Capn kamikaze

No, I said it causes a trim change in the roll axis due to a linear thrust component, not a roll, they are two different things, a roll is a continuous rotation about the roll axis, if the tail rotor is high it actually reduces the hovering angle, because it introduces a moment about the vertical axis opposing the linear one. Any roll there is a secondary gyroscopic reaction to the sudden nose up, the RBS cannot directly cause a roll, it will cause a nose up pitching moment, and that can cause a rolling moment..... see below.

Even with that on or off I am still seeing the nose rise if you release the cyclic. The effect is greater the faster you're going.

How fast are you going when you're trying this. It's quite noticeable at about 100 knots, straight and level, let go of the cyclic, and the nose will definitely rise scrubbing your speed off.

When I have time, I'll do a video, what I am seeing is a low rate recovery from a nose down forward flight condition, the helicopter does not maintain its orientation relative to the flightpath unless you hold a little bit of forward stick in, once you release that, the nose comes up to level and your forward speed drops off, and if you leave the collective alone, you start to gain altitude.

I can only tell you what I am seeing, as I said it is a light response, so your control set up may be hiding it a bit, but it definitely wants to pitch the nose back up, and you end up slowing down.

Just test flown it, and even with the AP, trim and Gyros on, it does resist you, but only lightly. All you have to do is establish forward flight, straight and level and let go of the cyclic, the nose will come up and you'll slow down.

That's interesting, with those turned off it should want to resist you the faster you go.

Try turning the gyros on and off, and see if that makes any difference.

Sorry, I took your statement about inducing a roll to mean that. To me a trim change is not a roll, most people when they talk about RBS they seem to think its going to roll the helicopter over.

Yes, in the normal flight envelope, asymmetry of lift will produce a roll trim change, but at that point, the retreating blade has not yet stalled. The asymmetry will also provide a resistance to pushing the nose down via the gyroscopic precession of the disk, which is why as you build speed you have to hold the stick forward to maintain what you're already doing, and progressively push more towards the stick limits to go faster, until you reach that point where you hit RBS and the nose flys up regardless of how much you push the stick forward.

RBS won't produce a roll, the force is coming from one side of the disk, but it is translated 90 degrees because of the gyroscopic effect, so ends up manifesting as a sudden nose up tendency at high speed....

I'll have to have a flight and check, but if this is only starting to happen when you slow down to a hover it may be accurate, all helicopters lean one way or the other in a hover, except coaxials or tandems, at higher speeds the tail rotor doesn't have to work as hard, and you trim it to produce less thrust, so the angle is far less apparent. The reason is the tail rotor, and it's vertical position relative to the CG (almost always above the CG) For instance in a helicopter with a main rotor that when viewed from above turns clockwise, the tail rotor pushes air to the right, this means if level, the helicopter will drift left, as aswell as providing a counter-torque, it is providing a small linear thrust, which can only be countered by assuming a slight right rolled position.

Then perhaps that needs to be allowed as an override option to mission builders, for exactly the reason I posted, such as a two person co-op, so that you can simulate QRA type intercepts in MP without having to taxi out.

Thanks Mav :D

Is there a way in a custom mission to force the spawn point of human controlled flights to be "take off from runway" when the mission starts up, and then after a timer, say 5 minutes, to have any respawning done at the ramp so the runway doesn't get obstructed? The reason I ask is I set up a co-op mission derived from an SP mission, and its a scramble to intercept an incoming raid on the base, and in SP it is "take off from runway", basically like an alert intercept that's sat at the bottom end of a runway, but in MP it automatically changes that to starting in a hangar, even though in the ME it says "take off from runway" meaning you lose time for taxiing out.

That isn't the issue, the issue is that if you're maintaining the glideslope, and you're light you will do so either by flying slower or by flying at a lower AoA to generate less lift, and if you're heavy then you'll maintain that slope by either flying faster or at a higher AoA to generate more lift. How are you helping the OP by making it more difficult than it has to be? Anyway I thought you was "Out".

Thank you.

I'll be using the left throttle as the nozzle control, there is another simulation in development with the Harrier at the moment, plus an older sim with a certain mod that allows you to fly the Harrier, and the left throttle works very well in both.

WTF? Of course you could fly in instrument conditions, you'd have to fly by instruments in that case, I am saying that if you are flying in VFR conditions then all you need to do is look out the window, and again considering what the OP is asking, they're going to be flying VFR, so instead of worrying about whether they have the exact right AOA they should be looking out the damn window. You need to get off your high horse and deal with the fact that aviation is as much to do with experience as it is to do with reading a damned dial, congrats on totally derailing this thread. @ williehayesjr, do what you have to do to get it down and then go from there, if that means ignoring the IRL technique, then do so, you can watch the dials later.

Always trusting your instruments over what you can see out the window is the worst advice ever, and has got pilots killed. The first rule in flying is fly the plane.

Best advice anyone can have on the spit is ignore the engine and pitch settings suggested in the training mission, it may be just me but I find lower RPM and slightly more pitch than is suggested really helps reduce unwanted torque reactions from fine adjustments of rpm, and if you set up the approach right you should basically be gliding in.

You're missing the point.... "If everything is working you have the ability to do cross checks to verify the indications." That's basically what I said, if everything is working, and that's sometimes not the case, such as the fuel quantity, and this not working has caused real life crashes, so don't rely on it, you said it yourself, when you said this.... "Otherwise you will not be able to detect if e.g. the ASI and/or AoA are showing wrong data." "Especially someone like you, who doesn't care about that AoA, needs to know the weight, otherwise the approach speed would be wrong." Which you can understand from flying the aircraft and looking at what the approach should look like, using visual cues, if you know your plane, and have flown the approach hundreds of times you shouldn't need to be looking at instruments at all, it should be instinct at that point, if you need to be looking at them then that suggests to me that you need to spend some time in a plane that is a bit more basic for a while and just concentrate on flying instead of managing, and again, that is more helpful to someone asking for basic advice like the OP.

"A professional pilot always knows the actual weight" Not true, if you can have the ASI and or the AoA sensor giving incorrect data, then you can also have the fuel quantity be incorrect either by faulty sensors, guages, or incorrectly input quantity in the flight computer, and that means an inaccurate weight, throwing all those factors off.

We're trying to help someone who's having basic problems getting the thing on the ground, and the best advice for that IMO is to slow things down, and learn the more advanced methods later, think about the OP question.

Ok, you're right about that, that the horizontal component does affect that, but you can still maintain the same glideslope by flying slower, personally I would consider the glideslope and airspeed more important, and if we're going to offer advice to someone asking for help landing, then the number one thing is to slow it down, it makes things easier to manage, and it acts like giving them more runway to play with.