Warthog Stiction

[dburne]

Hey gang,

 

So now that I have much more time available for flight simming, and getting much more into the ED sims - namely the Ka-50 at this time, one thing I am really starting to notice is the stiction in the Warthog joystick.

I really notice it when trying to line up the two small concentric circles for aiming the rockets. Especially in the Y axis, I will get it very close and try to move the stick just a small amount, and inevitably end up moving it more than needed. Makes lining those two aiming circles up challenging at times to say the least.

 

I know I have seen threads in the past, where some guys have re-greased their Warthog joysticks. Curious if anyone has done it, do you find that it helps in the stiction aspect of the stick?

 

I went from a Cougar to the Warthog, I know the Cougar had this problem as well but I had modded mine with the U2 NXT gimbal mod, and man was that thing smooth. But I really like my Warthog, just wish I did not find myself fighting this stiction at times.

 

Anyway I would be curious to hear from guys that have done the re-grease thing. I am not sure I could handle doing it though, I know the wires are kind of easy to break from what I remember reading and I don't see as well as I used to either, so not sure I could even handle taking on something like this. But I definitely would not even consider attempting if it did not alleviate the stiction issue, so having said all this I may be best of just living with it...

 

Thanks for any feedback,

[Viersbovsky]

Did the re-greasing - did not help much. What helped was a stick extension (35cm). You don't feel any centering force anymore, but because of lever effect there is no noticeable stiction.

So this may be worth a try for you since you do not have to open the base to install an extension. Maybe with a very short extension (10cm?) you would still get centering force but also less stiction?

 

May I ask why one would move from the Cougar with such a mod to the Warthog? That modded gimbal looks like the non-plus-ultra to me, it even has hall-effect sensors if I remember correctly. What does the Hog have that the modded Cougar doesn't?

[dburne]

May I ask why one would move from the Cougar with such a mod to the Warthog? That modded gimbal looks like the non-plus-ultra to me, it even has hall-effect sensors if I remember correctly. What does the Hog have that the modded Cougar doesn't?

 

Thanks for the tip on the extension, along with the feedback on the re-greasing. Have thought about the extension in the past but not sure it would fit in my space so good. May have to look into that further.

 

To answer your question, you know I am not really sure. Guess I just wanted the latest, and I do really like the looks and feel of the Warthog.

 

Still have the Cougar, not only do I have the U2NXT gimball mod with hall sensors in it, but I also have the Hall Sensor in the Throttle as well , along with Cubby's anti-stiction tape for the TQS. That throttle is smooth as a baby's butt lol. Also have a spare Cougar throttle I picked up from a guy on Ebay who was selling his, and I put a hall sensor and anti stiction tape in it as well, just to have a spare if needed.

[Vampr]

Did the re-greasing - did not help much. What helped was a stick extension (35cm). You don't feel any centering force anymore, but because of lever effect there is no noticeable stiction.

So this may be worth a try for you since you do not have to open the base to install an extension. Maybe with a very short extension (10cm?) you would still get centering force but also less stiction?

 

May I ask why one would move from the Cougar with such a mod to the Warthog? That modded gimbal looks like the non-plus-ultra to me, it even has hall-effect sensors if I remember correctly. What does the Hog have that the modded Cougar doesn't?

 

I was wondering the same thing myself. I have both the Cougar and the Warthog and really like the Cougar better. The factory gimbal is horrible in the Cougar, which is why I bought the Warthog. If I had a modded NXT Cougar, I'd use it over a Warthog every time. The only complaint I have with the Cougar is old firmware.. I'm currently in the process of doing a NXT style mod on my Cougar gimbal and will park the Warthog when it's done.

[Harle]

Same here. Regreasing didn't yield a satisfactory result for me. I changed the base mechanism altogether to a full-metal one (picrelated). But I do believe that an extention will be a good solution.

Edited November 7, 2015 by Harle

[some1]

Greasing cures the sticktion for me, although I have to repeat it every few months. You either use wrong grease or apply it in the wrong places. This has been discussed a lot on this forum in the other threads . I use teflon-silicon grease and apply it on the 4 shafts with little springs, rubber disc the part that goes up and on those shafts, and inside the ball joint (not every time).

Edited November 7, 2015 by some1

[Lausbub78]

My Stick had a lot of sticktion too, after opening it I found out why....there was no grease in it,and the bit that was has been dried out. I regreased it and it got a bit better. Some months later I had to regrease it again and thats been 3 years ago. Never bothered to do it again. Not because it's sticktion free now but because I didn't want to go through it every few weeks or months. I'm using a 10cm Extension ,helps to not notice the sticktion as much.

Hope to get one of those upcoming new VKB Joysticks soon,then I will retire the Warthog Stick.

[dburne]

Thanks for the feedback gang.

Just not sure I want to go the re-greasing route, especially as I can not see as good as I used to.

 

I may have to consider getting a 10cm extension, even if it helps a little it would be nice. Just need to make sure I have the room to be able to operate it with my gear here. The wife already thinks I am a little wacky with the equipment I have now, can imagine the looks I will get with the extension and that thing sitting between my legs lol.

[Viersbovsky]

Another solution would be to attach the Warthog grip to the Cougar base. That way you will get the feel of the WH grip and the smoothness of the Nxt gimbal.

 

The additional precision of the WH is pretty much worthless anyway due to the stiction.

[Harle]

Thanks for the feedback gang.

Just not sure I want to go the re-greasing route, especially as I can not see as good as I used to.

 

I may have to consider getting a 10cm extension, even if it helps a little it would be nice. Just need to make sure I have the room to be able to operate it with my gear here. The wife already thinks I am a little wacky with the equipment I have now, can imagine the looks I will get with the extension and that thing sitting between my legs lol.

