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CH products upgrades


rel4y
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Hey guys,

I have made and plan to make a bunch of improvements/ mods for the different CH products and some of them are already production ready. Most of my mods are explained in my thread here in the TM DCS forums, but I will update this post with the finished CH mods as well. https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=220916

 

If you are interested or want to ask questions please contact mtwsims@tutamail.com. No PMs please! 👍 Please note that sometimes I am rather slow to respond and it can take me several days to answer your emails. Payment via PayPal or SEPA bank transaction, but for PayPal I would have to add the PayPal fees on top.

 

CH Pro Throttle, CH Fighterstick, CH Combatstick, CH Pro Pedals, CH Yoke etc. magnetoresistive sensors

The cool thing about these MR sensors is that they are a drop in replacement for the standard CH pots, but contrary to these they work contactlessly. That means you can simply connect these sensors to your CH mainboard and done. You will never have to worry about deteriorating or dirty pots again. The CH Control Manager recognizes this sensor normally and you can calibrate it within the software.

Important installation instruction:

 

The pins of the sensor are labled with VCC, OUT and GND. You need to make sure to connect the voltage supply only to VCC, otherwise you may grill the very sensitive opamp in the circuit.

 

wire axis code overview:

green = GND

blue = VCC

brown = X out

black = Y out

yellow = Z out

Price is 22€ + 7€ tracked international shipping (shipping is only paid once per order)

 

IMG-20210227-022959.jpg

 

CH replacement hatswitches

CH-Hat-types.jpg IMG-20181025-173621.jpg IMG-20181025-173118.jpg IMG-20181205-193238.jpg

 

CH Combatstick to Fighterstick conversion PCB

Here is a in detail description of a mod I did with this board: https://forums.eagle.ru/topic/214485-ch-products-upgrades/?do=findComment&comment=4539101

Price is 15€ + 7€ tracked international shipping (shipping is only paid once per order)

 

IMG-20210112-121527.jpg IMG-20210112-221358.jpg

 

CH Pro Throttle (gameport version) analog slew mod

CH-slew-3-D.jpg IMG-20181205-193622.jpg


Edited by rel4y

Cougar, CH and Saitek PnP hall sensor kits + shift registers: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=220916

 

Shapeways store for DIY flight simming equipment and repair: https://www.shapeways.com/shops/rel4y-diy-joystick-flight-simming

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Sounds fun, but I'll need some more detail on how to measure them. (Multimeter mode, etc). I've done some basic electronics stuff, but would need to know exactly what you need done.

(I own the fighterstick)

 

Thanks A2597, PM sent!

 

So far I have decoded the USB, button matrix and axis pins. I mostly need information on the board and mounting hole dimensions. It isnt used on any CH devices, but I also have no clue what the P03 pin does. Probably some IC test pin. Still, any help is much appreciated! I am working hard on getting this project done! :thumbup:

 

Cheers!

Cougar, CH and Saitek PnP hall sensor kits + shift registers: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=220916

 

Shapeways store for DIY flight simming equipment and repair: https://www.shapeways.com/shops/rel4y-diy-joystick-flight-simming

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I forget where you are rel4y, Belgium? I would consider boxing up the whole Fighterstick Pro USB and shipping it if it's only going to be a couple weeks. All I would ask is the new sensor be installed also to cover shipping while you have it. Let me know if it sounds logical..

Asus Z790-PLUS D4, Corsair 1000X PS / Intel i9-13900KF @5.8Gz - Corsair H150i Liquid CPU cooler, 64GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 @3192mhz / 2TB M.2 NvMe Boot Drive (DCS World Beta installed here), 1TB M.2 Data drive, 1TB WD SATA drive, Zotac Gaming GeForce RTX 3090 Trinity OC 24GB - Nvidia 526.98 drivers / HP G2v2 / 3 Samsung LC32G53TQWUXEN 32" 7680x1440 at 144Hz  / Win11 Pro Ver.  22H2 - Build 22623.891, TIR 5, TM Warthog HOTAS\VirPil stick base, MFG V3 Crosswind Pedals, TM MFDs  on 2 8" Lilliputs/ ICP

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Ok, so I tested a lot of different ideas over the last days and I think an Arduino with an external 8 channel 12 Bit ADC makes the most sense. This would support even all 6 axis of the CH Throttle quadrant with 12 Bit resolution and keep enough pins free for button matrix and LEDs.

