Uuuuaaaah..! I have started building now..!

[CyBerkut]

:thumbup: Excellent news, Trigger! :D

[Swetrekki]

well if anyone is going for the same setup, and have a single action piston lying around, an easy solution, if you are using fluids that is is just to connect the piston to a solenoid valve and connect a reservoir to the other side of the solenoid valve.

No need for bleed valves and/or "one way" valves.

Edited January 8, 2009 by Swetrekki
spell check

[Triggerhappy69]

WARNING..!

 

If anyone have started using my drawings for the Pedals, You should STOP RIGHT NOW..!

 

 

A wrong calculation apeared as I was fine tuning the CAD Assembly. The Main Cross bar is to short compared to the real thing, and the pedals are not symetrical for some reason..?

 

I'll fix the drawings and post an update...

[CAT_101st]

And I was just about to print them out :D. Thanks It gives me a place to start any way.

[Triggerhappy69]

And I was just about to print them out :D. Thanks It gives me a place to start any way.

 

 

The only things wrong are that the Pedals are not symetrical.. And they should be..

And the Main Crossbar is to short.. You would only get 7-8 degrees movement before the CrossBar hit the Pedals..

 

I'll post the right dimensions later.. Everything else is 100% correct..

 

...sorry mate.,..:cry:

[Triggerhappy69]

And I was just about to print them out :D. Thanks It gives me a place to start any way.

 

 

Got them all fixed now...:music_whistling:

 

If the dimentions are wrong now, we BOTH have a problem.. :cry:

 

Ps. They are in the same post as before.. I just did some editing.. You'll find them here: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=27270&page=46

[Swetrekki]

I'm quite happy with my saitek x52pro, but i seriously started thinking about building a collective and cyclic just for the hell of it, the collective box i can mill out of a block of aluminum i figured, and the rest trigger has allready paved the way for ;)

But where the hell can i get hold of a good cyclic grip??? i't doesn't have to be a black shark or a genuine F16 stick, but it HAVE got to be a "real" one. ie same size as the real deal... anyone got any ideas besides Ebay?

 

BTW, trigger, this is all your fault ;)

[CyBerkut]

I'm quite happy with my saitek x52pro, but i seriously started thinking about building a collective and cyclic just for the hell of it, the collective box i can mill out of a block of aluminum i figured, and the rest trigger has allready paved the way for ;)

But where the hell can i get hold of a good cyclic grip??? i't doesn't have to be a black shark or a genuine F16 stick, but it HAVE got to be a "real" one. ie same size as the real deal... anyone got any ideas besides Ebay?

 

BTW, trigger, this is all your fault ;)

 

I don't own one, but as I recall, the Thrustmaster Cougar has a removable grip (I Think they had originally planned to offer alternative grips as options). I think it was Trigger that mentioned buying hat switches from Guillemot http://www.guillemot.com (the owners of Thrustmaster), ... perhaps they would sell you a grip assembly at a fair price.

[Triggerhappy69]

I don't own one, but as I recall, the Thrustmaster Cougar has a removable grip (I Think they had originally planned to offer alternative grips as options). I think it was Trigger that mentioned buying hat switches from Guillemot http://www.guillemot.com (the owners of Thrustmaster), ... perhaps they would sell you a grip assembly at a fair price.

 

 

Some thoughts arround this..

 

The Cougar grip, allthough the excellent quality it has, might make the stick a bit top-heavy..? It's made from metal and you would have to consider a sollution like URZE's balancing stick if you choose it.

 

I used an old Thrustmaster FCS (is that what it's called?) stick. It is made from plastic and dirt-cheap on e-bay..

And it also has every button placed right on the stick. Well almost ever button. I had to add one pushbutton on the lower leftside pinkie. but that was just a question of gluing it in with hotglue..

 

Naturally the top is all wrong, but making a new one is a lot easyer than you might think..

 

AND there's a lot of old Sun-Com sticks arround to.. I have the adress to the guy who ran Thrustmaster here in norway. And he has a bunch of old Sun-Com and Thrustmaster sticks in stock still.. AND spareparts for both of them..

 

If you are interrested I'll give you the adress?:joystick:

[CyBerkut]

Oooohhh... Suncom!

 

Good point about the weight of the Cougar grip. I was thinking that he was going to build a mechanism from the ground up (rather than modifying an existing commercial joystick), and that the design wouldn't be hampered by the grip weight.... but I can see that it easily could.

 

I would say part of it comes down to whether he intends to make a Black Shark cyclic replica (ala Trigger's pit), or just live with the switches, etc. provided on the commercial stick.

