Anatoli-Kagari9

Not the Museum itself :-) I'm trying - we do not have a 109 pilot around here... And, please bare in mind I've been - actively - flying for some years (more than 35) ... for real, even if "just" gliders :-) so, I guess I know what and how to ask, specially when the subject is a PC-based flight simulation and not a real aircraft...

With fuel in tanks, it doesn't, but I will repeat my empty tank tests with and without a bomb, and amno, as well as flying the aircraft at different speeds / AoA as per 5tuka suggestion above. Meanwhile, I have contacted the Messerchmitt Museum :-) - Let's see if I am lucky enough to get an answer... Should I get any answer, I will post the contents of my email as well as those of their answer.

I have to disagree because, as much as I myself thought it was indeed a dead horse, truth is I had never ran the tests with empty fuel and MW50 tanks. To be honest, I even completely neglected the importance of a filled MW50 tank, which resides behind the pilot seat, and if full should play it's role in bringing the CoG back... On empty tanks I believe any 109 will naturally be nose heavy, so, when we have a trim wheel with settings from -6 ( full tail heavy ) to +2 ( full nose heavy ), it surprises me that I can seldom go bellow -1 to fly without my aircraft wanting to pitch up, even when it is flying like a glider, and there are no gusts or updrafts being modeled in the sim. The difference, at least for me, resides exactly in that detail - now the aircraft has it's tanks empty, and still feels tail heavy ?

Sorry to bring this again, but a recent post at another thread re-opened the question of there really being something wrong with the pitching up moment / tendencies in the K-4... 1) Use a modified "free flight" startup situation where you edit in the Mission editor to empty the fuel and the mw50 tanks... 2) Start the SITU ---> The pitching up moment still there: you'll be gliding, and unless flaps and/ or gear are deployed, tail-heavy trim settings can't be used without you having to fight the pitching up moment... Even at full flaps and gear down, don't even think you can use more than -1,5 or -2,0 on your trim wheel.... Something must be wrong, I think ? The CoG couldn't be further fwd, the prop effects are gone ( yes, I know in DCSs FDM p-factor is still playing it's tricks in this situation... ), there's no power, ...., doesn't make sense to me :-(

My rudder is at 12, if I can correctly recall... 1) Stick back, full or 2/3rds 2) Rudder right 3) Advance the throttle, first up to 1,3 ATA (count to 6 ), gain speed, then 1,5 ATA ( not more ). 4) Start easing on the stick, towards neutral, and then ease the rudder as well to avoid over-correcting ( tye 190 D-9 doesn't need that much rudder on the takeoff roll, compared to the 109 K-4... ). 5) As soon as you get airborne, try to maintain a straight path and gain altitude. Use the trim to ease the force on your stick, avoid pulling the stick and entering stall... Retract the Gear when possible... 6) When the aircraft starts "feeling" stable, retract the flaps and adjust throttle and trim for the climb out...

In the first module I owned for DCS, the p51d, I have always found it a bit unexpected to experience that wobbling ( almost like the sensation of being in dutch roll ) that can be experienced when we takeoff. At high power settings, and even more if flaps are being used, the nose of the aircraft wobbles around visibly. As speed gains, it stabilizes and actually becomes a rather stable platform ( until we enter dogfight, and start pulling too much on the stick :-) ) ... The same happens with the Dora. For me the Bf 109 K4 is probably the one that wobbles the less under such circumstances...

They're wobbly mostly at high power settings and low speed / high AoA due to prop effects. Overall there is a specific modeling of p-factor in DCS prop aircraft that makes them feel a bit different from the experience I have with other simulator I use.

THX!

My account lists some credit ( bonus ) but when I try to buy any of the modules from the ED store the credit doesn't work ? Also, how can I buy again a module I already bought once ? It is listed as "BOUGHT", and I do not have the option to buy it a 2nd time ? Thx for any suggestions

Thank YOU! Great footage !!!