 

I also played around with the cool 32 Bit ARM MCUs (STM32F103 blue pill board), but these only support 3V on their internal ADCs and Software is a bit problematic... EJoy eg, is a nice little Software but I didnt get the 2.3 version to work correctly. Versions 3 and 4 dont support the blue pill boards anymore. I also found some nice new project on GitHub by a guy named vostrenkov (https://github.com/vostrenkov?tab=repositories), its called Freejoy, I will keep an eye on that one.

 

The external ADC will make the board more expensive and adds complexity, but I am sure that most people will be interested in upgrading from 8 (256 steps) to 12 Bit (4096 steps) rather than 10 Bit (1024 steps). The other possibility would be to leave the mainboard at standard 10 Bit and make the CH sensors digital 14 Bit GMRs, but that means that the sensors would only work with my new mainboard (or any DIY Arduino running MMJoy) and not with the original CH stuff!

 

So basically it comes down to what type of CH sensor is preferred. Would you rather have a contactless sensor that reads analog and is able to interface with the original CH electronics (8 Bit) and my new mainboard (12 Bit). OR do you say I will upgrade the mainboard anyway and want 14 Bit GMR sensors that connect digitally to the mainboard, but cant interface with the original CH stuff.

 

Maybe a bit confusing.., but please share your thoughts with me! :)


Edited by rel4y

Cougar, CH and Saitek PnP hall sensor kits + shift registers: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=220916

 

Shapeways store for DIY flight simming equipment and repair: https://www.shapeways.com/shops/rel4y-diy-joystick-flight-simming

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Would you rather have a contactless sensor that reads analog and is able to interface with the original CH electronics (8 Bit) and my new mainboard (12 Bit). OR do you say I will upgrade the mainboard anyway and want 14 Bit GMR sensors that connect digitally to the mainboard, but cant interface with the original CH stuff.

 

Maybe a bit confusing.., but please share your thoughts with me! :)

 

My vote - contactless sensor that reads analog and is able to interface with the original CH electronics (8 Bit) and your new mainboard (12 Bit)

Asus Z790-PLUS D4, Corsair 1000X PS / Intel i9-13900KF @5.8Gz - Corsair H150i Liquid CPU cooler, 64GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 @3192mhz / 2TB M.2 NvMe Boot Drive (DCS World Beta installed here), 1TB M.2 Data drive, 1TB WD SATA drive, Zotac Gaming GeForce RTX 3090 Trinity OC 24GB - Nvidia 526.98 drivers / HP G2v2 / 3 Samsung LC32G53TQWUXEN 32" 7680x1440 at 144Hz  / Win11 Pro Ver.  22H2 - Build 22623.891, TIR 5, TM Warthog HOTAS\VirPil stick base, MFG V3 Crosswind Pedals, TM MFDs  on 2 8" Lilliputs/ ICP

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Sent dimensions via PM.

 

 

My goal in upgrading would be improved resolution at an affordable price. Whether it's 10bit or 12bit I don't really care too much (12 bit nicer of course, depending on what that does to price) and I don't use the CH software because I'm in Windows 10.

 

 

 

While you're playing with this, and since you have experience with 3D Printing...if you engineer a way to add a paddle switch to this thing, or leave room for one more switch to be added for us that want to figure that out ourselves, that could be quite interesting. (Obviously involve cutting into the base a little to install).

 

 

Looking forward to seeing what you come up with!

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Thanks A2597! :thumbup:

 

I will definitely fit in expansion capabilities, as many as I have unused pins actually. At least one shift register connection is a must, that would allow to read an additional 80 buttons. :)

 

A paddle switch is doable I think. I also have a dual stage trigger mod for the Fighterstick ready in CAD, but I need to set priorities right now. Otherwise I have 200 half optimized mods and none will ever be finished.

 

The external 8 channel 12 Bit ADC adds an additional ~5€. I am not sure about price yet. I have already ordered the connectors and need to figure out an elegant way to make use of the original USB chord. Arduinos data inputs are sadly not pinned out and can only be accessed via the micro USB. Though I do have an idea for a workaround. :smilewink:

Cougar, CH and Saitek PnP hall sensor kits + shift registers: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=220916

 

Shapeways store for DIY flight simming equipment and repair: https://www.shapeways.com/shops/rel4y-diy-joystick-flight-simming

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.... if you engineer a way to add a paddle switch to this thing, or leave room for one more switch to be added for us that want to figure that out ourselves, that could be quite interesting. (Obviously involve cutting into the base a little to install).

 

I've installed a DIY (aluminum) paddle in two CH's (Fightestick and Combatstick), and the issue is the big angle of movement of grip. A conventional paddle, F-16/Warthog like will collide with stick base. Need a angled lever, that looks "weird but" result functional.

