Very Cool F-22 Video...

[Stealth_HR]

If I had to have a plane in my hangar to throw around the sky over weekends, I know what it would be...

 

(Clue: NOT an F22 ;) )

 

At the risk of hijacking a thread... I know I'd want a Yak-141 Freestyle. VTOL, maneuverable, speedy, and can fit into a garage with wings folded. :P

[nscode]

It's not for me then :( I don't have a garage :D

[Force_Feedback]

At the risk of hijacking a thread... I know I'd want a Yak-141 Freestyle. VTOL, maneuverable, speedy, and can fit into a garage with wings folded. :P

 

And with the engine from it's "son", aka the F-35B, you can take-off without burning your driveway too much.

[RvETito]

Saw it. Nothing special really. I would be more interested to see the demo of the couple F-15s that were starting up when the Raptor taxied in front of them.

[Cobra360]

Saw it. Nothing special really. I would be more interested to see the demo of the couple F-15s that were starting up when the Raptor taxied in front of them.

 

For as much as I really, really like the Eagle, I've never seen a display by an F-15 that really impressed me. The Eagle's show piece is the max performance takeoff and after that there's nothing really that would make you go wow. Just IMO. But in saying that, all F-15 demos I have seen have been solo displays.

[Trident]

Agree, the take-off is amazing though. That said, the JASDF apparently likes to demo its Eagles in pairs and the display is supposed to be quite something to watch.

[bflagg]

"Yep. That just killed the flanker's claim to fame"

 

& it only took the US 20 years to catch up...

 

I love the way when it was a Russian thing only there were endless cries of "it's a gimick" & "there is no real life application for manouverability of that kind in modern warfare", but now that the F-22 has publically displayed a cobra there is a collective cry of "YESS!!!, WE CAN DO IT TOO!!"

 

 

You do realize that it took the former soviet union aprx 15 years to come up with the 27 to "answer" the US's release of the 15?

 

In those days ..the soviets were all crying...

Да! Мы можем сделать его к!

 

The 15 for the next 10yrs of so aftereward maintained a unparralled superiority and at the least..an equality.

 

The last 6 years are a different story...hence the push for the 22.

[Guest IguanaKing]

Not to mention that, over the past 25 years, one jet has a proven combat record...and its pretty impressive. Its opposition does not. ;)

 

BTW...AFTI F-16s were doing these types of maneuvers in the early to mid 80's (off-axis pitch pointing...sustained). VISTA F-16s were doing some SUPER crazy s**t in the early 90's (181 instantaneous AoA, 90+ sustained). Yes, Weta, we're happy a production airframe of ours can do it too...but I don't think anybody said it means anything in combat. ;)

 

Has Cope India come up yet? Heh...if not...I'm sure it will soon. Ruh-roh. :megalol:

[TucksonSonny]

I've seen Su-27 performance videos. It performs the same 'lazy fat cow on ice' maneuvers. That is the entire POINT of high-AoA slow speed handling demonstration, and the flankler's claim to fame.

 

And yes, it's much older ... so? Okay, it did the Cobra 'first' for whatever reason. But if you are going to claim that 'doing it first' means something (And hey, I do it too!) then I say AMRAAM will own all other air forces ;)

 

 

Why the 22 was not yet tested in any air-combat exercise against the ef2k?

Are the Americans afraid or something?

BTW GG, Meteor ramjet owns all other air forces! :pilotfly:

PS. It is not wrong to be a patriot.:D

[Force_Feedback]

Not to mention that, over the past 25 years, one jet has a proven combat record...and its pretty impressive. Its opposition does not. ;)

 

BTW...AFTI F-16s were doing these types of maneuvers in the early to mid 80's (off-axis pitch pointing...sustained). VISTA F-16s were doing some SUPER crazy s**t in the early 90's (181 instantaneous AoA, 90+ sustained). Yes, Weta, we're happy a production airframe of ours can do it too...but I don't think anybody said it means anything in combat. ;)

 

Has Cope India come up yet? Heh...if not...I'm sure it will soon. Ruh-roh. :megalol:

 

Guess the SU didn't have the money to do some "peacekeeping" all over the world, they've learned their lesson after Ghan. Not that I'm saying that Russia is less imperialistic than the US, but they didn't have the money to fly all over the world, attacking countries and thus shooting down planes.

