Kev2go Posted February 20, 2021 Author Share Posted February 20, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, mayo25 said: All the F-5E used by the Navy ( Marines ) don t have a radar. Only those bought from Swiss are equipped. Same manual states that there are ( or were given its dated 2006 ) radar equipped models operated of the F5E/F. A chart has symbols various F5 models and what features they have for I for installed, S for some, and N for none. In the above example which F5E/F were fitted radar, S for some with older APQ 153 radar, rather than APQ 159 which isnt fitted in USN/USMC F5E's, but is in some F5F's Yes the F5E's bought from Swiss got designation of F5N. Then again when F5E was being made What Belsimtek had marketed the F5E specifically being a USAF based aggressor model. Which as i pointed out, wouldn't be accurate as the USAF F5E's even until retirement never had RWR or Countermeasures suite. 2 hours ago, Paganus said: None of them are virgins. They have all been around the block and had stuff done to them before they get sold again. My point is, even if ED's isn't a perfect representation of one that is flying, or has flown, it fits the mold in that it isn't a perfect match to any manual. It's inherent imperfectness makes it perfect. ED didnt make it Belsimtek did. ANd yet the F16 and F/A18 hornet are actually a specific models.Those are the standards they set. But by all means engage in mental gymnastics to rationalize F5E as accurate enough. Ah well guess we will have to wait for DCS F5E II, a paid update to get correct F5 model, which should have been from day 1. Edited February 20, 2021 by Kev2go Build: Windows 10 64 bit Pro Case/Tower: Corsair Graphite 760tm ,Asus Strix Z790 Motherboard, Intel Core i7 12700k ,Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 64gb ram (3600 mhz) , (Asus strix oc edition) Nvidia RTX 3080 12gb , Evga g2 850 watt psu, Hardrives ; Samsung 970 EVo, , Samsung evo 860 pro 1 TB SSD, Samsung evo 850 pro 1TB SSD, WD 1TB HDD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mayo25 Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 I am looking for the documents, US navy pilot interviews and pictures about the radar less US Navy ( Marines ) F-5E/F. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mayo25 Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paganus Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 15 hours ago, Kev2go said: ED didnt make it Belsimtek did. Maybe you haven't heard. ED absorbed Belsimtek. The IP belongs to ED now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev2go Posted February 20, 2021 Author Share Posted February 20, 2021 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Paganus said: Maybe you haven't heard. ED absorbed Belsimtek. The IP belongs to ED now. Yes , but that was well after the fact. So when ED does find the time to renew the F5E tiger, ( Wags himself said its something he would like to see) because if you haven't heard ED has alot of other things on their plate to get out of the way , il expect more than just a higher texture 3d model update. 1 hour ago, mayo25 said: yes radarless models exist as well for Navy/usmc Those cockpit diagrams of the radarless versions are cited in the 2006 manual Edited February 20, 2021 by Kev2go Build: Windows 10 64 bit Pro Case/Tower: Corsair Graphite 760tm ,Asus Strix Z790 Motherboard, Intel Core i7 12700k ,Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 64gb ram (3600 mhz) , (Asus strix oc edition) Nvidia RTX 3080 12gb , Evga g2 850 watt psu, Hardrives ; Samsung 970 EVo, , Samsung evo 860 pro 1 TB SSD, Samsung evo 850 pro 1TB SSD, WD 1TB HDD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowRider88 Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 On 8/15/2019 at 5:47 PM, Kev2go said: Yes Swiss F5E and F5N have the "pointy shark nose" and larger LEX and the AUTO flaps function. But so does the current F5E3. After all these were changes that came with that specific E production model which IRRC was a relatively late batch starting in 1979. These is also a aerodynamic characteristics that was present on of USAF aggressor based F5E's ( at least those that are the E3 model), so really there would be no FM changes needed from the current F5E3, just removal of AN/ALE40 Countermeasure and AN/ALR 87 RWR ( which is an export derivative of the AN/ALR 46V anyways) , because they weren't installed in USAF aggressor fleet. Edit: According to natops manual the F5N has the AN/APQ159 V3 or V5 radar. V5 radar is not more capable than the APQ 159V3 just described a product improvement to increase reliability and reduce weight to that of the earlier AN/APQ 153 Radar. In the manual both V3 and V5 are lumped into the same category and description and diagram of thier operations are the same. I think the difference in flight model related to the pointy vs shark nose is that the shark nose helped with directional stability during high AoA, maybe like how the ventral fin(s) on say a MiG-19 or F-16 do. Changing this for two different versions I assume wouldn't be too hard, maybe just a single FM variable that handles this range of directional stability. It would be quite fun to have this slight instability, and require us to use a bit of rudder more. By the sounds of it, I think the USAF, USN version may be the F-5E-1 version I had asked for previously. Truly hope we can get this version as well, since this is the one which saw the most actual real world air combat historically. If ED can consider this thread, they would be killing 2 requests with one stone. If this is the F-5E-1, apart from the pointy nose, and less AoA stability, I believe the smaller Original LERXs meant a few less degrees in max AoA angle. Seems to also be an easy change, FM variable wise. Also the thumb switches were the same but there were maneuvering flaps instead of the autoflaps. This also I believe is a slight change as well, as some of the flap angles are grouped slightly differently. Also should be an easy "if stantment" change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowRider88 Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 (edited) So in total, apart from the 3 slight FM differences above (anyone know of others?), to add the additional Agressor / F-5E-1 version, ED could also reuse and touch up their exising AI pointly nose F-5E external model (already exists, with pointy nose, smaller LERXs, no ventral countermeasures bump, no RWR bumps on tail pipes) and reuse the F-5E-3 cockpit, but just blank out the RWR and countermeasures 3D and coding. Edited December 16, 2021 by LowRider88 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mig Fulcrum Posted April 29 Share Posted April 29 Bump I would like to know if there is a true possibility to have a somewhat correct F-5E in game and not a "Swisserican" combo. I'm tring to do some research of every module in DCS and the F-5 really confused me about the date. From my research the AN/APR-87 arrived in 1979 to swiss F-5s but it seems very strange since AN/APR-46 (basically a -87) arrived on the F-4E in 1983 (despite HB said 1974). I doubt that the small, cheap fighter got the bettere RWR before the big and front fighter. I may be wrong but that's all very confusing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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