 

Trigger-6.jpg

 

 

For more buttons, if will install a new USB controller (10/12 bits), increase buttons is matter of find placement for then, as the new controller allow at least 32 (12 more than CH controller).

 

If want keep CH USB controller the only way I see - for more two buttons, is use throttle axis divided in two bands with resistors, but this require use a keymapper software with "axis to button" to make this axis band send keypress.

 

An dual trigger is very easy to implement, is matter to add a second micro-switch under the trigger lever.

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We should have known that somebody has done the paddle mod before and that this somebody was you Sokol. Making these mods is generally not that hard for someone with experience, the hard part is making it elegant and fool proof for anyone to install and use. :)

 

In terms of expanding the original CH board. Theoretically the LEDs are connected to columns, so it could be possible to expand the button matrix like this. There is also an unused C9 column on the newer rev boards pinned out, that would bring up the button count to a max of 32. But I don't know if the CH software is capable of interpreting the new buttons and I'm convinced it's not worth the hassle on a board with obsolete 8 Bit ADCs...


Edited by mtwsims
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In terms of expanding the original CH board. Theoretically the LEDs are connected to columns, so it could be possible to expand the button matrix like this. There is also an unused C9 column on the newer rev boards pinned out,

 

The LEDs are connected over a 74HCT138 decoder, so thats not an option. C9 may be a possibility on the newest boards if its not connected to the 74HCT138, though I doubt it. I guess it was added for an additional LED as the max amount of buttons on CH devices is 20 and the button matrix supports that. CH most likely doesnt expect nor want people to add additional stuff to their controllers. The CH mainboard interestingly enough also has an external 10 Bit ADC, but it seems to be downsampled to 8 Bit internally for some reason.


Edited by rel4y

Cougar, CH and Saitek PnP hall sensor kits + shift registers: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=220916

 

Shapeways store for DIY flight simming equipment and repair: https://www.shapeways.com/shops/rel4y-diy-joystick-flight-simming

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Hey guys,

I have finished the CH upgrade mainboard and will send it to the factory tomorrow. :pilotfly:

 

The final features are 8x 12 Bit axis, directly reads the CH axis, reads the CH button matrix, makes use of the standard CH USB cable, additional shift register connection, additional 2x digial axis connections = TLE5011. It will have the same KF2510 connectors as the original CH board, so it is 120% plug & play! I used up all the available pins of the MCU and also the board space to the absolute max! :D Really happy with this thing!

 

Cheers

Cougar, CH and Saitek PnP hall sensor kits + shift registers: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=220916

 

Shapeways store for DIY flight simming equipment and repair: https://www.shapeways.com/shops/rel4y-diy-joystick-flight-simming

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Hey guys,

I have finished the CH upgrade mainboard and will send it to the factory tomorrow. :pilotfly:

 

The final features are 8x 12 Bit axis, directly reads the CH axis, reads the CH button matrix, makes use of the standard CH USB cable, additional shift register connection, additional 2x digial axis connections = TLE5011. It will have the same KF2510 connectors as the original CH board, so it is 120% plug & play! I used up all the available pins of the MCU and also the board space to the absolute max! :D Really happy with this thing!

 

Cheers

 

Great news, i'll just add that to my shopping list when the sensors are ready! One of my toe brakes is quite jumpy now, i'll try the electrical contact cleaner spray cleaning trick while I wait.. Should I get just a cleaner or a cleaner/dielectric lubricant spray for this purpose?


Edited by GaryR

Asus Z790-PLUS D4, Corsair 1000X PS / Intel i9-13900KF @5.8Gz - Corsair H150i Liquid CPU cooler, 64GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 @3192mhz / 2TB M.2 NvMe Boot Drive (DCS World Beta installed here), 1TB M.2 Data drive, 1TB WD SATA drive, Zotac Gaming GeForce RTX 3090 Trinity OC 24GB - Nvidia 526.98 drivers / HP G2v2 / 3 Samsung LC32G53TQWUXEN 32" 7680x1440 at 144Hz  / Win11 Pro Ver.  22H2 - Build 22623.891, TIR 5, TM Warthog HOTAS\VirPil stick base, MFG V3 Crosswind Pedals, TM MFDs  on 2 8" Lilliputs/ ICP

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Hey rel4y, when are you coming out with a completely new base for the Fighterstick? Better gimbals, adjustable spring tension, dampening?