 

I have a Suncom F15E Talon stick (and SFS Throttle) that I've ben holding on to for the day when a good twin engine fighter jet sim catches my fancy (I'd have to rewire it to USB). If he was going to go with the stock switches/hats, etc. then the Suncom Talon could be a good choice. The CH Products sticks could be good also. If he is going to cut the top off and build a high fidelity / Black Sharkish cyclic, then any of those could still serve as a base, or he could do as you did with the old Thrustmaster FCS. (I still have a Thrustmaster FCS and WCS, too...)

 

If hand size is an issue, I'll point out that the Suncom Talon would probably feel better to someone with large hands, whereas the old Thrustmaster FCS would be a good fit for smaller hands.

 

Trigger, if your contact in Norway is handy enough, it would be cool if he made some Suncom Talon & SFS conversions to USB!

[Swetrekki]

The most annoying thing about that is that i had 2 PFCS (i think they are modeled on the Phantom F4 stick) but they are of course lost somewhere in the great beyond (parents attic) but the thing is that it was really plastic and actually wasn't full size!?!

 

Funny thing is that it's probably the same grip that they use in the Cobra heli. it looks quite similar at least. so i full size one would be awsome ;) but i wouldn't mind a cougar (despite the balance issue)

 

that said I'll take all the leads i can get so, yes please pm me the adress and i'll send him an email.

tnx mate

 

@CyBerkut tnx for the link, if triggers lead turns out to be a dead end i'll be sure to send them an email.

 

buggs me that i KNOW I have/had 2 grips, but cant find them

 

another funny thing is that a company called AMT/ERTL made a plastic model of the F16 and F18 cockpit, in 1:12, and a 1:1 model of the F16 stick!!! and yes i could have bought one 15 years ago but who knew.

Edit, i think that it might have been ESCI that actually made the molds originally

 

Edit 2: CyBerkut, aswered before i pressed save ;), you are dead on, I plan on building the base from scratch but weight might still be an issue.

The Talon sure looks bigger, and i do have large hands, but to be honest i dont like the look of it. What i'd really would want is actually to get my hands on one of these http://www.migman.com/hw/control/tm/topgun_platinum.htm

I could then use that as a base and make molds from it, and basicly build what ever type of stick i fancy. planning on using a connection system similar to the cougar (screw in contact) to be able to swap different grips and use the same gimbal and base. then i can really go crasy and build any style of grip i fancy :P

My main concern is not the exact look of the stick, just that it needs to feel right and that you dont have to twist your wrist just to be able to press some of the buttons (as is the case sometimes on the X52)

 

 

// trekki

Edited January 11, 2009 by Swetrekki

[CyBerkut]

Links... Maybe one of these could lead to something...

 

These guys make grips. I don't know what they would charge.

http://hirevsims.com/index.htm

 

Another commercial grip maker:

http://www.ottoexcellence.com/controls/control_grip_home.html

 

And another:

http://www.pqcontrols.com/products.html

 

I imagine all of the above are pricey, but who knows... maybe one of them will sell an empty grip (that you can populate/modify to your heart's content) for a reasonable price.

 

Good luck!

[Deadman]

Links... Maybe one of these could lead to something...

Hirevs doesn't sell to individuals only the Government

These guys make grips. I don't know what they would charge.

http://hirevsims.com/index.htm

 

Otto in the $500.00 to $600.00 range for a B8

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/ottopistolgrips.php

Another commercial grip maker:

http://www.ottoexcellence.com/controls/control_grip_home.html

Not sure

And another:

http://www.pqcontrols.com/products.html

 

Ebay has some grips on from time to time if you want a B8 grip you can get one on http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/infinitygrips.php

 

 

 

I imagine all of the above are pricey, but who knows... maybe one of them will sell an empty grip (that you can populate/modify to your heart's content) for a reasonable price.

 

Good luck!

Good luck

[Sokol1_br]

If hand size is an issue, I'll point out that the Suncom Talon would probably feel better to someone with large hands, whereas the old Thrustmaster FCS would be a good fit for smaller hands.

Thrustmaster FCS, PFCS MkI or II, Top Gun have a 2/3 size of original B-8 grip (ie. UH-1 Huey, many 50/60' fighters).

 

But Thrustmaster X-Fighter use a 1/1 size B-8 grip, ideal for big hands.

 

They use the same metal base of Tm F-16/F22 PRO and have a very strong springs, ideal for a floor based MOD.

