Checking to see how much interest in low cost $250 to $350 F16 throttle

[Osita]

Now I have the draft measurements of the FULL SIZE throttle. I would appreciate those of you who wish a smaller throttle to please share the top height that you want. Anyway here are the specs for the full size one...

 

 

Base Height: 10 cm

Base Length: 15 cm

Base Width: 12 cm (est)

 

 

Throttle arm length: 18.6 cm

 

 

Total height with throttle centered: 28.6 cm

 

 

Keep in mind that if you are mounting this in a cockpit, the intention is that the top of the base will be flush with the console, so the height will be 18.6 cm above the console surface. For a normal desktop mount it is too high, but if you mount it on a Virpil desk adaptor with a flat panel extenstion, you can *probably* use it comfortably on a desk setup at full height (assuming you're also using Virpil desk adaptor for the stick, then your arms are both about the same height of comfort for you personally).

 

 

Now what I need to know is the right height for the desk top version where you're not using any kind of adaptors. I am currently thinking an arm height above the top of the base to be between 6 to 8 cm (but keep in mind because of the throttle grip position and shape, with this arm height you won't get the full range of motion that would be possible with the larger size (I believe... haven't tested yet).

 

 

Motion range estimates from -60 degrees to +60 degrees. It may be a little more or less in each direction, because we haven't done any actual math or assembled anything yet. This is just to give some idea of what we expect. These measurements should be close to the real thing.

 

 

Also we're not at this stage planning on using realistic friction, and this will help us keep the cost down. We might use some kind of artificially induced tensioning that approximately simulates the feeling of the friction but you won't get that definite "click click" feeling as you move it. If nobody likes it, we'll reconsider, but keep in mind the idea here is to keep the cost down for you and making that friction assembly will require extra parts and extra machining.

 

 

All ideas, suggestions, and comments are most welcome.

[norbot]

Build an F-16 throttle in the quality and size of a TM Warthog and I'll be a new customer.

[Osita]

Build an F-16 throttle in the quality and size of a TM Warthog and I'll be a new customer.

 

 

Theirs is:

 

 

L = 24

W= 15

H = 12

 

 

This is provided for comparison to the details I provided earlier.

 

 

Thanks for your input on this.

[Mustang25]

Will you be including idle stop/AB gate in your design? I know at the price point it might not be feasible but I would welcome that addition!

[Osita]

Will you be including idle stop/AB gate in your design? I know at the price point it might not be feasible but I would welcome that addition!

 

 

Yes, and for the full sized version it will work in the same way as on the real control. But for smaller desktop version we may have to do it more F-14 style... that is something still to be figured out. We know for sure how to do it with the full sized one to get authentic cut off and AB detents that function identical to real F-16 throttle.

[Osita]

OK, looks like we're maxed out at 74. Is that as high as we're going to go?

[RogueSqdn]

I feel you’d get more responses if you posted in a few other places... maybe the F-16 forum here, the BMS forum, and Reddit.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[Osita]

I feel you’d get more responses if you posted in a few other places... maybe the F-16 forum here, the BMS forum, and Reddit.

 

 

Thanks RS, but I am not sure how to do that properly. Would I just post a link to this thread? Is that even allowed in the other boards?

[RogueSqdn]

You can post a link to this thread on Hoggit, but I'm not sure if you can do that on the BMS forum. You may want to contact one of their mods.

 

Viperpits.org might be another spot for you to gauge interest.

[Osita]

Thanks. I've never really been able to get into Viperpits, though, because of the bug in their registration page (it asks a bunch of ridiculous questions with one that is almost impossible to answer, and when finally the right answer is discovered, then it says "wait for a human to review your application" and they never do). Somebody said somewhere that the admin of that forum abandoned it but left it up, so apparently only people who are existing members can use it.

[Osita]

OK guys, quick update... we're talking with the govt to get some funding so we won't have to mess around with kickstarter or that kind of thing, hopefully. I think we're about a 75% chance of getting that development funding approved. We're also starting plans to develop the prototype for it. Might be not too long to wait, I will update as often as I have new info to share.

