Maxfps not working

Yes, as others have mentioned......if you are getting tearing, most likely vsynch is "OFF" on your video card. Set Vsynch to "on" and it will limit the FPS to your monitor refresh rate getting rid of any tearing.

No. Please go back and read again - stuttering vs tearing and max FPS vs Vsync.

 

 

I think I can rest my case :) Using MaxFPS combined with Vsync ON causes this "weird" behavior. If you don't understand something, look at one thing at a time. How it is possible? I don't know. If you're going to observe the same with MaxFPS OFF and Vsync ON then I don't know how to explain.

Well, i got that situation right here.

Vsync forced on whit Ati Tray Tools and MaxFPS = 0 in graphics.cfg file

This indeed solved my tearing issues BUT my fps counter shows something ranging from 30 to 60 whit anything in between it. (so also 45 or 38)

So what i think Vsync does is make sure that the video produces an image at the same moment your monitor refreshes. If the Video card cant reach 60 FPS to equal the monitors refresh rate it will simply "wait" for the next refresh. Thus enabling to get rid of the tearing but still have an variable FPS that isn't an divider of 60

PS, i wont be surprised if i am proven wrong on this.

Few notes to everyone:

• focus on "did Vsync kicked in?" rather than "i turned it on in my card settings". Indicators of successfully forced Vsync are: no image tearing AND FPS changing between 1/1, 1/2, 1/3 ... of monitor refresh rate *
  
• I can tell very little about MaxFPS and Vsync both enabled *
  
• don't throw yourself into swamp of details if you still don't get the basics. Sure we can make jellys of our brains by discussing anandtech article and nVidia white papers on the subject but I don't see the point. I don't own the thread so feel free to go deeper but without me.
  
• I do well in avoiding speculations and presenting what I know in a simple and effective way but I am not an expert
  

Mysterious *:

• I don't own DCS BS so I can test s$%t :D
  
• if Vsync is working and you still get FPS other than 1/1, 1/2, 1/3 ... of monitor refresh rate then either Vsync is not working or something else is going on but certainly it is not a reason to redefine Vsync and how it works. Like I said before there is 5% chances that a game uses different "Vsync implementation" not constrained by 1/1, 1/2, 1/3 ... of monitor refresh rate. So I'm simply not interested in such speculations unless you have something more (like FPS vs time registered by FRAPS or other software).
  
• if anything works not as you'd expect it to
  

  Blame Canada!

  :P
  

Eh?

It's a line from South Park movie. No offence intended :)

V-sync

Vertical synchronization is an option found in most systems, wherein the video card is prevented from doing anything visible to the display memory until after the monitor has finished its current refresh cycle.

During the vertical blanking interval, the driver would order the video card to either rapidly copy the off-screen graphics area into the active display area (double buffering), or treat both memory areas as displayable, and simply switch back and forth between them (page flipping).

When vertical synchronization is in use, the effective frame rate of the rendering engine will exactly equal the monitor's refresh rate, if it was higher. Although this feature normally results in improved video quality, it is not without trade-offs in some cases. When one wishes to benchmark a video card or rendering engine, it is generally implied that the hardware and software render the display as fast as possible, without regard to monitor's capabilities or the resultant video tearing. Otherwise, the monitor and video card will effectively throttle the benchmarking program, causing it to generate invalid results.

Vertical synchronization can also lead to artifacts in video and movie presentations, as they are generally recorded at somewhat low frame rates (usually 24 to 30 FPS). When such a movie is played on a monitor set for a typical 60 Hz refresh rate, the video player will miss the monitor's deadline fairly frequently, in addition to the interceding frames being displayed at a slightly higher rate than they were intended for, resulting in an effect similar to judder.

Video games, which have a wide variety of rendering engines, tend to benefit well from vertical synchronization, as a rendering engine is normally expected to build each frame in real time, based on whatever the engine's variables specify at the moment a frame is requested.

