Colliding with own bombs during a divebombing attack, bug?

[razo+r]

I think it is a sort of special bug, with those bombs flying through planes, but here is my explanation: As long as a bomb is not fuzed, it behaves like a texture with flight model physics, so it can float through anything, same goes why jettisoned bombs fall through the ground until it reached 0m/ft a.s.l.

 

But his is my explanation and is only correct under certain circumstances...

[Bogey Jammer]

And as I said several times, the moment of release has 0.1 G, then shortly after that a -0.9G spike happens which is due to lazy script coding on the developer's side that does not account for the gravitational situation at this point. If i pull positive G and release 3 tons of bombs, which accounts for roughly 25% of the plane's current mass, then it would reinforce the positive G, and not cause a negative G spike, because my positive G pulling now got a lot easier because of 3 tons of mass having detached from the plane.

 

After release, there was a small and sudden pitch downwards, causing the negative G spike. Which physically would not make sense. Because if I am in a slight upwards pitch (+0.1 G) then releasing 3 tons of mass from the plane the positive G should increase with the stick in the same position.

 

Ahh I finally understand your point. The discussion becomes interesting :). This might be a bug indeed. Now to be sure, it has to be repeatable.

 

I always release at 1.0g on steep dives, it is the way I have always done it, anything below is increasing the risk of hitting your own bombs.

 

I neutralise the stick, and walk on to the target.

 

I don't think you read 1G in such case. Speed acceleration during a steep dive and keeping a rectilinear trajectory until bomb release = gravity force absorption = G < 1

Edited September 28, 2016 by Bogey Jammer

[BIGNEWY]

I don't think you read 1G in such case. Speed acceleration during a steep dive and keeping a rectilinear trajectory until bomb release = gravity force absorption = G < 1

 

from my tacview after some bomb practice

 

[AJaromir]

Thank you, bigenvy. I had the same idea but you was faster. I am aware that he's just trolling. hard to know where is truth.

I write it for the last time. In situation in your video: G=1 NO ACCELERATING to the ground. G>1 SLOWING to the ground G<1 ACCELERATING to the ground. G=0 ->weightlessness (accelerating in vaacuum, but the bomb was not in vacuum so it was accelerating slower than your aircraft because it has engine making thrust and better aerodynamics) But this applies only for this case because G is mark of the gravitational force. In aviation it means how many times the force perpendicular to the longitudinal axis of the aircraft is bigger than the gravitational force. So when the G=1 then forces on aircraft are the same as the gravitational force. When the G<1 they are less than gravitational force and when the G>1, they are bigger than gravitational force. And do not forget 0.1<1

BTW if you want to go to physical details if the wing could be ripped or not, learn all Newton's physical laws (they are 3 in total) and other kinetic laws 1st.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newton%27s_laws_of_motion

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinetic_energy

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potential_energy

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechanical_energy

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Momentum

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acceleration

..........

 

Then, The law of conservation of momentum, The law of conservation of energy, The law of conservation of angular momentum, composition of forces, counting speed, and something about material flexural strength, Torsional strength, tensile strength, compressive strength and Shear strength.

 

HAND Doc. Ing. Spacehamster Ph.D.

Edited September 28, 2016 by AJaromir

[Dr_Arrow]

After release, there was a small and sudden pitch downwards, causing the negative G spike. Which physically would not make sense. Because if I am in a slight upwards pitch (+0.1 G) then releasing 3 tons of mass from the plane the positive G should increase with the stick in the same position.

 

+0.1 G is certainly not slight upward pitch...You do not seem to have a slightest idea what that G represents. I think you should study mr. Newton's laws kinematics and dynamics of flight in order to understand what you did wrong.

 

Anyway I know about a pilot who unloaded his aircraft with bombs in level flight during practice flight to some 0.8G and it nearly cost him his career as he was all set to fly a desk.

[SkateZilla]

After release, there was a small and sudden pitch downwards, causing the negative G spike. Which physically would not make sense. Because if I am in a slight upwards pitch (+0.1 G) then releasing 3 tons of mass from the plane the positive G should increase with the stick in the same position.

 

5 Bombs Do not Equal 6000lbs Sorry.

 

Pitchup from weight departure wont happen with the Horizontal Stabilizers Pitching Down.

 

The ONLY Bug, is the Bombs Collision Model Not interacting with the Aircraft at the time of release.

 

For the Umpteenth time,

 

ZERO POINT ONE POSITIVE Gs IS NOT AN UPWARDS PITCH,

 

Your Increasing Negative AoA Value

Your Increasing Pitch Angle Value

The Position of your Horizontal Stabilizers

The Position of your flight stick in the controls indicator,

 

ALL say you were in a negative Slope, which is the ONLY reason the Bombs went on a separate track through your aircraft.

