, 2012 Author Posted January 7, 2012 Hey All, Thanks for the advice. I've been spending a ton of time trying to figure out what is going to be best for the MIP (mostly the Artificial Horizon, HSI, Altimeter, VSI, and ASI). The fact that these are military spec sure don't make it easy. Part of me figures I could use SimKits instruments for the VSI and Altimeter and ASI. Any thoughts on that? Other than that, if anyone has these instruments actually working, I am sure I could pay some cash to have them replicate their instruments. Possible? Yes, I'm well aware that I am in far over my head as far as fabrication goes. I learned my lesson real early when I was trying to see how the Warthog Throttles fit into the side console. The result was me cutting it. Even though it does fit, I realized that the end result wasn't pretty and could have been done waaaaay better. Anyhow, that sort of stopped me in my tracks as far as the power tools go. :S However, I do happen to have some very handy friends who have access with CNC's and plasma cutters. I figure that I'll let those who know what they are doing do things best. I've been playing in Sketch Up a lot to try and learn some drafting. It's a ton of fun! As far as the A model MIP, are the dimensions actually the same as the C model? I've heard that it's a touch wider to accommodate the MFDs. Thanks for the input guys! Oh, btw, I'm located in Calgary, AB.
y2kiah Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 hey there slimheli, hold tight for a day or so, I'll be posting my latest and greatest drawing of the -C panel that you can base yours off of. Mil-spec accurate instrument cutouts, including the MFDs.
Deadman Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 (edited) HI First how exact of a modeling of the simulator does the owner want? You have said it is not your cockpit,but that you are rebuilding it for some one else. The parts will be his investment that would be my first concern. Let start answering your questions With the Main Instrument Panel (MIP) as the base for your work. The MIP of the A model and C modle share some dimensions as far as i can tell the width and high of the MIPs are similar. The stepped construction of the center area seam to be the same along with the most part of the lower part of the panel. I have reversed engineered a MIP from My A-10A MIP I will be casting several weeks.If it turns out well I may be offering copies to off set my investment. Having some replicate any of the instrument correctly will be fairly expensive if you want them now. I have not bothered to reproduce any instruments do to lack of a market. As Before I will offer to help you out how ever I can. I am located fairly close to you just south of the boarder. good luck on your project:thumbup: Edited July 4, 2016 by Deadman https://forum.dcs.world/topic/133818-deadmans-cockpit-base-plans/#comment-133824 CNCs and Laser engravers are great but they can't do squat with out a precise set of plans.
slimheli Posted January 7, 2012 Author Posted January 7, 2012 hey there slimheli, hold tight for a day or so, I'll be posting my latest and greatest drawing of the -C panel that you can base yours off of. Mil-spec accurate instrument cutouts, including the MFDs. Well now I'm just giddy with delight! I shall wait eagerly kind sir.
Deadman Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 I don't want to take any thing away from y2kiah hard work but with out a real panel. there are things that will need to be change on his model i am sure of. https://forum.dcs.world/topic/133818-deadmans-cockpit-base-plans/#comment-133824 CNCs and Laser engravers are great but they can't do squat with out a precise set of plans.
slimheli Posted January 7, 2012 Author Posted January 7, 2012 HI First how exact of a modeling of the simulator does the owner want? You have said it is not your cockpit,but that you are rebuilding it for some one else. The parts will be his investment that would be my first concern. Let start answering your questions With the Main Instrument Panel (MIP) as the base for your work. The MIP of the A model and C modle share some dimensions as far as i can tell the width and high of the MIPs are similar. The stepped construction of the center area seam to be the same along with the most part of the lower part of the panel. I have reversed engineered a MIP from My A-10A MIP I will be casting several weeks.If it turns out well I may be offering copies to off set my investment. As far as the instruments go the ATTITUDE Indicator ARU-2BA MIL-I_27193C. It is a 5x5,25 instrument with the steering bars I can not find the actual size of the Sim kits ADI but it looks small added to the fact it is missing the steering bars.These units do come up on eBay from time to time for ruffly the same price as the simkits unit. Here is one example http://www.ebay.com/itm/230697979930 I would say go for the real ADI. The Horizontal Situation Indicator AQU-6/A MIL-I-83034 is one of the most complex units you will find for an indicator. I would suggest only spending money on the real item or on an extremity high powered computer, with a card able to drive multiple monitors and use a monitor there with a replica bezel. this techinque has been used in the F-16 community with great success. The RWR indicator can be found on eBay there are also copies available The AAU-34A Altimeter can be found on eBay there is one currently there http://www.ebay.com/itm/130620232291?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649 it is ruff shape but priced under $100.00 so not a bad deal The AAU-9A Vertical velocity indicator can be easily found on eBay at times. The AVU-22A Airspeed indicator is all most impossible to find so far i have seen one and i own it. But Not an extremely difficult instrument to copy. Having some replicate any of the instrument correctly will be fairly expensive if you want them now. I have not bothered to reproduce any instruments do to lack of a market. As Before I will offer to help you out how ever I can. I am located fairly close to you just south of the boarder. good luck on your project:thumbup: Thanks Deadman! Yeah, I know you've offered before. I've been so dang busy for the past six months with getting married and all. Things are starting to settle down now so I have some decent time to put towards it. Thanks for the links on those instruments! I'll do some more research.
rocketeer Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 If you can make mold copies or 3D printing, you can make replicas of real parts or knobs that we can't source from the market. There are some that I've not been able to find. My A10C cockpit thread
Deadman Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 I was going to make a set of molded knobs from mine but not enough response http://forums.eagle.ru/poll.php?do=showresults&pollid=644 https://forum.dcs.world/topic/133818-deadmans-cockpit-base-plans/#comment-133824 CNCs and Laser engravers are great but they can't do squat with out a precise set of plans.
Lumper Posted January 8, 2012 Posted January 8, 2012 A good start would be to get Mikes books. http://www.mikesflightdeck.com/mfdb/mfdb.html Lumper ------------------------------------------- When the going gets tough, the smart cutout. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
y2kiah Posted January 8, 2012 Posted January 8, 2012 (edited) edited... discussion better in private Edited January 8, 2012 by y2kiah
JCook Posted January 9, 2012 Posted January 9, 2012 Deadman How many more orders do you need to make the A10 knobs? How many knobs are included and whats the cost per set? Possibly I could order a second set if it gets us closer and I can afford it.
Deadman Posted January 9, 2012 Posted January 9, 2012 Deadman How many more orders do you need to make the A10 knobs? How many knobs are included and whats the cost per set? Possibly I could order a second set if it gets us closer and I can afford it. This is derailing this thread please pm me for more information on the possibility of knobs being the next project thanks. https://forum.dcs.world/topic/133818-deadmans-cockpit-base-plans/#comment-133824 CNCs and Laser engravers are great but they can't do squat with out a precise set of plans.
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