:smartass:

Asus Z790-PLUS D4, Corsair 1000X PS / Intel i9-13900KF @5.8Gz - Corsair H150i Liquid CPU cooler, 64GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 @3192mhz / 2TB M.2 NvMe Boot Drive (DCS World Beta installed here), 1TB M.2 Data drive, 1TB WD SATA drive, Zotac Gaming GeForce RTX 3090 Trinity OC 24GB - Nvidia 526.98 drivers / HP G2v2 / 3 Samsung LC32G53TQWUXEN 32" 7680x1440 at 144Hz  / Win11 Pro Ver.  22H2 - Build 22623.891, TIR 5, TM Warthog HOTAS\VirPil stick base, MFG V3 Crosswind Pedals, TM MFDs  on 2 8" Lilliputs/ ICP

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Looking forward to it! My fighterstick has started to get a little jitter when centered, a plug and play method for updating it would be amazing!

 

I think you would be pleased with this board! :) I just ordered 10 boards and the corresponding amount of ADCs & MCUs. But I have to dial down expectations a bit, it will probably not be ready before next month.

 

Great news, i'll just add that to my shopping list when the sensors are ready! One of my toe brakes is quite jumpy now, i'll try the electrical contact cleaner spray cleaning trick while I wait.. Should I get just a cleaner or a cleaner/dielectric lubricant spray for this purpose?

 

I usually use isopropyl alcohol, it worked very well on all sorts of pots so far. :)

 

Hey rel4y, when are you coming out with a completely new base for the Fighterstick? Better gimbals, adjustable spring tension, dampening?

smartass.gif

 

I am not sure that makes sense economically. A sort of Evenstrain mod might be rather simple to do. I may take a look at it sometime, but the next big project is force sensing and getting my Crosswind F-16 footrests cast in Aluminium. :)

Cougar, CH and Saitek PnP hall sensor kits + shift registers: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=220916

 

Shapeways store for DIY flight simming equipment and repair: https://www.shapeways.com/shops/rel4y-diy-joystick-flight-simming

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I usually use isopropyl alcohol, it worked very well on all sorts of pots so far. :)

 

Ok, i'll get the plain Contact Cleaner spray for now, please count me IN on the new board and sensors!

Asus Z790-PLUS D4, Corsair 1000X PS / Intel i9-13900KF @5.8Gz - Corsair H150i Liquid CPU cooler, 64GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 @3192mhz / 2TB M.2 NvMe Boot Drive (DCS World Beta installed here), 1TB M.2 Data drive, 1TB WD SATA drive, Zotac Gaming GeForce RTX 3090 Trinity OC 24GB - Nvidia 526.98 drivers / HP G2v2 / 3 Samsung LC32G53TQWUXEN 32" 7680x1440 at 144Hz  / Win11 Pro Ver.  22H2 - Build 22623.891, TIR 5, TM Warthog HOTAS\VirPil stick base, MFG V3 Crosswind Pedals, TM MFDs  on 2 8" Lilliputs/ ICP

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I think you would be pleased with this board! :) I just ordered 10 boards and the corresponding amount of ADCs & MCUs. But I have to dial down expectations a bit, it will probably not be ready before next month.

 

 

...but the next big project is force sensing

 

 

I'll just file it under "Anticipated Christmas Present". If we can figure out a solution for paddle switch, I don't see myself upgrading from CH for a very long time.

 

 

 

Also...Force Sensing?!

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  • 2 weeks later...
I usually use isopropyl alcohol, it worked very well on all sorts of pots so far. :)

 

The next big project is force sensing and getting my Crosswind F-16 footrests cast in Aluminium. :)

 

I cleaned and blew out the (right toe brake) pot a few times, working it full each time. It seemed a little better but quickly went back to jittering from neutral to about 10-15% application so it's gotta be changed out. As it's not as critical to be as accurate as the Stick/Throttle I guess i'll just get a replacement pot while I wait for your new stuff to be ready! :D

Asus Z790-PLUS D4, Corsair 1000X PS / Intel i9-13900KF @5.8Gz - Corsair H150i Liquid CPU cooler, 64GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 @3192mhz / 2TB M.2 NvMe Boot Drive (DCS World Beta installed here), 1TB M.2 Data drive, 1TB WD SATA drive, Zotac Gaming GeForce RTX 3090 Trinity OC 24GB - Nvidia 526.98 drivers / HP G2v2 / 3 Samsung LC32G53TQWUXEN 32" 7680x1440 at 144Hz  / Win11 Pro Ver.  22H2 - Build 22623.891, TIR 5, TM Warthog HOTAS\VirPil stick base, MFG V3 Crosswind Pedals, TM MFDs  on 2 8" Lilliputs/ ICP

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Hey guys,

I have finished the CH upgrade mainboard and will send it to the factory tomorrow. :pilotfly:

 

The final features are 8x 12 Bit axis, directly reads the CH axis, reads the CH button matrix, makes use of the standard CH USB cable, additional shift register connection, additional 2x digial axis connections = TLE5011. It will have the same KF2510 connectors as the original CH board, so it is 120% plug & play! I used up all the available pins of the MCU and also the board space to the absolute max! :D Really happy with this thing!