Don't think Cope India will exist for long, as they will have a communist goverment in a few years :P

Yesterday I discovered the terminology that is used by the US goverment for drug dealers, prpare yourself for laugh; "Narcoterrorists" :lol:. Terrorising all kinds of coca plants in South America :megalol:

 

I don't care which plane is good in combat, as the chances of me actually seeing it (or feeling the consequences) are almost zero. At the airshows however, judging from the vids posted all over the net, the Su-27, mig-29, Mirage-2000 and the F-18 do the most impressive shows.

[britgliderpilot]

Why the 22 was not yet tested in any air-combat exercise against the ef2k?

Are the Americans afraid or something?

BTW GG, Meteor ramjet owns all other air forces! :pilotfly:

PS. It is not wrong to be a patriot.:D

 

 

The Typhoon is only just barely in service, as is the Raptor - we haven't really got pilots properly trained in them yet. We're not in the business of flying preproduction fighters thousands of miles across very large expanses of ocean to play with our friends until the wrinkles have been ironed out, and the pilots properly trained ;)

 

 

Then we might see some kind of joint exercise.

I wouldn't expect to see the Typhoon come out on top - we don't have the stealth research the Americans have, and we don't have the money.

 

Against almost any other aircraft in the world now or in the immediate future (with the possible exception of the JSF/new AMRAAM at long range), I reckon it's more than good enough.

[britgliderpilot]

Someone mentioned the VISTA F-16, which I've never seen any video of flying, but certainly sounds the business . . . . . more impressive to me was the X-31.

 

 

 

If you can make a Flanker do THAT, I'd be properly impressed :)

[Stealth_HR]

Got a snippet off the Russian TV about the Su-37 pulling that same maneuver. Considering there are TVC-equipped regular Flankers, no doubt they can pull it off, too.

[nscode]

Yup... there's a video of it.. just find super_flenker.mpeg

 

You can even do it in a regular 27 if you spin at the end of the bell manouver, but you need more time/space

[Guest IguanaKing]

Guess the SU didn't have the money to do some "peacekeeping" all over the world, they've learned their lesson after Ghan. Not that I'm saying that Russia is less imperialistic than the US, but they didn't have the money to fly all over the world, attacking countries and thus shooting down planes.

 

A majority of the F-15s kills did not have an American pilot in the cockpit. ;)

 

Don't think Cope India will exist for long, as they will have a communist goverment in a few years :P

 

Maybe...but you should remember that India was a Soviet client state back in the days of the cold war. The US STILL installed some of its own systems in these Soviet aircraft, and even provided training to the aircrews. My dad was one of those avionics instructors. ;)

 

I don't care which plane is good in combat, as the chances of me actually seeing it (or feeling the consequences) are almost zero. At the airshows however, judging from the vids posted all over the net, the Su-27, mig-29, Mirage-2000 and the F-18 do the most impressive shows.

 

Agreed, and the combat aircraft is a VERY small piece in a larger puzzle of networked air and ground sensors. I hope we never see the day when VVS and US aircraft go against each other...that won't be a good thing.

[nscode]

Even if you're there, theres not much aircraft you can see, trust me.. just explosions.

[Force_Feedback]

How does an F-16 sound? What about the mig-29? And the F-117? What noise do they make when they go boom? Can you see the smoke trail from Dutch F-16s? What kind of thud does an UAV cause when it dives into the ground?

 

Seriousely now, if there ever was a war between the US and Russia, it won't be in equal numbers, considering the current, although improving, bad state of Russia's military.

 

I still don't know what the F-22 is for, sure, it created some tech for the F-35, but why have those things, when the F-35 can do the same thing, in greater numbers and almost as effective. Sure the JSF would get it's a** pounded at close range, but since the F-22 relies that much on "one shot one kill from uber distance without any kind of glitch" (aka wishful thinking), why not do it with the F-35?

Guess this is the same as with the modern F-16 and vanilla F-15C.