 

No wife, no problem :smilewink:

[jcbak]

I used silicone spray on the four small poles that the flange/disc moves up and down on. I tried silicone grease but it wasn't as effective. The spray worked great for me and two others that I suggested it to. I now use a 7.5 cm extension so I'm not anticipating a re-spray anytime soon. The extension wasn't nt purchased to eliminate sticktion. I do HIGHLY recommend an extension though.

[dburne]

I used silicone spray on the four small poles that the flange/disc moves up and down on. I tried silicone grease but it wasn't as effective. The spray worked great for me and two others that I suggested it to. I now use a 7.5 cm extension so I'm not anticipating a re-spray anytime soon. The extension wasn't nt purchased to eliminate sticktion. I do HIGHLY recommend an extension though.

 

Was just doing the spray very difficult?

 

Also out of curiosity, where are you guys getting these extensions from? I looked around the forum and do not really see any info on them. I know I have seen it in the past but not sure where.

 

Thanks,

[Viersbovsky]

Also out of curiosity, where are you guys getting these extensions from? I looked around the forum and do not really see any info on them. I know I have seen it in the past but not sure where.

 

Gardena hose adapter plus PVC-pipes. Purely DIY on my part.

[mugen]

...

Also out of curiosity, where are you guys getting these extensions from? I looked around the forum and do not really see any info on them. I know I have seen it in the past but not sure where.

 

Thanks,

 

Hi dburne,

 

take look over here:

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=121242

or

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=120997

 

greez mugen

[dburne]

Thanks for the links mugen!

Those shorter extensions certainly look interesting, maybe even allowing me to continue to use on my desk - but not sure about comfort in doing so either.

I wonder how much they help??

[Endy]

I bought a 7,5cm extension from Sahaj and am very happy about it. Good quality and cable cut to proper length so no problem with installation.

 

It definately helps with sticktion because you don't need as much force to move the stick andthe added benefit is stick precision due to it being longer and dogfighting no longer resembles and arm wrestling match :)

 

If you fly jets, I would go for 7,5 or 10cm extension, with longer ones only for dedicated prop plane and heli flying.

 

BUT, I would not use it with a desk setup. I currently have the stick in central position like in A10 for example and that seems to work best with extended sticks. But you would need to have it placed on something so that it's on proper height, some kind of stand etc. Having it on the desk, especially extended won't work because you'll need to have to keep your arm high all the time and will tire easily and won't be comfortable.

[dburne]

Thanks, yeah I was more curious about those shorter extensions by the other guy, like the 80mm. Wondering how much they might help...

[Endy]

Well, I can only tell you that a 7,5 cm does help, and it's a significant difference, which I am happy about. Helps with stiction which is much less noticeable, and even if the stick jumps a bit bedcause you use less force, it will not affect the plane so much because the stick is longer and stick movement translates to more gentle plane moves. And like I said, overall flying feeling is more pleasant because the stick feels smoother and you don't need as much force to move it.

 

It's difficult to describe in words, but remember, the longer you go, the lighter the stick will feel but you'll also lose more centerin force, so it's a preference thing. 7,5 cm suits me fine, and perhaps 10cm would be ok, but linger than that may feel too light for me.

[dburne]

Ok thanks for the information Endy. That may be the way I should go, just unsure of how I can make it work with my setup here.

I will have to mull all this over for a bit.

I would like to do something to make the Warthog stick a little smoother in movement for sure, I sure do notice it now that I am learning to fly the Ka-50...

[Endy]

Take a look at his site, there are some reviews and setups as well: http://warthog-extensions-by-sahaj.com/blog/

[Lausbub78]

You also have to consider the throw of the Stick. I find 10cm are perfect,l personally wouldn't use a longer one than 12cm. In any case, even a 7,5cm one will make a significant difference. The longer the extension is the more stress will be put on the Gimbal and the risk to break it may get higher if you aren't carefull. Slamming to the boundaries of the stick isn't adviced with any length of extension anyway. Occasionally it will do no harm though,I'm using my extension for over 3 Years and I'm sometimes a bit rough I have to admit. Never had any broken parts yet (Fingers crossed^^)

 

A Stick with extension is a bit different in use,you will have to use the whole arm to control,not just the hand. I only can recommend extensions of any length,wonder why Thrustmaster doesn't offer one by themselves as in my opinion the Warthog,or the Cougar, are made for it.

[dburne]

Thanks for the feedback guys, I appreciate it.

Going to have to give this some careful thought, I am curious about the other guy's shorter extensions, like the 80 mm. Not sure how much improvement though I might see in something like that, or how feasible it might be to use on my desk.

 

My Warthog stick does sit on a slide out flat panel in my desk, which sits below the desktop by maybe 2 to 2.5 inches. Actually my desk has the same slide out panel on the left side as well, which I have my throttle sitting on. One of the main reasons I wanted this desk was for that.

[Endy]

Having a desk setup like that would be uncomfortable I think. You can sort of measure it, just add the appropriate height to the current stick and see where your hand would be at. Having it up somewhere is not really ideal... So I'd consider switching to some kind of central stick position like in a lot of planes.

[jvanhoog]

I was fighting the stiction prob as well, 10cm extension is like night and day for helo's. I think I will do some work to the gimbal as well, but get an extension you will wonder how you ever flew without it!

[jcbak]

Was just doing the spray very difficult?

 

Also out of curiosity, where are you guys getting these extensions from? I looked around the forum and do not really see any info on them. I know I have seen it in the past but not sure where.

 

Thanks,

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xwarthog+extensions.TRS0&_nkw=warthog+extensions&_sacat=0