Wiki

It is the "judder" (stutter), to which I refer to

ATI cards had a problem (at least the 4870x2, or its drivers of that era) in which Vsynch just did not work, whereas the nVidia cards (GTX285) does have vsynch working....

I still don't see your point / question.

one point is contributing to the thread, in a factual manner...

a second, and perhaps more important point... is when running an LCD monitor and the sim/ game is outputting less than the LCD's refresh rate of 60Hz... there will be stuttering (LCD television judder) as mentioned earlier.

It's a line from South Park movie. No offence intended :)

None taken. You'd have to be Canadian to understand the use of "eh!"

one point is contributing to the thread, in a factual manner...

I'm afraid the essay is on home video and this...

Vertical synchronization can also lead to artifacts in video and movie presentations, as they are generally recorded at somewhat low frame rates (usually 24 to 30 FPS). When such a movie is played on a monitor set for a typical 60 Hz refresh rate, the video player will miss the monitor's deadline fairly frequently, in addition to the interceding frames being displayed at a slightly higher rate than they were intended for, resulting in an effect similar to judder.

... just does not happen in 3D apps Vsync which allows FPS to be 1/1, 1/2, 1/3 ... of monitor refresh rate. Next time prefer e.g. [/url] or over such articles.

a second, and perhaps more important point... is when running an LCD monitor and the sim/ game is outputting less than the LCD's refresh rate of 60Hz... there will be stuttering (LCD television judder) as mentioned earlier.

And why I think we shouldn't talk about it (and home video articles shouldn't be cited here)? Because the judder you mention, clearly visible on constant FPS video materials will be indistinguishable from already (often massive) stuttering caused by 3D FPS fluctuations. To put it even more simple - don't cite articles on home video because video materials are constant FPS generaly while 3D app FPS is not, video Vsync has no influence on FPS etc. etc. Don't you have enough sources "on the 3D apps side of the internet"?

None taken. You'd have to be Canadian to understand the use of "eh!"

Ano ;)

DCS isn't a home video Bucic, (I was offering a 'clarity' with the wikipedia quote) but when the sim/ game is running at less than the LCD monitor's 60Hz refresh rate, the stutter (judder) is present :music_whistling:

this is with vSynch off and MAXFPS set to any of the dividers and with vsynch on... and with MAXFPS = 30/15/12, a similar situation to the video (30 FPS) player is present, because frame rates are capped to those dividers.

nice try on your deflections though... ;)

this is with vSynch off and MAXFPS set to any of the dividers and with vsynch on... and with MAXFPS = 30/15/12, a similar situation to the video (30 FPS) player is present, because frame rates are capped to those dividers.

The only reason for writing in such a clumsy way I can think of is that English is not your native language and you write in a hurry. I'm not having a go, but from the cited bit I get that you claim that stuttering occurs... always.

Now, I spent much more time figuring out what your actual statements are than I spent figuring out technicals. Please start highlighting your points e.g. "judder is present with Vsync on </next line>" or don't expect me to answer.

ok then Bucic (now let's not get into who can't understand what, when it comes to language, eh?).... stutter (LCD television, for clarity, judder) is present when the game is outputting less FPS than the LCD monitor 60Hz refresh rate, regardless of vSync on or off, or what divider the ingame MAXFPS= option is set to except 1/1 (60/ 60). In the condition of 1/1 when the game is running at less than 60FPS, the stutter (judder) is present

:)

ok then Bucic (now let's not get into who can't understand what, when it comes to language, eh?).... stutter (LCD television, for clarity, judder) is present when the game is outputting less than the LCD's 60Hz refresh rate, regardless of vSync on or off, or what setting the ingame MAXFPS= option is set to.

I'm sure I can understand less but presenting clear specific statements is not your strong point either. Capital letters would be sweet too.

Regarding your statement - wrong.

