Photos of filed down VKB adapter on TM F/A-18C grip

[streakeagle]

I had to do a bit of filing to make the VKB TM Warthog grip adapter fit the new TM F/A-18C Hornet grip. I only had a large metal file and was more interested in getting it to fit than making it look pretty, but it works perfectly. I really like this grip and it works great on the VKB Gunfighter base with this slightly rounded off adapter.

 

 

[BMGZ06]

This is interesting that you go thte TM grip to work since I wondered if there was a way to use it. I have the Warthog stick but I want to get a new more precise stick ad base. I am trying to decide on the VKB and which one to go with either the short or long with the MCG Pro grip since I want more buttons than the F14 grip has unless I can get the F18 grip and mount it like you did.

 

Any advice on which to go with in terms of short or long grips and how to do this F18 grip mod would be great! I am really sick of the lack of precision on feel in the TMW stick and do not want to rip it apart and try to modify it to work better and still not be as good as the VKB or VPC bases.

[streakeagle]

VKB makes an adapter for the Warthog grip. They were out of stock for the longest time. When they came in stock, I presumed it would work with the F/A-18C grip, so I bought two of them. The first one installed without issues into the Warthog grip as advertised. But the bulged area for the F/A-18C grip's pinky lever prevented the second adapter from fitting. So I rounded down the offending edge until I could see daylight through the gap. I can't remember if I neede to file any of the mount on the inside part. That is to say, I recall doing so, but after I got the one edge rounded enough, I may not have needed to file anything else. But if I did file anything else, it was quick and easy to get clearance to fit into the F/A-18C grip wtihout damaging the grip.

 

VKB should revise their adapter design to fit the F/A-18C grip, which would still fit perfectly in the Warthog grip, then they wouldn't need separate listings/part numbers.

 

Of my 6 grips that I can use with the VKB gunfighter base, the F/A-18C is currently my favorite because it is comfortable to hold, feels solid, and is a reasonable representation of the grips used in many US fighters. The F-14 grip would be my 2nd favorite, but its lack of extra hats means that it is only well suited for older US fighters with B-8 grips.

 

But if you want one grip to rule them all and don't mind the size/shape/odd control layout, the MCG Pro has the control options to mimic the locations/types of switches of just about any grip and aside from its Virpil twin, it is the only one with the analog brake lever used in Russian aircraft and the Spitfire Mk IX. While it has as many hats or more than any US grip, they are arranged in a peculiar way. It still works great when you get used to the layout, but I would still rather use the Warthog grip for the A-10C and F-16C and the F/A-18C grip for just about everything else. If spend lots of time in the A-10C, F-16C, and/or F/A-18C, and don't need the analog brake lever, the SCG Pro is much more suited to US sticks than the MCG Pro. I would use the SCG Pro a lot if I didn't have the F/A-18C grip.

[BMGZ06]

VKB makes an adapter for the Warthog grip. They were out of stock for the longest time. When they came in stock, I presumed it would work with the F/A-18C grip, so I bought two of them. The first one installed without issues into the Warthog grip as advertised. But the bulged area for the F/A-18C grip's pinky lever prevented the second adapter from fitting. So I rounded down the offending edge until I could see daylight through the gap. I can't remember if I neede to file any of the mount on the inside part. That is to say, I recall doing so, but after I got the one edge rounded enough, I may not have needed to file anything else. But if I did file anything else, it was quick and easy to get clearance to fit into the F/A-18C grip wtihout damaging the grip.

 

VKB should revise their adapter design to fit the F/A-18C grip, which would still fit perfectly in the Warthog grip, then they wouldn't need separate listings/part numbers.

 

Of my 6 grips that I can use with the VKB gunfighter base, the F/A-18C is currently my favorite because it is comfortable to hold, feels solid, and is a reasonable representation of the grips used in many US fighters. The F-14 grip would be my 2nd favorite, but its lack of extra hats means that it is only well suited for older US fighters with B-8 grips.