Edit. Sample:

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/49310655/m/3821084134/p/26

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/Thrustmaster-X-Fighter-Joystick_W0QQitemZ230318717416QQcmdZViewItemQQptZPCA_Joysticks_Game_Controllers?hash=item230318717416&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50

 

My "interpretation" (WIP) of Triggerhappy69 collective drawings:

 

 

I dont have tools to work with metal, so I use PCV pipes, stirene sheets, spare plywood and balsa wood (leftower from airmodel kits), plastic brake lever for bicicle. :P I plan build grip for Ka50 ciclic carved in wood

but need some drawings.

 

Edit- The more accessible real grip are from Aircraftspruce:

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/infinitygrips.php

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/b8pistolgrip.php

 

Sokol1

Edited January 11, 2009 by Sokol1_br

[Triggerhappy69]

Thrustmaster FCS, PFCS MkI or II, Top Gun have a 2/3 size of original B-8 grip (ie. UH-1 Huey, many 50/60' fighters).

 

But Thrustmaster X-Fighter use a 1/1 size B-8 grip, ideal for big hands.

 

They use the same metal base of Tm F-16/F22 PRO and have a very strong springs, ideal for a floor based MOD.

Edit. Sample:

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/49310655/m/3821084134/p/26

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/Thrustmaster-X-Fighter-Joystick_W0QQitemZ230318717416QQcmdZViewItemQQptZPCA_Joysticks_Game_Controllers?hash=item230318717416&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50

 

My "interpretation" (WIP) of Triggerhappy69 collective drawings:

 

 

I dont have tools to work with metal, so I use PCV pipes, stirene sheets, spare plywood and balsa wood (leftower from airmodel kits), plastic brake lever for bicicle. :P I plan build grip for Ka50 ciclic carved in wood

but need some drawings.

 

Edit- The more accessible real grip are from Aircraftspruce:

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/infinitygrips.php

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/b8pistolgrip.php

 

Sokol1

 

 

That is sooo cool Sokol1..! :thumbup:

 

It looks really good, and when you paint it, it will be just perfect,,!

 

I used the grip from a Thrustmaster like the one pointed to in the link above. All I did was to cut off the top and replace it with my own box..

 

If you need drawings I'll get riight on it and try having them ready by tonight for you..:joystick:

[Triggerhappy69]

Cyclic Stick

 

Here's a short picture series showing how I made the Cyclic..

 

First the drawing for the Cyclic Top Box:

And here is the Pdf file: KA-50 Hocas Top Box.PDF

 

I started by forming the Plug out of styrofoam. DO use styrofoam because it's easy to remove with gasoline later.

 

Check it for size on your stick. As I mentioned earlier I found an old Thrustmaster Top Gun stick, and simply cut the top off..! The bottom part has all the buttons placed just right for a Ka-50.

 

Now after mounting the foam plug on a holder, I started putting on layers of fiberglass cloth with epoxy glue.. (Use the one-hour glue, or thin out five-minute glue with paint thinner to make it set slowly)

 

Leave it to harden for at least a couple of days.. I know this is difficult for some of us.. But the Epoxy needs to completely hardened to not dissolve when you use gasoline later..

And the using a dremel or a pair of small sissors you trim of the edges roughly.

 

In my case I actually had to add some more layers of fiberglass cloth to make the box 100% rigid.. Never mind the overall look of the box at this stage.. You will need to do some serious sanding later anyway. Just make sure that you have the basic shape of the box, and no air pockets in the fiberglass..

 

Some rough trimming and another check on the Cyclic stick.

 

Now start digging out most of the styrofoam with your fingers or a blunt object.. Try to avoid using a knife, because it will most likely either cut you, or damage the box (.. wise from self inflicted damage :cry:..)

 

And then remove the last foam by pouring gasoline into the box and leaving it for ... I dunno.. maybe 3-5 minutes..! and then pour the gasoline out.. Let the box dry for 10 minutes before pouring more gasoline into it. This is so you don't make the epoxy resin go "spungy" and soft..

Repeate untill the foam has all gone..

 

At this point I had done some serious sanding and painting (naturally I was so in the "zone" I forgot to take pictures :huh:).

I cut the plate that holds the buttons from a sheet of 3mm plastic I had in my workshop. 'Dunno what it originally was for, but it doesn't matter. Use whatever material you feel is right for you.

 

Another test fitting to please my ever growing ego..:music_whistling:

 

And naturally I had to add the buttons and POV Hat to give myself wet dreams that night!

 

 

And that's really all that there's to it..! Easy peasy if you ask me..

 

 

 

The supplier that has all the old Thrustmaster and SunCom sticks and spare parts can be found on this adress: http://www.computerpartner.no/frame_uk.html

 

you can contact them at: http://www.computerpartner.no/shop/catalog/contact_us.php?osCsid=54629dccdb53c6aa991cd15221125462

[Alex_rcpilot]

Wet dreams...lol.

Hey I finished some work a minute ago and dropped in just to laugh my a** off. Good job trigger.

[stelios2000]

fantastic !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Swetrekki]

I knew there where plenty of info out there to tap into, that X Fighter stick looks just like what the doctor ordered. thanx Sokol1_br!

I found one in germany and placed a bid on it, shipping cost will be lower

thanks once more, and once i made a mold out of it I can make grips for you fellas out there as well :)

 

If all goes well, i might end up casting it in aluminum, but im starting with polyethylene plastic :P

 

edit, and yes trigger i will do it the same way, but i would recommend using extruded polystyrene board instead, easier to sand and set a good finish with, and it melts away just as good, you can find them under different brandnames but its generally called bluecore or pinkfoam (originaly used for floor insulation when building heated flooring)

Edited January 11, 2009 by Swetrekki

[CyBerkut]

I knew there where plenty of info out there to tap into, that X Fighter stick looks just like what the doctor ordered. thanx Sokol1_br!

I found one in germany and placed a bid on it, shipping cost will be lower

thanks once more, and once i made a mold out of it I can make grips for you fellas out there as well :)

 

If all goes well, i might end up casting it in aluminum, but im starting with polyethylene plastic :P

 

Nice! If you make castings, I might be on your customer list. :)

 

I would think a reasonably solid plastic (on the order of what the better game joysticks use) would be a good choice.

[CyBerkut]

Trigger, I seem to recall some postings from you (I don't remember if it was in this thread, or elsewhere) that indicated that your dual trigger setup had the larger trigger also operating the small one (underneath it when the large trigger is folded down). I think you wrote that back before the DCS: Black Shark pilot's manual became available, so I made a mental note to watch for subsequent message traffic on it. I don't think I have seen anything from you about changing that.

 

Do you still plan to have the larger (weapon release) trigger also depress the smaller (cannon) trigger underneath it? If so, that doesn't match what pages 2-7 and 2-8 indicate in the manual. It says the weapon release trigger, folded down, renders the cannon trigger inoperative. You have to fold the weapon release trigger up to operate the cannon trigger.

 

Just checking!

Edited January 13, 2009 by CyBerkut

[Swetrekki]

sorry for hogging your build thread trigger but i'm tickled pink, i just won the bidding on an x fighter stick for the neat sum of 1€!!!!

Now thats a good price!, now i'm off to order a usb card from leo bodnar

 

and on that subject:

Is it worth the extra cost to go for the 12Bit version? as i understand it the 2 cards are the same, besides the higher resolution (4095) ???

[Triggerhappy69]

sorry for hogging your build thread trigger but i'm tickled pink, i just won the bidding on an x fighter stick for the neat sum of 1€!!!!

Now thats a good price!, now i'm off to order a usb card from leo bodnar

 

and on that subject:

Is it worth the extra cost to go for the 12Bit version? as i understand it the 2 cards are the same, besides the higher resolution (4095) ???

 

 

ABSOLUTELY..! Go for the highest resolution..!

 

It just makes the whole thing more presise, and you will notice it (at least if you compare two joysticks directly).

 

And if you plan on using hall effect sensors, the higher the resolution, the happyer Swetrekki..:thumbup:

[Swetrekki]

Haha, well we want a happy trekki, i guess. And I plan on useing hall sensor (självklart)

 

edit:

Well i sure hope your right because i just ordered the card and sensors :):):):):):)

Edited January 12, 2009 by Swetrekki

[Triggerhappy69]

Haha, well we want a happy trekki, i guess. And I plan on useing hall sensor (självklart)

 

edit:

Well i sure hope your right because i just ordered the card and sensors :):):):):):)

 

So do I my friend.. because I am sitting here with Leo's BU0836 Card in my hands right now..:music_whistling:

 

I ordered it a week ago, and it got here today..! A lot quicker than I expected..!

 

So tonight is dedicated to making the matrix and finally connecting the collective and pedals (with Hall Effect sensort).

 

FINALLY I get to actually try DCS Blackshark..! YAHOOO..!

 

And this card ROCKS..! I made a simple 6x6 matrix like Leo Bodnar describes on he's website:

 

 

... I have connected all sorts of strange sh*t to it now. And it just works..! I even thought I had ruined it by being a bit "cross-eyed" when soldering, but it still works just fine.. Good Job Leo bodnar..!:thumbup:

 

Leo's Website: http://www.leobodnar.com/

Edited January 15, 2009 by Triggerhappy69