A2A reefeulling difficulties

[AG-51_Razor]

Awesome video Johnny! Thanks. I think I heard you say something about a "formation bug". Is that peculiar to the Mirage? I have been flying the Mod for the F/A-18C for quite a while now and have had very few problems with the AAR after getting it figured out, but this Mirage is kicking my ass!! I don't know if I can blame it on a "formation bug" but that would make me feel a lot better. :megalol:

 

I am having a huge problem with overcontrolling, mostly in the verticle. Are you using any curve in your joystick axis??

[xxJohnxx]

Awesome video Johnny! Thanks. I think I heard you say something about a "formation bug". Is that peculiar to the Mirage?

 

If we are talking about the tanker speeding up, then yes, that seems to be a Mirage specific problem!

 

I am having a huge problem with overcontrolling, mostly in the verticle. Are you using any curve in your joystick axis??

 

I had to add a curve of 10 for all axis to make refuelling a bit easier. Don't like it, however without a curve it was way harder. :joystick:

[PiedDroit]

I don't really get what's so difficult but okay

You're the best, we know, thanks, that's very helpful.

 

Maybe that helps out a bit:

Will check that out, thanks. How to feel the movement of the aircraft is unfortunately difficult to get from a video.

[Kreye]

I don't really get what's so difficult but okay

 

I actually didn't have problems aswell. After 1-2 tries i felt pretty confident while refueling whilst my buddy is having a hard time. Which is weird to me since hes a really good pilot and never had any problems refueling any aircraft.

 

I guess it's mostly the feeling you have for a certain plane and what suites you best. Some people are more comfortable with the way the A-10 handles and some have the Mirages snappiness coming in pretty handy...

 

:joystick:

[smnwrx]

For an added challenge, put the tanker in an orbit.

[Rlaxoxo]

I actually didn't have problems aswell. After 1-2 tries i felt pretty confident while refueling whilst my buddy is having a hard time. Which is weird to me since hes a really good pilot and never had any problems refueling any aircraft.

 

I guess it's mostly the feeling you have for a certain plane and what suites you best. Some people are more comfortable with the way the A-10 handles and some have the Mirages snappiness coming in pretty handy...

 

:joystick:

 

I think it all comes down to confidence, If you believe it's hard and can't do it you won't be able to do anything

[FSKRipper]

If we are talking about the tanker speeding up, then yes, that seems to be a Mirage specific problem!

 

I am having a huge problem with overcontrolling, mostly in the verticle. Are you using any curve in your joystick axis??

 

I had to add a curve of 10 for all axis to make refuelling a bit easier. Don't like it, however without a curve it was way harder. :joystick:

 

Hey John, would you be so kind to post the mission you used for your video? I have tried several approaches to deal with the tanker speed up and it would be nice to see your settings.

 

What I have done so far:

 

1. Tanker at 300kts (actually flying 241kts) going into Orbit mode with 300kts (241kts). When cleared contact he accelerates to more than 350kts. I have done it with the S-3, IL-78 and KC-135.

 

2. Tanker at 300kts (actually flying 241kts) flying from WP1 to WP2 with the command to switch back to WP 1 (like in Rlaxoxo's design). Same behaviour like above when cleared for contact...

 

Speeds were set to 300kts fixed in the normal waypoint options and under advanced options where possible.

[YoYo]

Finally! GOT it! 3 times in a row from 50 to 100% of tanks. What is the case my difficulties?

Curves! I had in DCS for Mirage death zone = 1% and curves for X and Y = 10%. I noticed that my movements of joystick are delayed so the tanker always jums few feets - I deleted it, back to default 0% and it works as I need so my advice do not touch curves for Mirage!

 

[PiedDroit]

Finally! GOT it! 3 times in a row from 50 to 100% of tanks. What is the case my difficulties?

Curves! I had in DCS for Mirage death zone = 1% and curves for X and Y = 10%. I noticed that my movements of joystick are delayed so the tanker always jums few feets - I deleted it, back to default 0% and it works as I need so my advice do not touch curves for Mirage!

I will try again with 0 curve to see if I get less over correction then :thumbup:.

I was using 10 at the moment without much luck.

 

Like FSKRipper, I'm quite interested to know xxJohnxx's setup for the tanker.

[YoYo]

Ok, after modified curves! I join the authors of films about AtoA. ;>

 

Enjoy.

 

[ame]

[/ame]

[mr_mojo97]

Nice one, YoYo. I too am also really getting he hang of A2A refuelling (not managed a full load though yet) In my case I use a nine inch extension to my warthog so it's a case of just getting used to a touch in each direction and throttle management. And 0 curves as usual. Making sure that when you first get pre contact you speed up with the Viking accordingly is also important as it gives you more time. Actually is there a way to stop the tanker asking you to pre contact again? So you can keep trying without the need to keep slowing down and speeding up?

[ac5]

This is so difficult.

