The Meteor roughly doubles the range of the AIM-120 AMRAAM

[TucksonSonny]

 

Conventional rocket powered missiles rely upon an initial boost phase to achieve high speed, followed by a 'coast' phase to intercept. Latest generation, highly maneuverable aircraft have the ability to outrun or outmaneuver conventional missiles at the extremes of their range, where their energy state is weakest. In contrast, the Meteor's Bayern-Chemie solid propellant, throttleable, ducted-ramjet motor gives it sustained Mach 4 speed in order to chase and destroy targets even at the outer edges of the missile's range.

The divergence goes to a fundamental disagreement about future threats and tactics. American doctrine to address the proliferaton of weapons systems like Russia's Sukhoi SU-27 family with AA-12 "AMRAAMski" missiles was predicated on having planes (F/A-22, F-35 JSF to some extent) with stealth features that would reduce the range of detection and engagement, while using vectored thrust technologies and other enhancements that would combine with stealth to give its planes the edge in close-in fights.

In contrast, the Europeans chose a combination of less stealthy and maneuverable 4th generation aircraft with long-range missiles carried externally, in order to defeat foes at the outer edge of the engagement range. Hence the Meteor BVRAAM and its design characteristics, including 100 km est. maximum range which is roughly double that of the AIM-120 AMRAAM. There are also reports that the Meteor missile will include "hand-off" capability to other aircraft, which could further improve fighter survivability in head-on closing engagements by avoiding situations in which the enemy can get close enough for a return shot with today's increasingly accurate 5th generation short-range missiles.

Source: www.defenseindustrydaily.com

Fitting the meteor into the stealth-enhancing internal weapon bays of the F-35 JSF and F/A-22 Raptor would be an impossible job!

Tuckson Sonny,

[Rhodesian]

Oh, crap...

[GGTharos]

TucksonSonny, you just gave some engineer a challenge which he'll wilkely solve quite quickly ... ;)

[S77th-GOYA]

What are the dimensions of that missile? If the F-22 can carry two JDAMs and two AMRAAMs internally, it doesn't seem like it would be much of a problem. Maybe length?

[GGTharos]

Looks like just a strap-on for the AMRAAM, no length changes ... how appropriate ;)

[Pilotasso]

It was developed with Raytheon. I wouldnt be surprised if the US buys some in case of need. Dunno if it fits inside the raptor but then with such sandoff range stealth is secondary.

[hitman]

http://www.global-defence.com/1999/missiles/missile3.htm

[TucksonSonny]

Looks like just a strap-on for the AMRAAM, no length changes ... how appropriate ;)

 

Length is Ok but,

Do you think that the F-22 project did not cost already enough. Production is already started.

Do you really think that they are going to cut open the 22 and redesign completely.

[TucksonSonny]

Oh, crap...

 

My point is the 22 is crap :badmood:

[GGTharos]

Fortunately, the Raptor's ability to prosecute airborne threads is not really dictated by the little hairs on the back of your neck :D

[SwingKid]

100 km is "roughly double" of 40 nm?

 

-SK

[Crusty]

Looks like just a strap-on for the AMRAAM, no length changes ... how appropriate ;)

 

What?...spit it out man

[Prophet_169th]

It means that most AMRAAMs in service can probably be upgraded with a kit.

 

So all you need is kits, and the already present AMRAAM.

 

Tuscon, why would they have to completely redesign the F22 to fit a missle in the bay. If anything, its just designing a new weapons rack, or just carry less.

[Cobra360]

I think the 120 and Meteor are the same length because the Typhoon can carry them in the same place on it's fuselage that it can with the 120. I think right now it would be possible to fit a max of four Meteors into the F-22 compared to six 120s. If the fins can't be clipped on the Meteor, I can't see why they can't make them fold in like the Russian Kh-35, the only problems may be with the intakes on the missile.

 

I can't see the US buying the Meteor instead I think they will go with the AIM-120D because they will want to be seen to supporting US jobs.

[Yellonet]

In the future there will be super fast drones with radar and optical tracking devices that can be carried by fighters, then sent away to a specified area and find the enemy and then guide missiles to the target, radar-stealth wont do much good once the drone can see you. It would most likely be impossible to break lock too if you don't destroy the drone.

[TucksonSonny]

I think the 120 and Meteor are the same length because the Typhoon can carry them in the same place on it's fuselage that it can with the 120. I think right now it would be possible to fit a max of four Meteors into the F-22 compared to six 120s. If the fins can't be clipped on the Meteor, I can't see why they can't make them fold in like the Russian Kh-35, the only problems may be with the intakes on the missile.

 

I can't see the US buying the Meteor instead I think they will go with the AIM-120D because they will want to be seen to supporting US jobs.

 

 

Exactly,

The US will never design a rack or even think about using foreign missiles on their planes.

They never did it and my guess is that they will never accept a deal like that!

BTW, a ramjet-technology based R-77 version is under development.

[Shaman]

Meteor BVRAAM is ~3,65m in lenght (11ft,11in) so it is just a bit less then AIM-120A/B AMRAAM which is 3,66m (12ft)

 

source: http://www.eurofighter-typhoon.co.uk/common/AA/bvraam.html

[Pilotasso]

It uses ramjet, hence the body length is not as much used to pack solid roket motor fuel.

[Crusty]

It means that most AMRAAMs in service can probably be upgraded with a kit.

 

So all you need is kits, and the already present AMRAAM.

 

Tuscon, why would they have to completely redesign the F22 to fit a missle in the bay. If anything, its just designing a new weapons rack, or just carry less.

 

Its not a modified amraam, its totaly different

[Cobra360]

I think the Meteor was re-designed to fit inside the F-35B. Seeing as MBDA has a large portion of a British company in it and that the RN is buying the F-35B, which was the smallest weapons bay of the three F-35 variants, it would have made no sense to buying the F-35 and have to use it's primary air to air weapon on external pylons defeating the whole stealth ability.

[Shaman]

It uses ramjet, hence the body length is not as much used to pack solid roket motor fuel.

Ramjet works only at high speeds, hence a powerfull rocket engine is still necessary till missile reaches certain speed so ramjet engine can kick in. Theoretically no rocket engine would be necessary if the missile would be always launched from a plane that is moving at around sonic speeds :)

 

Oh and bout that posts F-22 sucks, blah blah...that it cannot carry these kind of new missiles. Like someone said it is just a problem for the engineers. I'm sure some US war industry will design simmilar missile that can fit into F-22 and F-35 payload doors.

[ALDEGA]

Fortunately, the Raptor's ability to prosecute airborne threads is not really dictated by the little hairs on the back of your neck :D

What exactly is so good about the F/A-22? It has stealth, ok, but the internal payload seems so limited. Does it have the ability to carry external payload as well? Otherwise it's an invisible, clawless cat ;) Expensive one as well.

[Pilotasso]

Ramjet works only at high speeds, hence a powerfull rocket engine is still necessary till missile reaches certain speed so ramjet engine can kick in. Theoretically no rocket engine would be necessary if the missile would be always launched from a plane that is moving at around sonic speeds :)

 

Ramjet works at above 750Km/h (arround 400Mp/h) Futrther more it has a booster that quikly accelerates the missile to that speed if needed. But the fuel used it takes to do that is a small fraction of that a full solid rocket motor takes.

 

Why are you insisting on this issue?

[Cobra360]

@ ALDEGA: It can carry 8 AIM-120s external aswell or two tanks and 4 120s. So in non stealth config it can carry 14 AIM-120s and 2 AIM-9s.

[Shaman]

Why are you insisting on this issue?

Why not? I find it interesting. :music_whistling: