NADIR and ZENITH symbols in HUD

[Geraki]

This is not correct for the block that it does not have it

 

Please re-evaluate your sources for tape 4.2 all F-16C tapes from 2007 and above have it for better pilot situation awareness like curved dash level lines ..... as correctly you simulate in the current block...

[mvsgas]

What page number and paragraph number does it mention those symbols on the manuals?

You can't post a link nor copy and paste the info, but you can tell me page number and para.

 

I have never hear nor seen anything regarding this in the USAF F-16 manuals circa 2007 and beyond

[Alfas]

that symbols are from F-16C block 40, don't know if it still exits in block 50.

 

here is the report about "testing new HUD symbols for F-16C" (block 40)

the report is "APPROVED FOR PUBLIC RELEASE",so i think it not violate ED's forum rule.

 

https://apps.dtic.mil/docs/citations/ADA260280

https://apps.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a260280.pdf

 

btw, almost all test pilots not prefer that new NADIR and ZENITH symbol. :megalol:

Edited February 6, 2020 by Alfas

[Geraki]

Pm send it

 

correct page 6

 

all tape 4.2 have avionics and HUD - references upgrades for better SA

 

ghost horizon, nadir/zenith symbols

 

also if anyone F-16 "veteran" can help in that please provide the info

Edited February 6, 2020 by Geraki

[Bouli306]

I opted for this long time ago. Answer was that it was not applicable for this block.

[Geraki]

I opted for this long time ago. Answer was that it was not applicable for this block.

 

This is stated wrong!!!

 

if DCS wants to make a realistic F-16 must search a lot, we are here to help

 

 

the same answer was for Altitude ARC in dogfight...

[mvsgas]

So you basing this in a 1992 paper? The -34 explains everything about the HUD. What each window will show, why and when. You don't have a page number and paragraph number for that?

 

The paper states that: "there is no plan to make the HUD a primary flight reference" but when you look at the current training manuals ( which have no releasability restriction and can be downloaded from E-publisihing, the USAF website) it mentions the HUD as a primary reference. That how outdated this paper is.

 

A operational F-16 was not even use for this study, they made a sim from a salvage F-16.

 

The document you provided, has little to nothing to do with a USAF F-16C block 50 circa 2007.

[Alfas]

You can see nadir/zenith (and ghost horizon line) presented and in-use in many F16 HUD video on youtube.

 

And how can I find USAF series for F16 block 50 manual -34 , Can you Pm me the link ?

All I can find is HAF series manual -34. and that not What ED told us they working on.

Edited February 6, 2020 by Alfas

[mvsgas]

You can see nadir/zenith (and ghost horizon line) presented and in-use in many F16 HUD video on youtube.

That does not help unless the video can be proven to be from a USAF F-16C block 50 circa 2007

 

And how can I find USAF series for F16 block 50 manual -34 , Can you Pm me the link ?

All I can find is HAF series manual -34.

 

Why would you need a link? I thought you and Geraki knew this to be accurate, so you guys had first hand experience or correct documentation right?

[Alfas]

that what I told you, if you have USAF series of F16 -34 , you can PM me.

We can’t discuss if we don’t have the same referance.

[mvsgas]

So we agree you don't have the proper reference. I guess we need to trust Eagle Dynamics.

[Alfas]

But you told me you have proper referance, USAF -34 circa 2007 that not show this symbol in it.

Why not you pm me ?

[Geraki]

So we agree you don't have the proper reference. I guess we need to trust Eagle Dynamics.

 

F-16CM -34

 

page 1-165 and 166

 

no further information end of story!!!!

Edited February 6, 2020 by Geraki

[mvsgas]

1-165 to 166 talks about FCR symbols, nothing about HUD symbols

[Alfas]

this is hilarious

 

I never mention about USAF block 50 -34.

I was talk about block 40 have it.

 

And you told me , to tell where it is in your USAF -34.

How can I do that. If you not give me that USAF -34 lol.

[Alfas]

F-16CM -34

 

page 1-165 and 166

 

no further information end of story!!!!

 

Can you PM me which -34 you referance to ?

[mvsgas]

Like I PM Geraki, I can't find no reference nor mention of nadir nor zenith. Are they called anything else?

 

Looks like we need to trust ED to have to proper information. I'm sure if they find it or enough people complain about it they will change it.

[Alfas]

ED could be wrong.

they was wrong with DGFT Alttitude Awareness Arc not included in this block 50.

 

new nadir/zenith, bendy dive pitch bar, ghost horizon, extended horizon bar, all come together with same software upgrade SCU-2 1993 (after block 50 1990)

and i think block 50 got this upgrade too (DCS simulating all except nadir/zenith)

 

i don't have USAF -34, is it refer to DGFT arc, bendy dive pitch bar, ghost horizon, extended horizon bar ?

i doubt if that -34 cover all software upgrade change (MLU, SCU).

 

if they was really removed only nadir/zenith from block 50

only reason i can think of, is almost all test pilots not prefer and rarely use it, as they complained in that report.

Edited February 8, 2020 by Alfas

[Geraki]

Nadir/Zenith HUD reference please!!! 

[Geraki]

THK F-16 Block50 during CCIP upgrade in LM 

TEST FLIGHT  nadir/zenith symbols

   

[Tholozor]

That video does not state at any point it's from a Block 50.

[Florence201]

9 hours ago, Geraki said:

+1 realistic detal

Wind up merchant. Oh and spelling/grammar go along way to making a strong case 

[TAW_Blaze]

 

This is an incentive flight with a D model from 2009. Zenith at 22:23 and Nadir at 22:39.

[TAW_Blaze]

4 hours ago, Desert Fox said:

 

So what exactly got a 2009 F-16D to do with a 2007 F-16C?

 

You guys are hilarious

 

I never said that this is proof of anything. But it is rather odd that all other variants of the same aircraft have this symbology. Why would they remove it in a more modern variant? It helps a lot with SA, especially in low visibility conditions.

 

In this thread there is no direct claim that the blk50 should not have these symbols. These symbols are important to me and if they do not exist in the modeled variant I consider it as a critical design flaw, just like not having IFF indication on your HUD.

[Bunny Clark]

On 4/3/2021 at 12:39 PM, 104th_Blaze said:

These symbols are important to me and if they do not exist in the modeled variant I consider it as a critical design flaw, just like not having IFF indication on your HUD.

So, are you arguing that a DCS module should include a feature because you want it to, even if it's not realistic?