1. How do you switch off the landing gear alarm?

2. When I make precontact the S-3 goes from 220 to 350 knots so by the time I've caught up again to try and dock with the probe I get a warning to pre-contact again then the S-3 slows back down to 220 again making me overshoot by a mile! On so it goes on and on. Never have managed to get put the thing in the thing.

 

I was fine with the A-10C

 

Any help and tips please. Ta

It seems impossible, or at least there is no keyboard assignment to switch off the landing gear alarm in the Mirage. Odd, becouse in the A-10C, Sabre and P-51 there is.

 

Anyway, I have greatly reduced the volume of this wav file:

 

G:\Games\DCS World 2\Mods\aircraft\M-2000C\Sounds\Effects\Gear_Warning.wav

 

Problem solved. Not so the sudden acceleration of the tanker.

[PiedDroit]

It seems impossible, or at least there is no keyboard assignment to switch off the landing gear alarm in the Mirage. Odd, becouse in the A-10C, Sabre and P-51 there is.

 

Anyway, I have greatly reduced the volume of this wav file:

 

G:\Games\DCS World 2\Mods\aircraft\M-2000C\Sounds\Effects\Gear_Warning.wav

 

Problem solved. Not so the sudden acceleration of the tanker.

 

you can mitigate the tanker speed problem by forcing it to cruise and orbit faster.

Overall speed should be much faster than with A-10C (this will fix your alarm issue)

[Azrayen]

Ok, after modified curves! I join the authors of films about AtoA.

Nice :)

What about switching the radar to standby (SIL) while you're there?

That's nicer to the tanker crew ;)

 

Overall speed should be much faster than with A-10C (this will fix your alarm issue)

+1

[Charly_Owl]

I think it all comes down to confidence, If you believe it's hard and can't do it you won't be able to do anything

 

I think you misspelled "training".

[Rlaxoxo]

It seems impossible, or at least there is no keyboard assignment to switch off the landing gear alarm in the Mirage. Odd, becouse in the A-10C, Sabre and P-51 there is.

 

Anyway, I have greatly reduced the volume of this wav file:

 

G:\Games\DCS World 2\Mods\aircraft\M-2000C\Sounds\Effects\Gear_Warning.wav

 

Problem solved. Not so the sudden acceleration of the tanker.

 

No need to modify the file

 

Just go to: G:\Games\DCS World 2\Mods\aircraft\M-2000C\Sounds\sdef\Gear_Warning.sdef

 

Open it with notepad++

 

and add

 

"Gain 0"

 

and it will mute the sound, or you can put "Gain 0.01 - 1" in case you want to still hear the sound just chose something like 0.54 for example

[bzhnono]

Can you share tour training A2A refueling missions ?

 

thanks !

[YoYo]

Can you share tour training A2A refueling missions ?

 

thanks !

 

 

Here is my ( http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2696005&postcount=35 ), for NTTR: https://www.sendspace.com/file/yqu17o

 

Put in C:\Users\Name of User\Saved Games\DCS.openalpha\Missions

[bzhnono]

Thanks :notworthy:

[xxJohnxx]

That's the mission I used on my video, if anyone is interested:

 

http://www.blumen-huschle.at/John/Videos/Mirage2000-AAR.miz

[FSKRipper]

That's the mission I used on my video, if anyone is interested:

 

http://www.blumen-huschle.at/John/Videos/Mirage2000-AAR.miz

 

Thanks, will take a look as soon as I'm home.

[PiedDroit]

That's the mission I used on my video, if anyone is interested:

 

http://www.blumen-huschle.at/John/Videos/Mirage2000-AAR.miz

Cool, thanks!

BTW I managed to do the full transfer several times (with 5-10 contacts :music_whistling:) but it's getting better, I even managed to make it once in one gulp on last attempt (5th of the day, arms aching).

I tried to make a track but everytime the replay is corrupted :(

 

To other learners, what really made it work for me is the FPM and the energy carets.

When going for contact with the basket, make sure the A/C is on the tanker's path (i.e. not drifting left or right), with FPM on the horizon and small speed difference (2-3 knots, i.e. walking speed). Anything outside those parameters will make it difficult to maintain contact (catching the basket is only half of the job).

Focus on keeping the FPM on the horizon, use FPM and energy carets to make very small adjustements in altitude, bank and speed.

To help maintaining contact, find a visual reference that will help you maintain good position (e.g. keep the tanker's engine on a certain portion of the basket) - but don't forget the focus should be on the FPM.

 

Curve are 0, HOTAS WH, feet off the rudder.

I also put the FBW gains in CHARGES (STORES) mode, to get a less snappy plane.

 

P.S.: One thing I *think* is modelled is that the drag of the basket is transferred to your aircraft and takes away the extra few knots you had in excess. So don't back away the throttle immediately after connection.

Happy refuels!

Edited March 1, 2016 by PiedDroit

[ac5]

Hi...

 

FPM and the energy carets?

 

What is this?

[Voodooflies]

Hi...

 

FPM and the energy carets?

 

What is this?

 

Read the manual. :thumbup:

[ac5]

Well, thank you very much...

Better no help than this help...