 

But if you want one grip to rule them all and don't mind the size/shape/odd control layout, the MCG Pro has the control options to mimic the locations/types of switches of just about any grip and aside from its Virpil twin, it is the only one with the analog brake lever used in Russian aircraft and the Spitfire Mk IX. While it has as many hats or more than any US grip, they are arranged in a peculiar way. It still works great when you get used to the layout, but I would still rather use the Warthog grip for the A-10C and F-16C and the F/A-18C grip for just about everything else. If spend lots of time in the A-10C, F-16C, and/or F/A-18C, and don't need the analog brake lever, the SCG Pro is much more suited to US sticks than the MCG Pro. I would use the SCG Pro a lot if I didn't have the F/A-18C grip.

 

Ya they should do that you are right then it would be easy to swap grips. I was going to order the GF III with F14 grip and adapter but they do not have the adapters and the NA VKB rep said he has no idea when they will get them back. I may just get the GF mkIII with the MCG grip and their desk mount for center stick with 200mm ext.

 

I am hoping it will help me with AAR. I have only been able to get the Hornet hooked up 3 times then disconnect because i cant get the movement fine tuned enough with curves and deadzones with the TMW stick.

[streakeagle]

You can't go wrong with the MCG Pro / GF3 combo with the 20 cm extension. It is smooth and precise. I don't use any curves or deadzones. A good stick like this combined with VR is the way to go. VR give you a better sense of your attitude/rate of motion. The stick gives you the smooth precision you need to make small, exact adjustments. It makes flying helicopters much easier, too.

[BMGZ06]

You can't go wrong with the MCG Pro / GF3 combo with the 20 cm extension. It is smooth and precise. I don't use any curves or deadzones. A good stick like this combined with VR is the way to go. VR give you a better sense of your attitude/rate of motion. The stick gives you the smooth precision you need to make small, exact adjustments. It makes flying helicopters much easier, too.

 

Ya I have VR already. I am just wondering now if I should get VKB's desk mounts or Monstertech. Foxxmounts would nice but the wait is crazy long.

[dburne]

Ya I have VR already. I am just wondering now if I should get VKB's desk mounts or Monstertech. Foxxmounts would nice but the wait is crazy long.

 

I am using the Gunfighter Mk III Pro L with MCG Pro grip and absolutely love it. The L comes with the 20cm extension. I have been using the MK III since Jan on almost a daily basis. There is a link in my sig to my review of it.

 

I also have the Monster Tech Mounts. I use the extended mount for my extended Gunfighter, and the standard mount for my Warthog throttle. Love these mounts, they are very well built and are so quick and easy to mount to the desk and remove.

 

[streakeagle]

I am more of a "do-it-yourself" kind of guy when it comes to chair, throttle mounts, and stick mounts.

[BMGZ06]

I am using the Gunfighter Mk III Pro L with MCG Pro grip and absolutely love it. The L comes with the 20cm extension. I have been using the MK III since Jan on almost a daily basis. There is a link in my sig to my review of it.

 

I also have the Monster Tech Mounts. I use the extended mount for my extended Gunfighter, and the standard mount for my Warthog throttle. Love these mounts, they are very well built and are so quick and easy to mount to the desk and remove.

 

 

Ya that looks like a nice way to go. Is the pressure able to be increased a lot? I want to be able to have a heavier stick setting for the Tomcat since it is so easy to over stress it with a floppy light stick. I know that this is not the case in the real plane. I was lucky enough to talk to a Tomcat pilot years ago and he told me the stick gets pretty heavy at speed so going up to 10g is not easy but certainly possible, but you cant accidentally do it unless you are a gorilla.

 

I am more of a "do-it-yourself" kind of guy when it comes to chair, throttle mounts, and stick mounts.

 

I would love to do that but I lack the time, tools, and skill set.:D

[dburne]

It definitely has a progressive increase in pressure as the stick is moved to the extremes. And of course spring choice and number of springs can affect that as well.

I use one each #50 spring on each axis and it feels just great for me with the extension.

