Steve Davies

Thanks. Will take a look. Hummingbird wrote "when no one gives a shit about the peace time limits, the Tomcat more often than not seemed to give the Eagle a licking". I haven't made any claim, so there is zero burden of proof on me. And, for goodness sake, this is an internet chat, not a court of law. Let's get some perspective: I posted a link from an F-15 pilot who, when summarising his ten years in the F-15 and commenting on the DACT engagements he and his squadron experienced, recalled that killing the F-14 was not difficult. As you pointed out, there are so many factors that can influence that experience that it just isn't possible to argue whether that experience was typical (note, the presumption is that I believe him, but that doesn't mean his experiences extend to other pilots at other times) And yet somebody responded say 'he's a liar... because charts'. I questioned that. Again. I have made no claim. An Eagle pilot has made the claim based on *his experience*. As you well know, there is no repository of engagement results for us to go to (and you can't trust the AIM/ACEVAL results, because everyone knows that Hoser Strapa cheated!). So, I am not sure how pragmatic the insistence is on high quality data, and lots of it, in order to determine how typical his experience was. Instead, I take the view that as reasonable and rational people, we can ask BTDT guys for their first-hand experiences (not, 'there I was' stories, but general observations), and look for published accounts that are likely to have been peer reviewed and published by reputable organisations. This might function well as an alternative 'burden of proof' for an internet conversation! On that note, I've asked some F-14 and F-15 guys to share their experiences and general observations. Will post them here when I get them.

You're not arguing with him, but you're intimating that he is lying because he reckons the F-15 to be better at the merge? The basis for your claims is charts (see below). The basis for his is that he did it for real. The reason I don't place as much store as you in the charts is that operational, front-line aircraft often don't perform to the full extent that the charts depict. In other words, engine wear and airframe condition degrade performance over time. Case in point, I flew an F-15D at Eglin that would not go supersonic, yet the charts showed that it was clearly capable of it. When I queried this, I was told that it was not that unusual for a squadron to have aircraft that didn't do what they should. You call it 'established performance', but the only thing it establishes is the performance of a new airframe with new engines. I don't think that continuing the debate with you will create any further understanding, so I'll bow out now.

Very happy to be proven wrong, because the only thing I know about the Tomcat is what the DCS sim has taught me, but the image doesn't show a kill. So, no, not all bears shit in the woods.

It's a good question! It's you who is arguing with an Eagle pilot, not me arguing with you :) I am assuming you posted charts. Too bad they are not allowed.

No. I mean someone who has published something into the public domain, put their name beside it, and is prepared to have their credibility judged by it. I don't actually disagree with most of what you've written. My point is that Hummingbird is saying that charts debunk someone's personal experiences, and that if an Eagle pilot had won against the F-14, it must have been because: he had a clean jet, he was fighting a nugget, or his sample size (sortie count) was too small. In the face of that reasoning, I am simply asking where the narratives are that we can all go and read, that show the Tomcat would 'nearly always' wax the Eagle when things were evened up. That's perfectly reasonable of me to ask. As you point out, it's possible for anyone to kill anything given the right conditions (note that there's a Tornado F3 driver on here who says he managed to kill an F-15). But in this instance, the Eagle pilot I quoted was not talking about specific engagements, but the general experience in his community during the decade that he flew the Eagle. On the question of WSV, how much video total have you seen from the F-15A/C? The answer is probably 'not very much' (I have seen maybe three clips). The reason is that since the early 1980s, Eagle HUD video is classified SECRET.

I think that's an excellent summary. My own experiences as a journalist who visited dozens of fighter squadrons over 16 years is that even among those who are current, you can hear wildly different opinions on the same things and the same events. Sometimes, it's just not possible to arrive at a concrete answer.

Is that a kill? ;)

Wait, what? His actual experiences are debunked by charts? Other than the article you already posted, can you point to other first-hand sources that speak of community-wide experiences of the F-14 dominating the F-15 in DACT? You know who he flew against, what his configuration was, and how many times he did it? Is it possible he supported fleet workups? Or supported Top Gun? His bonafides are clear: three operational Eagle tours and about 1,200 hours, plus another 500 in the AT-38. Serious question: what are yours? GCI controller? RIO? Pilot? Says who? Again, can you point to any material where Tomcat crews talk of "more often than not" besting the Eagle? The Flight article is very interesting, but I would like to hear read the words of actual crews...

From https://www.amazon.com/F-15-Eagle-Engaged-successful-Aviation/dp/1846031699 The BTDT guys on the forum will note the to-be-expected fighter pilot irreverence towards someone else's jet, but my co-author of this book, "Disco", is a very objective commentator, so despite the slapstick delivery, I take him at his word. At any rate, he also told me that in the 1990s, the Eagle community referred to the F-14A as 'the grape', on account of it being so easy to pick. I'll ask him to provide some words on his personal experiences against the F-14B and D. Well, with that hand grenade rolling down the aisle, I am off to fly some more of this wonderful simulation. :pilotfly:

WAI weaknesses around station keeping and flying tactical turns are a well known DCS weakness.

Yeah, I think it's called Dogfight mode. The Greeks and Turks do lots of ACM together, for sure!

AIM-9M lock tone here: This is from a Greek F-16. Doesn't sound much like the new tone, but sounds a lot like the old one. Did the F-14 get its lock tone from the missile, or generate it itself?

The pedant in me says: 'airframe' is defined as the aircraft minus engines (so that includes the wings).

With Jester in his current carnation, the first thing I do is go Crew Contract > No Talking. I only turn him on for the tactical portions of the flight, and even then his value is questionable.

Yeah, he has a fuel totaliser, so he has the means of knowing. I wonder whether HB did not implement this because IRL it's the pilot's responsibility? One things's for sure, what I have learned about the F-14 and the F-14 community so far, is that they do things differently to other two-crew fast jet types (arming the ejection seats while the canopy is still up, for example!).

I don't understand why there is no tone associated with the master caution. Just seems so strange.

You're more likely to see scratches dirt than the crazing, although the latter does certainly exist. I also think it should be toned down a little, but it's got to be a very low priority in the grand scheme of things!

+1

He definitely doesn’t manage scan volume properly, and I think that the scan low and scan medium-low commands are buggy.

Seems that to get any of the ACM modes (other than PLM) to lock a target, I have to select Sidewinder, get the lock, then cycle back to guns.

As per title, would love to read a BFM guide if you can write it. I just flew the NTTR DACT guns on,y mission and managed to get behind the F-16, but I couldn’t get my pipper on him!

Is there supposed to be a master caution tone to accompany the light?

Is there any way to get true heading on the BDHI? Can’t see an answer in the manual, but while flying over NTTR I had 270 on the BDHI and noticed that the map view showed my heading as 285. Assumed this relates to mag variation...

I just had the same. How do we reset it?

Coming: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=235249