 

Cheers

For all CH devices?

So, If I understood correctly, we can add more buttons and 2 axis? :joystick:

:megalol:

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For all CH devices?

So, If I understood correctly, we can add more buttons and 2 axis? :joystick:

 

The Fighterstick or pro throttle eg only use 3 axis, so you can add 5x analog 12 Bit axis and 2x 14 bit digital axis and somewhere over 100 buttons extra. :)

Cougar, CH and Saitek PnP hall sensor kits + shift registers: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=220916

 

Shapeways store for DIY flight simming equipment and repair: https://www.shapeways.com/shops/rel4y-diy-joystick-flight-simming

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The Fighterstick or pro throttle eg only use 3 axis, so you can add 5x analog 12 Bit axis and 2x 14 bit digital axis and somewhere over 100 buttons extra. :)

 

Rel4y, will the new sensors for the Pro Throttle be any different than what you have in stock now (I assumed you were just modifying the FS board/sensors?)? I want to replace it now while it's just sitting unused if possible but will wait if something better is coming soon. I sent Thomas an email also. I have no issue waiting for the new board and sensors for the Fighterstick, wish someone made a progressive spring set just a bit stronger for it, too hard to go "spring shopping" around here and Amazon is no bueno, love to mod it while it's apart.. and when will you know prices/availability on your rudder pedals, they are the one CH item I'm not in love with..


Edited by GaryR

Asus Z790-PLUS D4, Corsair 1000X PS / Intel i9-13900KF @5.8Gz - Corsair H150i Liquid CPU cooler, 64GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 @3192mhz / 2TB M.2 NvMe Boot Drive (DCS World Beta installed here), 1TB M.2 Data drive, 1TB WD SATA drive, Zotac Gaming GeForce RTX 3090 Trinity OC 24GB - Nvidia 526.98 drivers / HP G2v2 / 3 Samsung LC32G53TQWUXEN 32" 7680x1440 at 144Hz  / Win11 Pro Ver.  22H2 - Build 22623.891, TIR 5, TM Warthog HOTAS\VirPil stick base, MFG V3 Crosswind Pedals, TM MFDs  on 2 8" Lilliputs/ ICP

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Just an FYI (and maybe you can clarify what goes where), as my Toe brake pots just arrived.

 

I wasn't sure which pot from Digikey (except throttle, which is 1040-1156-ND - REPPOT615, stamped 900-6158 1741 on the housing) went where I bought a couple of each (all in about 20 euro). All I needed was my right toebrake replaced, which was (orig. CH) stamped HP-100A 0315 on the housing. There was only one of the 3 that had a shaft matching (and pins bent 90 degrees) so I used that one. The new part number is 1040-1164-ND and is stamped HP-100A 1709. Seems to work perfectly, no more jitters and jumps. Not sure yet where 1040-1173-ND, stamped 900-615C 0537 go, have to assume as the are shorter (look just like Throttle Pot) they are for rudder and Fighterstick axis, which I will use Rel4y's new products for when available. Here is a pic of original and replacement for toe brake for future reference..

1319598972_CHToebrakePots.thumb.jpg.68d3af4f945d5959bf9622722911ab14.jpg

Asus Z790-PLUS D4, Corsair 1000X PS / Intel i9-13900KF @5.8Gz - Corsair H150i Liquid CPU cooler, 64GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 @3192mhz / 2TB M.2 NvMe Boot Drive (DCS World Beta installed here), 1TB M.2 Data drive, 1TB WD SATA drive, Zotac Gaming GeForce RTX 3090 Trinity OC 24GB - Nvidia 526.98 drivers / HP G2v2 / 3 Samsung LC32G53TQWUXEN 32" 7680x1440 at 144Hz  / Win11 Pro Ver.  22H2 - Build 22623.891, TIR 5, TM Warthog HOTAS\VirPil stick base, MFG V3 Crosswind Pedals, TM MFDs  on 2 8" Lilliputs/ ICP

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