[BMGZ06]

It definitely has a progressive increase in pressure as the stick is moved to the extremes. And of course spring choice and number of springs can affect that as well.

I use one each #50 spring on each axis and it feels just great for me with the extension.

 

Ya I am looking forward to it. I just ordered the GF3 MCG Pro L and also ordered the MT Long desk mount with additional plate for my warthog stick just in case. I assume you can easily remove the 20cm extension if I want a super short throw?

[streakeagle]

The extension has the same kind of connection as the grip, so it is easily removed

 

My setup was designed for a real F-4 stick, but I got tired of cleaning pots almost nightly to get rid of noise spikes, so I shoe-horned a Warthog stick with a straight 15 cm extension in its place. It was a perfect fit in terms of height and the range of throw in the pitch axis compared to the real thing. When I got the MCG Pro, the 20 cm extension caused two problems: it is too long and it is curved. I could still use it, but it was less than ideal. Because the MCG Pro is such a long grip, it is almost the right height with the VKB straight 10 cm extension. But I need a 15 cm straight extension to use with the other normal, shorter grips. I have aluminum tubing with the right inside and outside diamters to use the fittings and cable from the VKB 20 cm extension I just need to cut it to various useful lengths and drill the necessary holes, maybe 12.5 cm, 15 cm, 17.5 cm and 20 cm.

 

As for the springs, I didn't read the manual and was inspired by someone elses post here to try 2 x #50 springs on each axis. The textbook limit is 2 x #40. One of the bearings on my roll axis failed. I was able to replace the bearing. I tried 2 x #40 and went back to 1 x #50. That leaves the stick fairly easy to move near the center, but still requires some pull to reach the full back position. I love the smooth increase in spring force as you pull back. It's the next best thing to force feedback.

[BMGZ06]

The extension has the same kind of connection as the grip, so it is easily removed

 

My setup was designed for a real F-4 stick, but I got tired of cleaning pots almost nightly to get rid of noise spikes, so I shoe-horned a Warthog stick with a straight 15 cm extension in its place. It was a perfect fit in terms of height and the range of throw in the pitch axis compared to the real thing. When I got the MCG Pro, the 20 cm extension caused two problems: it is too long and it is curved. I could still use it, but it was less than ideal. Because the MCG Pro is such a long grip, it is almost the right height with the VKB straight 10 cm extension. But I need a 15 cm straight extension to use with the other normal, shorter grips. I have aluminum tubing with the right inside and outside diamters to use the fittings and cable from the VKB 20 cm extension I just need to cut it to various useful lengths and drill the necessary holes, maybe 12.5 cm, 15 cm, 17.5 cm and 20 cm.

 

As for the springs, I didn't read the manual and was inspired by someone elses post here to try 2 x #50 springs on each axis. The textbook limit is 2 x #40. One of the bearings on my roll axis failed. I was able to replace the bearing. I tried 2 x #40 and went back to 1 x #50. That leaves the stick fairly easy to move near the center, but still requires some pull to reach the full back position. I love the smooth increase in spring force as you pull back. It's the next best thing to force feedback.

 

I will see how it goes with the extension. I have no idea when I will get the stick right now but hopefully in the next 2 weeks. I am having all sorts of control issues in the hornet with performing proper carrier breaks and landings. Either too much or too little correction and over banking is super easy with the warthog and no resistance. The engines in the hornet seem to respond really slow for me where the Viper is super responsive.

[dburne]

Ya I am looking forward to it. I just ordered the GF3 MCG Pro L and also ordered the MT Long desk mount with additional plate for my warthog stick just in case. I assume you can easily remove the 20cm extension if I want a super short throw?

 

Yes you can very easily remove the extension.

[BMGZ06]

Streak do you use your F18 grip much with the VKB? I am waiting for the adapters to be ready for shipping but wondered about the weight of the F18 grip and how it may mess up the feel of the base. I mean they deigned it to work with the light grips they have. I am still going back and forth with getting VKB F14 grip as well. The MCG Pro is just so versatile.