[Furiz]

Well atm on the market I can't find newer f16 throttle only old stuff, but anything new that comes out is very high quality product that costs a ton of money,

 

 

 

for example to have a real simulator f-16 stick you have to dish out 810€ for cheaper version (lmao) and for the high end version 1110€...

 

I can buy pretty decent computer for that money, add a quality throttle to that, about 400€ and you are in debt lol

 

 

so that is 1210€ for cheap and 1510€ expensive version.

 

 

 

If there is a HOTAS stick and throttle for 300€ doesn't have to be of awesome quality, something like TM T16000M FCS HOTAS quality, as long as its a replica F16 or F18 etc..., I'd buy it instant.

 

But handing over 1200€ for a HOTAS (a game peripheral) is a bit too much.

 

 

I bet there is tons of people out there like me who would do the same and buy those cheaper replicas.

[Osita]

for example to have a real simulator f-16 stick you have to dish out 810€ for cheaper version (lmao) and for the high end version 1110€... I can buy pretty decent computer for that money, add a quality throttle to that, about 400€ and you are in debt lol

 

 

That is exactly why we're doing this project. I mean no disrespect to the high end manufacturers, but most people out there are have to make difficult choices about how to spend their money, and the pricing for some sim parts is just a bit unfair.

 

 

 

I've discovered recently that it's often more unfair than it seems, because if you open some of those expensive products up (no don't do it, you'll probably wreck them and lose your investment) it's amazing how cheap the internals are, and sometimes even not well assembled.

 

 

I could cite the TM warthog stick as a good example. The connector for this, where it attaches to the base, uses a PS/2 style connector, the same kind that used to be normal for a mouse and keyboard before USB was invented. This is, in my opinion, a huge mistake. That's not even taking into account that it's not a very high quality PS/2 connector, made with metal that is too soft and thin.

 

 

It should not take a Masters degree in engineering to work out that using a design that relies on thin metal pins to support a >1kg stick that will undergo a lot of extreme motion, including possible torsion, is not a fantastic idea.

 

 

To be fair, though, it's one of the cheapest realistic sticks on the market. Plus the problem is far more likely to affect you if you use a stick extension than if you just plug it directly into the base like you're supposed to.

 

 

But I think it's frustrating to have to pay $200+ to replace that thing when the pins get bent, because it would probably not have been difficult to use a stronger connector type.

[Furiz]

Wait you building just the throttle or the whole HOTAS set? Stick and throttle

[Osita]

For now we are only planning to do the throttle because TM already makes a decent enough (but weak) F-16 grip. What we might do is create a converter kit for the TM base and grip so it won't break as easy. Just have to come up with some way that anyone could do it without needing to know about electronics, etc. I would definitely like to do this part of the project, but we'll get the throttle done first and then look at what else can be done.

[Osita]

Hmmm.... wonder where the poll has disappeared to?? The forum upgrade giveth, and then the forum upgrade taketh away....

[Osita]

Update: It's going to take about 60 working days to know if we're getting the funding support. It's not that big of a deal, so don't worry.... Even without the funding, we'll still give it our best shot, just slower.

[Supmua]

A lot of people own TM devices, so making add ons that would improve their performance or usability is definitely a good idea. But of course throttle should come first.

[Myrsnipe]

Thanks. I've never really been able to get into Viperpits, though, because of the bug in their registration page (it asks a bunch of ridiculous questions with one that is almost impossible to answer, and when finally the right answer is discovered, then it says "wait for a human to review your application" and they never do). Somebody said somewhere that the admin of that forum abandoned it but left it up, so apparently only people who are existing members can use it.

 

I had issues with this as well, but it turns out they WONT contact you, when you do the registration theres a line of text that tells you to send an email. It took me a few days from sending it to getting access. Viperpits is by my estimates a bit archaic, but there is for sure a very dedicated F16 sim community there.

 

As for your throttle, an F16 style throttle would be amazing, even just a quality grip would be nice. I can always engineer my own mechanical solution, but high quality injection plastic molds are hard to do for a hobbyist

[Osita]

heh... that's funny! I've been fuming about that ever since I signed up and never heard back from them!