Mi-8 newbie controls .

[badger66]

Right , I bought the Mi-8 over the Christmas .

 

I know I said I wouldn't buy a chopper unless it was an AH-1S/T ..... but the look of this thing , along with the added scenario possabilities was just too much .

 

But now ..... I haven't gotten a damn clue where to start with controls . I was kinga hoping I could use my split throttle . Im really don't know where to start .

 

Any good ideas , explanations or profiles on this would be great , cheers .

 

Oh , I got a TM Warthog , Tir5 ..... with no pedals , Z & X for rudder , and a G510 keyboard in the post .

 

Ive also forgotten where to plonk any TW profile , so If someone could please run that by me again .

 

Ive got a sinking feeling that its near on impossible to fly this beast without rudder pedals ?

 

Any help at all ..... thanks in advance

 

Ger

[Fri13]

You can fly helicopter without pedals but it is more like riding a bike without breaks, you manage with some manner.

 

I have always had pedals for rudder and they are always there in real one (;-)) but once I tried to fly with a stick with twisting handle and I couldn't even stay in air because I have so use to naturally handle helicopters without thinking.

 

I did not have time to learn off the correct flying so it is easier to you learn to fly without. After all you can in stabile flight use way less X and Z buttons and fly more like you would fly airplane.

[Flagrum]

I would start simple:

 

• Cyclic Roll/Pitch -> Stick X/Y, no saturation, no curves
  
• Collective -> Right Throttle, Inverted, Slider (so you pull the throttle, like you would pull the collective)
  
• Corrector -> Left Throttle ... or ignore it at the moment. not that important for your first few flights
  
• Rudder -> "friction" slider right side of the throttle. As you have no pedals atm, you will still definately want to have an analogue axis for the rudder for precise steering!
  
• Trimmer -> some button at the stick, perhaps the CMS-depressed? (a bit like in the Huey) or more Hip style: Weapon Release
  
• Fire -> some other button ...
  

 

That should get you off the ground already. Everything else - what you need and what you want - will come together with a bit of practice.

[lmp]

Unlike Flagrum, I personally like a 10 - 15% curve on my X/Y axes. YMMV here.

 

Fire and trim are your most important buttons on the stick, you may also want reset trim somewhere handy. If you want to do a lot of shooting and switching weapons, well, you'll have to see what works for you, but for now you can use the weapon status "cheat sheet" that Belsimtek provided (it has all the keyboard shortcuts). There isn't nearly as many weapon and FCS related controls in the cockpit compared to the A-10 or Black Shark. If you still have some buttons left, maybe use them for autopilot controls (yaw and altitude channels engage and disengage - you'll probably be using the pitch/roll channel from takeoff to landing, no need to waste stick real estate for it ;) ).

[badger66]

Thank you so much for your above replys ..... Ill certainly give this a go once I muster up the courage to try again :) ..... like Im talking hours , not days . Man , I hope I can get the hang of this superb looking monster .

 

I work on heli's ..... mostly Bell & Sikorsky , Eurocopter ..... wonder what its like to work on this . I reckon its a massive leak (hydraulics) ..... rough sheetmetal work and big bolts ..... but good at what it does .

Edited December 28, 2013 by badger66

[Cibit]

Got my rudder pedals for christmas and they replace my borked ones from when the huey was first released. Man I am so in control of both helos since Christmas day. If you can get a set they will make learning the Hip and Huey so much easier:)

I also use a 18 % curve on X and Y axis because there is quite a bit of play on the X52 I have to use ATM.

 

For a warthog hotas I would keep stock. Best advice for where to put profile is start up the software and open a file to edit. This should give you the map to find it via windows

 

Enjoy it took me 50 hours flying in the hip before I felt comfortable with most scenarios;)

[badger66]

Woah ..... this thing will need some taming .

 

Managed a rather Omni-directional lift off followed by what sounded like power loss ..... emmm , I lost my tail boom !!!

 

Any more hints please ?

[Flagrum]

Woah ..... this thing will need some taming .

 

Managed a rather Omni-directional lift off followed by what sounded like power loss ..... emmm , I lost my tail boom !!!

 

Any more hints please ?

Yeah ... patience! ;o)

 

And maybe search youtube for some tutorials.

[lmp]

The Hip has a tendency to lose the tail boom if you slam it hard into the ground.

 

Can you describe the power loss in more detail? What led to it? Maybe we'll be able to shed some light :).

[badger66]

Looking at it now , Im sure it was not enough fuel onboard . Ive been on several servers 1.2.6. ..... and I cant rearm or refuel ?