[streakeagle]

Streak do you use your F18 grip much with the VKB? I am waiting for the adapters to be ready for shipping but wondered about the weight of the F18 grip and how it may mess up the feel of the base. I mean they deigned it to work with the light grips they have. I am still going back and forth with getting VKB F14 grip as well. The MCG Pro is just so versatile.

 

I use an extension and single #50 springs. I have zero problems with the weight of the TM grips when mounted on my VKB. I do not use the special Warthog cam... it has a strong detent feel. If I wanted my stick to feel like that, I would have just kept using the Warthog! The regular smooth cam centers just fine despite the extra weight.

 

My grip use based on my flying habits in order of how often I use them:

 

Random aircraft and don't want to constantly quit out to swap grips, I use the MCG Pro.

 

F-14 or older American aircraft, I use the F-14 grip.

 

Modern American aircraft and don't want to swap grips, use the TM Hornet grip.

 

A-10C or F-16C, I use the TM Warthog grip.

 

Bf109K4, Fw190A8, or Fw190D9, I use the KG12 grip.

 

The Hornet grip and the F-14 grip are my favorite ones, but the MCG Pro is just too convenient, so it sees the most use. But I have been flying the F-14 Tomcat quite a bit lately and I really love using the grip with it. I did some fancy programming tricks to make it more useful in other aircraft, so it is now a really good choice for flying anything with a B-8 style grip like the F-5, F-86, and UH-1 or earlier stuff like the P-51D. Lately, I have been focusing on multiplayer, so I have stuck to the MCG Pro to make sure I have good mapping for every aircraft in the game available while I am online.

 

The KG12 was an early budget design. I would like to see VKB follow through with the high-end one they were planning to make that would be both a better replica and higher quality, but it should also reflect the capabilities of their latest grips (and those of competitors) that maximize the capabilities of every available button/lever while maintaining replica appearance: i.e. position sensing for both up and down for the flip-down trigger, making buttons 4-way hats with center-depress, twist grip base, etc.

[BMGZ06]

Gotcha. Well I will likely buy the F14 grip along with the hornet adapter when it is available. I dont want to pay shipping twice. Then I will grab the hornet stick for the hornet since I fly it a lot but I am flying the F14 again as well and any extra realism is welcomed. I fly in MP a lot as well and the MCG grip is great for basically any plane really. Since I can tank the F14, 18 and 16 now I am finally combat effective with them all.

[Gman109]

Hey Streakealge, figured you might mod yourself a way to fit the TM Hornet grip to the VKB base. I have a couple adapters incoming, and I'm going to try to do the same, as I also feel the Hornet grip is my favorite, that or the TM Cougar stick.

 

Question - do you think your affinity for the TM Hornet stick is partially because of its "stronger" and more metallic construction than other options? One of the reasons I like the TM sticks so much is their solid, metal feel (I realize that the Hornet stick isn't as "metal" as the Cougar/WH stick), and not just their shape, although shape is a factor as well.

 

I don't have the KG12 LW VKB grip, is it plastic or metal Streak? I wish VKB and Virpil both would make grip options that were made of metal housings. IMO a GF2/3 or Warbrd base with a TM Hornet or Cougar/WH stick is the go-to base/stick combo available out there. If VKB made their MCG Pro in a metal housing, I'd buy 2 instantly.

 

Anyhow, thanks for the pics, I'll copy what you've done when I get my adapters in.

Edited June 9, 2020 by Gman109

[streakeagle]

VKB now sells adapters for the TM Hornet grip. You have to choose the drop-down option, Warthog or Hornet, when you order.

 

I actually don't care for metal with its cold and hard feel. I prefer the grips be identical to the real ones, which are not metal. Metal feels cold and hard. The Warthog grip is my least favorite grip. It has the cold, hard metal and the shape is not comfortable for me to hold. When I replaced the Warthog with the MCG Pro, going to the combination of plastic with a diamond texture and a rounded shape was a huge step up for me. The only losses were the odd control arrangement and the light weight. But there were gains in control options especially analog axis support and flip down trigger as well as the huge jump in the mechanical design and feel of the base.

