bobd Posted January 14, 2018 Posted January 14, 2018 Saw some discussion on this, but can't remember where. Can this really happen? Asus ROG Z390, I9 9900K , 32 GB DDR4, EVGA GTX 2080 Ti , Win10 64, Rift CV1 & S VR
razo+r Posted January 14, 2018 Posted January 14, 2018 Yes. Especially the SA-15, which is designed with taking down missiles in mind.
Rex854Warrior Posted January 14, 2018 Posted January 14, 2018 Yes. Especially the SA-15, which is designed with taking down missiles in mind. With such a low RCS for the 122, it would unlikely be able to shoot it down. A maverick or an MPU surely even bombs but an AIM-9 ? [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
GGTharos Posted January 14, 2018 Posted January 14, 2018 Try doing the math for detection range based on it's RCS, see if you're correct. I suspect you won't be. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
razo+r Posted January 15, 2018 Posted January 15, 2018 (edited) Try doing the math for detection range based on it's RCS, see if you're correct. I suspect you won't be. The question is "Can it happen" and not "will it always happen" In addition, it's DCS. Everything is possible, even a MiG-21 with 140km detection range... Edited January 15, 2018 by razo+r
razo+r Posted January 15, 2018 Posted January 15, 2018 I did a test with a SA-15 as a target and a Harrier carrying two sidearms attacking the SA-15. First test was with a human. The missile won't show up on the SR, but you can intercept it. Second test was with an AI. The SA-15 successfully intercepts the Sidearm before it reaches the SAM.
Kang Posted January 15, 2018 Posted January 15, 2018 In other words it's the old problem of all-seeing AI?
Rex854Warrior Posted January 15, 2018 Posted January 15, 2018 (edited) Try doing the math for detection range based on it's RCS, see if you're correct. I suspect you won't be. Alot easier said then done. We are missing quite alot of information. Edited January 15, 2018 by Rex854Warrior [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
GGTharos Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 Very easily done with relatively low probability of error actually. To put another way, you'll pick up at stealth fighter within say, 6-10nm ... the sidewinder's RCS is larger than that - it has no RCS reduction features at all. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
Guest Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 The missile won't show up on the SR, but you can intercept it. What does it mean that you can intercept it? How is it done if no return on the screen? SOrry, I dont have CA to try.
Majinbot Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 Anyway there's an option for all the SAMs in the mission editor where you can deactivate: intercept incoming missiles PC: i7-13700K - Gigabyte RTX 5080 GAMING OC - 64GB DDR5 6400 - VPC MongoosT-50CM3 - VKB GF pro - MFG Crosswind - Msi MPG321UR-QD + LG OLED 32GS95UE - TrackIR5 - Quest 3
razo+r Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 What does it mean that you can intercept it? How is it done if no return on the screen? SOrry, I dont have CA to try. As you can see in my pictures, there is only a square on the SR, which is the AV-8B. A missile would be indicated by a circle. The only way to lock a missile which is not on the SR is by always keep an eye on the target and look out for a missile trail.
Guest Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 As you can see in my pictures, there is only a square on the SR, which is the AV-8B. A missile would be indicated by a circle. The only way to lock a missile which is not on the SR is by always keep an eye on the target and look out for a missile trail. But how do you lock it when spotting the trail?
firmek Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 I did a test with a SA-15 as a target and a Harrier carrying two sidearms attacking the SA-15. First test was with a human. The missile won't show up on the SR, but you can intercept it. Second test was with an AI. The SA-15 successfully intercepts the Sidearm before it reaches the SAM. But this only proves that the CA and AI modes don't work the same. It doesn't tell which one is actually correct. F/A-18, F-16, F-14, M-2000C, A-10C, AV-8B, AJS-37 Viggen, F-5E-3, F-86F, MiG-21bis, MiG-15bis, L-39 Albatros, C-101 Aviojet, P-51D, Spitfire LF Mk. IX, Bf 109 4-K, UH-1H, Mi-8, Ka-50, NTTR, Normandy, Persian Gulf... and not enough time to fully enjoy it all
razo+r Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 But how do you lock it when spotting the trail? With the tracking radar..
razo+r Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 But this only proves that the CA and AI modes don't work the same. It doesn't tell which one is actually correct. This proves that the missiles can get shot down in DCS, AGM-122 included. If this is realistic or not should be for another thread.
Guest Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 With the tracking radar.. Ok, I see have much to learn in regards of ground units. You have a track radar besides the search one in CA?
razo+r Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 Ok, I see have much to learn in regards of ground units. You have a track radar besides the search one in CA? Yes. You have on the top left this search radar and another one for locking the targets. But only if the vehicle features this. In a shilka, you have only the track radar. If this is real or not, idk.
Guest Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 Yes. You have on the top left this search radar and another one for locking the targets. But only if the vehicle features this. In a shilka, you have only the track radar. If this is real or not, idk.Thanks. What unit was the one on your ss? There is only SR Enviado desde mi Moto Z Play mediante Tapatalk
razo+r Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 It was the SA-15. You can see the symbology for tracking around the target which are on my screenshot four red ^ around the middle, more or less where my + was looking at.
Rex854Warrior Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 (edited) Very easily done with relatively low probability of error actually. To put another way, you'll pick up at stealth fighter within say, 6-10nm ... the sidewinder's RCS is larger than that - it has no RCS reduction features at all. I'd love to know how you estimated those results, i couldn't find alot of technical data on the Search radar and tracking radar of the Tor M1 (radar equation might be overkill for this purpose but more precise). Edited January 16, 2018 by Rex854Warrior [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
GGTharos Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 There's actually an engagement diagram somewhere but I don't have it handy. Radar equation is appropriate and you can find a calculator for it online. Even if you just guess at the TOR using a 1kw system and the missile having a 0.1 RCS you'll probably get a reasonable ball park. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
Hook47 Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 I wouldn't be surprised if the TOR could intercept the AGM 122. In my experience with the U.S. Army's FireFinder Radar, we can track a single round fired by OPFOR Arty up to about 20km. That being said the FireFinder is small and high mobility, but I can't get into specifics since the latest versions of the radar are classified. The radar on something like the TOR is probably notably more powerful than something like the FireFinder. Either way it's pretty amazing what radar can do.
Kang Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 You can shoot it down by aiming the guns visually.
SinusoidDelta Posted January 20, 2018 Posted January 20, 2018 There's actually an engagement diagram somewhere but I don't have it handy. Radar equation is appropriate and you can find a calculator for it online. Even if you just guess at the TOR using a 1kw system and the missile having a 0.1 RCS you'll probably get a reasonable ball park. Is it this document by chance?
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