[Cobra360]

Speaking of the F-16 VISTA, there was also the Nasa F-15S/MTD which was fitted withh big canards based on the Hornets tailplane. It later became the F-15 ACTIVE which gave it -229s engines with TV nozzles able to vector in any direction like the MKI.

 

I would really like to see the ACTIVE in action.

 

 

[Pilotasso]

The Typhoon is only just barely in service, as is the Raptor - we haven't really got pilots properly trained in them yet. We're not in the business of flying preproduction fighters thousands of miles across very large expanses of ocean to play with our friends until the wrinkles have been ironed out, and the pilots properly trained ;)

 

Actualy the typhoons have already gone to US. I had a brief news report on that on aiforces monthly. I have no idea what they went there to do. It would be interesting to see it pitted against the Raptor.

[Guest IguanaKing]

I've seen the F-15 ACTIVE up-close when I was at Edwards. Very impressive machine. :D Never saw it in flight though.

[Cobra360]

I've seen the F-15 ACTIVE up-close when I was at Edwards. Very impressive machine. :D Never saw it in flight though.

 

Some people have all the luck. The ACTIVE does not fly anymore under that program. It's now part of a different test phase to test out a self teaching FBW computer systems that automatically reconfigure the fighter as if it has been damaged. I think it is still currently apart that. I read about it a year ago in New Scientist when I was in collage.

[Guest IguanaKing]

Heh...FBW is where I cut my teeth, almost literally. I used to go on test hops in Litton Aero Products' Merlin and Sabreliner when I was barely 10 years old, testing FBW systems. I even sat in the back seat and had rudimentary control over the aircraft with a small (HUGE by today's standards), wired, remote control. Serious business for APD, but an informative joy ride for me. :D

[Force_Feedback]

Heh...FBW is where I cut my teeth, almost literally. I used to go on test hops in Litton Aero Products' Merlin and Sabreliner when I was barely 10 years old, testing FBW systems. I even sat in the back seat and had rudimentary control over the aircraft with a small (HUGE by today's standards), wired, remote control. Serious business for APD, but an informative joy ride for me. :D

 

I've taxied a Mi-17 when I was eight for 5 minutes, the crew, and my dad had great fun watching me taxi the chopper (they did hold the second stick, and I was sitting on my dad's lap (no pedals for me, couldn't reach them :P). They even let me squeeze the trigger, and told me that it was used to fire rockets, I pulled, but to my disappointment there were no fireworks.

They let me control it while hovering above the taxiway, but, again, with supervision, and a second crewmember was holding the other stick, it was really interesting to see the ground move forward when you push on the stick.

That was one of the most "w00test" days of my life, controlling a real military chopper. What I remember after that was that some of my dads friends died a few weeks from my flight, while practicing an airshow routine, I remember explaining it to my mom that it was because they were flying behind eachother, then the forward chopper decellerated, and the rear one climbed above it, to avoid a collision, but it "overshot" the front chopper, placing it directly above the leading one. Because the second chopper was slowing down as well, the helos ended up above eachother...

 

 

I remember a eurofighter featured semi-sim, in wich you had those self-repairing FCS, the AI was so dumb, and they even ejected after they lost a piece of the rollerons, I remember seeing the inner workings of my wing, and still making it back to base. And, even if you ejected on finals, it would take like 30 minutes for the SAR to find you :P

[Guest IguanaKing]

Cool story, Force. This is the kind of stuff I LOVE to read...the childhood experiences that gave many of us the aviation bug. :D

 

BTW...not sure if it was part of 1.12, but my wingnut no longer panics and shoots his load when fired upon. That's good work, ED.

[nscode]

How does an F-16 sound? What about the mig-29? And the F-117? What noise do they make when they go boom? Can you see the smoke trail from Dutch F-16s? What kind of thud does an UAV cause when it dives into the ground?

I forgot how a 29 sounds.. only seen it once in flight and they don't do it (fly) any more :( I mosly get 21s over me, but even that is rare now.

 

As for the F-16 - it's hard to say. They always sound muffeld as they are high and always in numbers. And F-117.. you could maybe hear it, but it's also never alone and it's neigbours are much louder. The smoke? You meen black smoke or condens? They usually fly just below condensation altitude, so you get a nice white arc when they loop for sam avoidance