Interesting! I didn't try to empty it - is it possible through the Fuel and Load menu ?

when I first used DCS World, the p51d was my entry model, and I really had a bad time taking off with it too :-) The TF51, not having any armament is the lightest of the prop aircraft in DCS. If you are able to takeoff in the 109, then you really should be able to master takeoffs in the 190 ? Are you sure you're not using takeoff assist with it ? I also noticed, at one of the servers I tried last week, that they forced takeoff assist ??? During the taxi in my Fw190 I noticed the rudder was not in sync with my use of it, and kept making small adjustments even if I had it centered... I then tried with the 109, and the same happened... Strange...

Full stick back, max 1,5 ATA, first flap detent. Make sure you have disabled "auto rudder" and "takeoff assist" in the Special Menu. As you gain speed, start easing on the stick. Input right rudder - just needed at the initial takeoff run acceleration, because as it gains authority on the tail surfaces, you can practically bring the rudder to neutral... It's easier than the 109 :-)

I will, for sure. I'll search for it in Youtube ( and hope they guy doesn't talk German... ), or is there any text I could read ? Thx Yo-Yo

It's been a long time since I had problems taxiing or taking off in the k4. Landing has long been piece of cake too, but, the truth is I don't believe the way the aircraft behaves, specially that pitching up tendencies, and the lightness on ground, are that plausible :-( ... There really must be something wrong with this model, although I can't give maths to support my belief... I used to takeoff : - at MAX 1,4 ATA, - Manual Prop Pitch set to 12 o'clock, - Flaps set to the beginning of the 2nd mark. - Tail Wheel locked, - Full right rudder and stick centered for initial takeoff run, then easing the right rudder as required to avoid over correcting, and - only brisk inputs of aileron to counter any rolling tendencies.... - retracting gear only above 150', as I also change to Auto Pitch, or keep in Manual but make sure RPMs are set to MAX 2400 and ATA back to max 1,3 for initial climb, while flaps are being retracted, then re-adjusting to 2300 RPM, and 1,2 ATA

Great! Thx!

In the heat of a dogfight, we just can't forget about the limits... I haven't used the MW50 now that I use mainly manual prop pitch settings... And I find the required response, all of the time, even better than sometimes with auto prop and MW50 :-)

Hmmmm, didn't find this server ? Where is it ?

Yep! Chuck is DA MAN!!!!!!

After a long track of simming, of more than 25 yrs, and a recent 3 yr process of selection and "filtering", in which I re-evaluated FSX, X-Plane 10, IL-2 CoD, IL-2 BoS / BoM and DCS World, I have settled with only two simulators: - Condorsoaring for virtual gliding when not able to fly for real... - DCS World for rotary wing, ww2 fighters and from time to time maybe a ride on the L-39 or any other special modern jet module I may decide to buy. Simply can't find any match for DCS in terms of flight dynamics, attention to detail in modelling of a specific aircraft module, ... I would surely like to fly a nice Civil aircraft, like an aerobatic airplane or even a glider if the weather model one day get's updated to cope with the sources of lift we use in gliders :-), but although I didn't like combat simulation, the truth is I became addict of ww2 combat.....

Ok Billy, I'll try it myself when I get the module :-) Thx for the answers.

Very interesting to learn that! So, I can feel even more confident now with my climb rates in the K4 :-)

Ah! for that I usually set 1,35 or 1,4 ATA and set RPM to 2400 - 2500 BTW: I find myself using more the manual prop pitch mode than auto, throughout all of my online missions and offline as well. The aircraft feels better, even climbs better sometimes... And during combat i can manage to get better results even if I have to pay attention to ATA and RPM instead of simply setting my throttle...

Ah! Ok, understood, but still in doubt that engineer would forget about it ? ? ?

Of course, the true TC will be indifferent to uncoordinated turns. On a GA aircraft you can make a flat ( rudder ) turn if you want, and get the exact same result.... I believe the slip in the turns performed by frumpy is so negligible that I don't think it has any influence in the outcome...