Possible FPS less than monitor refresh rate + Vsync ON => constant FPS at e.g 1/3 of the refresh rate and no visible stuttering.

Unless you're talking about 15 FPS or less. I'm not going there.

visible stuttering (judder) exists on an LCD 60Hz monitor, when the game is outputting less FPS than the LCD monitor's 60Hz rate.... As I first mentioned, this can be seen when moving over terrain.

Well, i got that situation right here.

Vsync forced on whit Ati Tray Tools and MaxFPS = 0 in graphics.cfg file

This indeed solved my tearing issues BUT my fps counter shows something ranging from 30 to 60 whit anything in between it. (so also 45 or 38)

 

So what i think Vsync does is make sure that the video produces an image at the same moment your monitor refreshes. If the Video card cant reach 60 FPS to equal the monitors refresh rate it will simply "wait" for the next refresh. Thus enabling to get rid of the tearing but still have an variable FPS that isn't an divider of 60

As for the reason for the thread, setting Maxfps=60 DID limit the frame rates. It just limited it to 64 FPS and I was expecting 60.000. I tried Maxfps=30 to verifiy and it limited it to 33ish. So it's trying, it just isn't exact so I thought it wasn't working.

But I'm glad it got us all talking. It is a bit confusing, I'll go with the above theory about the variable FPS. It would explain why the stuttering isn't too sever when my FPS drops < 60 and also why the game FPS is reporting a variable FPS around 41-48 when it does (and not exactly 30).

BTW, this is really maddening. With Maxfps=0, I get variable rates between 70-110 FPS 90% of the time. That makes me feel better about spending all that $ on this rig. Large towns and other complex scenes HAMMER the CPU down to 45-50 fps. Mix that with a 60Hz plasma and I get the stuttering. It's a 60 in screen though and looks absolutely stunning at 1920x1080.

So, question, would you kick out a pretty girlfriend (60" plasma tv) for smoking in bed (being only 60 Hz)?

be careful with plasma tv screens though... some of them bugga's pull upwards of 500watts (the equivalent of 5 x 100watt light bulbs)

Woots, vSync basically synchronises the vga output to the monitor (read the wiki post explaining it... if you've missed it). CRT monitors have a different method of drawing compared to an LCD, which is why the stutter (judder) I've mentioned was never apparent, and have an adjustable refresh rate. (what was apparent with the CRT's though, was the stutter (slide show) of low FPS from the game.

visible stuttering (judder) exists on an LCD 60Hz monitor, when the game is outputting less FPS than the LCD monitor's 60Hz rate.... As I first mentioned, this can be seen when moving over terrain.

OK, maybe I didn't notice this. Maybe it's harder to observe at ~40+ FPS I were getting and much more evident if frame rates are lower. As I said, I can test s#$t now ;)

Anyway, I hope I made the idea of what are the benefits of Vsync more clear and that it is a very underrated setting. Combined with Anisotropic Filtering and Anti Aliasing it gives a jump from stuttering, tearing and shimmering graphics to something great without those flaws.

I totally agree... the benefits of vSync are highly underated :) its just a shame about the inherent flaw of an LCD screen, eh?

I totally agree... the benefits of vSync are highly underated :) its just a shame about the inherent flaw of an LCD screen, eh?

If it's a Canadian "eh?", then you'll have to translate it for me :D

:)

Kiwis (New Zealanders) like to get an eh or two in as well

What a waste of time these all Vsync posts!!! :doh:

I can say with 90% probability that DCS Black Shark uses special Vsync implementation (wait for Vsync ?) that allowes to bypass Vsync limitation re FPS being integer fractions of monitor refresh rate so you don't need any tools for forcing tripple buffering (like D3DOverrider).

Just enjoy it people! Other simmers are not that lucky! :thumbup:

I agree. I'm using D3Doverrider to force triple buffer and I don't think it's doing squat. BS is already forcing it for you. I'll disable D3doverrider, one less utility to be running in the background.