 

Also , I cant install the module into 1.2.7 .... says I need 1.2.6 installed first ?

 

Im not surprised the tail fell off ..... I did hit the ground a bit hard !!!

[lmp]

Looking at it now , Im sure it was not enough fuel onboard . Ive been on several servers 1.2.6. ..... and I cant rearm or refuel ?

 

Also , I cant install the module into 1.2.7 .... says I need 1.2.6 installed first ?

 

Im not surprised the tail fell off ..... I did hit the ground a bit hard !!!

 

So you're using 1.2.6? Well, in that case, here's a hint. On the center console there's the autopilot control panel. It's number 12 on this picture: http://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/products/magnificent_eight/?PAGEN_2=2#446355

 

There are three green buttons on top of it for turning on the autopilot channels. Before take off make sure the middle one is on (click it). That's the pitch/roll stability augmentation system. It will make the Hip a LOT more stable and controllable. In 1.2.7 if you do a hot start on the ground, it will be on, but in 1.2.6 it's off.

 

I had no problems with installing the Mi-8 in 1.2.7 so I can't help you there, sorry.

[badger66]

It was me doing it wrong ..... Im all in 1.2.7 update 1 now .

 

Any more advice please ?

[badger66]

The Hip has a tendency to lose the tail boom if you slam it hard into the ground.

 

Can you describe the power loss in more detail? What led to it? Maybe we'll be able to shed some light :).

 

Yeah , I got what assume is a ;ow RPM warning trzing to transition from fwd motion to hover at about 300 feet ..... then it just drops , so I wait until the last moment and pull collective and she settles somewhat ..... hard is the best discription ! Im also finding it hard to co-ordinate collective and rudder ..... any deadzones in the profile .....

 

I really gotta sit down and slow up some ..... I really want to learn this 8 .

 

Any more usefull tips to shower me with will be much appreciated .

Edited January 10, 2014 by badger66

[lmp]

Was the warning you heard a long "beep"? If yes, that was probably the radar altimeter warning that you're descenting through decision height (which is by default set to 100m, or about 330 ft.). A yellow knob by the radar altimeter gauge should light up together with the sound. You can change that decision height by rotating the knob.

 

As you're slowing down, at about 40 - 50 km/h, you'll start losing effective translational lift, or ETL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Translational_lift). If you don't gradually pull the collective to compensate for this, your descent rate will increase. You'll also experience some shaking at this point which should go away as you slow down even more.

 

That in itself wouldn't be such a big problem if not for an aerodynamic condition called the vortex ring state, or VRS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vortex_ring_state). VRS happens when you're at or near hover, your descent rate is more than about 3m/s and your rotor is getting at least some power (you aren't autorotating). I won't bore you with all the physics behind it (you can read up on it on the internet) but what happens is you basically fall out of the sky.

 

What I believe is happening to you, is you're failing to compensate for the loss of ETL when you slow down and you develop the conditions needed for VRS to happen (low horizontal speed, descent rate of more than 3 m/s). When you're transitioning from forward flight to hover, the vertical velocity indicator is your number 1 instrument to pay attention to. You need to anticipate and compensate for the loss of ETL and don't let that descent rate increase too much. Try to slow down gradually and keep in mind that the VVI gauge has some lag.

Edited January 10, 2014 by lmp

[Rongor]

Imp describes it very well. Follow him!

 

then it just drops , so I wait until the last moment and pull collective

Don't wait for the last moment. Expect the drop, learn how to anticipate it, apply collective slowly to keep the drop at zero:thumbup: Slow down very slowly to practice this!

 

Im also finding it hard to co-ordinate collective and rudder ..... any deadzones in the profile

It is hard, like in reality this demands a lot of practice. There also no deadzones in RL.

[wolle]

Was the warning you heard a long "beep"? If yes, that was probably the radar altimeter warning that you're descenting through decision height (which is by default set to 100m, or about 330 ft.).

 

Makes one wonder why there are no warning sounds when the helicopter enters a flight regime where there is danger to enter VRS (low forward speed and high vertical speed). Would be mighty useful, but there must be a reason it is not so useful in practice (or do some choppers have that?)

[badger66]

Great advice lads ..... now I gotta store it someplace ..... brain aint what it usedta be .

 

Greatly appreciated , your time and advice ..... thank you

[Cibit]

I would be happy to take part in a training/familiarization night. I have about 100 hip flying hours and half that maybe on the huey. I can organize a ts server but someone would need to host. Also a mission would be a neccessary component.

Thoughts welcomed:)