 

My F-4 B-8 is heavy because it has metal through the center, but it is some sort of heavy industrial grade plastic or resin with a nice glossy finish for the actual grip.

 

I like grips that look and feel like the B-8. The TM Hornet grip is almost as comfortable as my B-8, yet has controls for more modern aircraft.

 

The F-14 grip is absolutely the next best thing to my B-8. The only way it could be better is to match the grade of plastic used on real grips. I do like the feeling of weight. So, if VKB used a metal core it would feel more like a real grip.

 

The KG12 is plastic. I think the flip safety trigger is metal.

[Gman109]

Thanks for the response. I'll pick up the KG12 anyway.

 

They are out of stock on the F18 adapters, and if the wait time is anything like the TM WH adapters was, I don't mind modding one of my WH adapters now that I'll have 3.

[Sokol1_br]

The KG12 is plastic. I think the flip safety trigger is metal.

 

KG-12B grip sell standalone or included in Gunfighter WWII has metal trigger.

 

This grip is no true replica, but inspired in real KG-12 grips, (IMO) their major lack is the diamond pattern texture on grip.

Edited June 10, 2020 by Sokol1_br

[streakeagle]

KG-12B grip sell standalone or included in Gunfighter WWII has metal trigger.

 

This grip is no true replica, but inspired in real KG-12 grips, (IMO) their major lack is the diamond pattern texture on grip.

 

1. The diamond texture is a big miss. The texture on the MCG Pro is nice. The rubber inlays that provide the texture on the F-14 grip are fantastic! I don't fault replica sticks for not having textures if the real ones didn't have textures, but the real KG series grips had very nice textures.

 

2. The top button to the left is a pov hat, but doesn't have a center depress function.

 

3. The top button at the center should have been another pov hat with center depress.

 

With those three fixes, I would recommend this stick, though there are other KG variants that would provide more control options. I still like using this grip while flying the Bf109 and Fw190s, but that is the only time I will use it.

[BMGZ06]

I am itching to get the F14 stick now that I am so into flying the F14 again. I was talking to a tech rep at EVGA today and he plays DCS also. He was thinking about getting the warthog stick and I think I talked him out of it and into getting a VKB stick and MFG pedals. I am telling everyone I fly with to get VKB and ditch the TM. They all have issues doing AAR and see that I do not. It has nothing to do with skill I tell them and everything to do with the gunfighter 3.

[streakeagle]

But don't throw away the TM grips... get adapters. The Warthog grip is still the way to go for the A-10C and F-16C and the Hornet grip is great for the AV-8B, F-15C, and F/A-18C.

 

I don't know if I should waste my money on a new Hornet adapter. I assume it has a different firmware so that it shows up in game as a hornet grip and not a warthog grip.

 

The problem with using the warthog adapter on the hornet grip is that they have slightly different button assignments and the game can't tell the difference between the two. But I could replace the one on the hornet grip and then I could have separate stick profiles in DCS. Right now, I have all aircraft except the F-16 and A-10C mapped to work correctly with the Hornet grip. So I have to switch grips to fly those two aircraft and switch back again to fly anything else. Of course, the MCG Pro is configured to work with everything to avoid the need to swap grips, which is why it ends up being my most used grip even though I prefer using either the hornet grip or the F-14 grip.

[VirusAM]

I bought the warthog adapter...because the hornet one is not in stock and i am tired of not using my hornet grip...so i couldn't wait anymore.

I have a 20cm extension but i cannot use it as i have not enough clearance forward (the grip touchs my desk).

So actually I am using an MCG pro (which I will sell) without extension and with the standard no center cams, 1 #20 and 1 #10 springs on the Y axis and 1 #20 spring on the X axis.

So my question...given the added weight of the Hornet grip, will be better to have more springs and cam with a center detent?

What do you advise?

 

Also i have seen a guy on facebook which managed to limit the throw of his Winwing stick using cable ties. Would be nice to limit Y axis forward and X axis like in many real planes (f18 and f14 among the others)