 

There was a Slight bump, but this is equivalent of maybe a stick shift from your hand position to press the release button depending on Controller.

 

 

As for Bombs Sitting on the Rails Until Negative Slope Fades, The Kick from the Foot would have sent the bombs off the pylon regardless

 

Edited September 28, 2016 by SkateZilla

[GGTharos]

AGARDograph No.300 Vol.5

STORE SEPARATION FLIGHT TESTING

Although store-to-rack/pylon collisions are obviously also collisions with the aircraft, they

have been broken out separately to distinguish them from those in this section. Store-to-aircraft

collisions, as used here, involve collisions after release of the store with other parts of the aircraft

such as wings, fuselage, or empennage. Collisions of this type are by far the most serious from an

aircraft safety standpoint. Since they occur at some time and distance from the initial point of

release, the stores are moving rapidly, and their mass, impacting the aircraft at high energy and high

speeds, can cause serious aircraft damage.

 

....

 

This condition was initially aggravated by the stores being released in a high

dive angle (sixty degrees) at low "g", further reducing the effective ejection force.

 

 

This message was brought to you by feathertouch bomb separations.

[Bogey Jammer]

from my tacview after some bomb practice

 

OK, even though it was quite hard to see that your trajectory isn't actually rectilinear but stlightly curved upwards.

If the dive angle is 45°, the speed is constant and trajectory is rectilinear, the G-meter reads 0.71G. Because the gravity is normal to the earth surface, and the G-meter reads the force normal to the aircraft's "wing plan", independently to its attitude.

 

That may look pedant, but telling «never go below 1G or you're blown» is exaggerated and misleading because this figure already takes in account safety margins from regulations. That margin is likely to depend on the bomb's ability to keep itself in the air. Like the aircraft, the curvature of the trajectory, the dive angle and the speed acceleration affects the perpendicular G acceleration we are talking about.

[AJaromir]

Bogey. That is not true. There is no dependency on attitude. If the aircraft speed and vector is not changing, then the all forces are balanced and there is no acceleratolion. So you can not read something else than 1G.

In the last tacwiev video u can see that he after bomb release instantly pulled G. That is why he did not fly straight.

Edit : Of course I mean speed and vector relative to the ground. Not indicated airspeed.

Edited September 29, 2016 by AJaromir

[Dr_Arrow]

Bogey. That is not true. There is no dependency on attitude. If the aircraft speed and vector is not changing, then the all forces are balanced and there is no acceleratolion. So you can not read something else than 1G.

In the last tacwiev video u can see that he after bomb release instantly pulled G. That is why he did not fly straight.

Edit : Of course I mean speed and vector relative to the ground. Not indicated airspeed.

 

I think, it is true what Bogey says, regarding the accelerometer which is placed in cockpit area and measures the acceleration component in body-frame axis, therefore its measurement dependent on attitude.

 

Illustrated here:

http://tom.pycke.be/mav/69/accelerometer-to-attitude

[AJaromir]

Yeah, that should be right. I made a mistake. (which I should not make as the proffesional technician of automatic measuring and control systems) But his G meter shows near 0 (at bomb release point it is -0,4), which is far under any safe limits. His vertical acceleration was simply faster than the bomb's was. I can calculate it quite accurate. But I am too busy to do it now.

Edited September 29, 2016 by AJaromir

[Bogey Jammer]

If the aircraft speed and vector is not changing, then the all forces are balanced and there is no acceleratolion.

 

We perfectly agree on this.

 

So you can not read something else than 1G.

 

No. Like I said, The G-meter shows an acceleration value along the normal of the wing plan, in other words, it is the same forces as what are applied on the pilot's ass. If the aircraft is diving at -90° or climbing at +90°, it shows 0G, the pilot feels nothing in his ass, but they are rather felt in the back or straps. Dr_Arrow's illustration shows perfectly what it is about. During uniform movement, the G-meter can show 1G only if the aircraft is flying perfectly horizontally.

 

In the last tacwiev video u can see that he after bomb release instantly pulled G. That is why he did not fly straight.

 

It was the case both after bomb release (indeed) AND before.

Edited September 29, 2016 by Bogey Jammer

[Gliptal]

+0.1 G is certainly not slight upward pitch...You do not seem to have a slightest idea what that G represents. I think you should study mr. Newton's laws kinematics and dynamics of flight in order to understand what you did wrong.

 

Anyway I know about a pilot who unloaded his aircraft with bombs in level flight during practice flight to some 0.8G and it nearly cost him his career as he was all set to fly a desk.

Hopefully they gave him another chance?

[Dr_Arrow]

Hopefully they gave him another chance?

 

Yes he continued, but it was thoroughly investigated, bulletin was issued, so it was pretty serious for a relatively minor error.