Su-25T first flight

[cobrabase]

My first impression. It feels like flying a shopping cart with a wobbly wheel full of bombs while wearing a football helmet.... and I LIKE IT :thumbup:

 

I picked a random airbase to just make a familiarization flight and got to it. Nearly ran off the runway on takeoff. The tricycle landing gear is placed closely together I see. This should make cross-wind landings... um... fun.

 

Landing for the first time... well... let's just say that I'm not dead. My random airbase did not have an ILS so I had to land by eye my first time. Kept speed close to 240 and was flying with full fuel but no weaps. Was used to the drooping nose of the flanker so when I put the front wheel down I gave it way too much pressure. Didn't know this at first. I was wondering what the heck the vibration was as I taxied until I noticed on F2 view that my front tire had blown. :doh:

 

How cool is that?! They really did do a great damage model!!! :pilotfly:

[Boberro]

Yes, the flight'look and targeting are esences of this plane. Cool you landed at 240 km\h, I often damage gear at this speed, so I land from 350-about 450 if enough runway. Anyway welcome on ours bomber league :D

[Dunkan Aidaho]

350?!!!! O_o

[Boberro]

Yes, this is why 25T's parachute is is important :D, Even 45o is not so huge speed during landing - if the runway is long, you'll easy brake :)

Edited July 14, 2008 by Boberro

[Dunkan Aidaho]

As far as I remember, fully loaded Su-25T needs only 1/3 of shortest LockOn runaway to stop without using a parachute, if landed properly.

 

I think tires will blow at 400+km/h, although I never tried to land in that way:)

[Case]

Don't you also rip the parachute apart if you use it at any speed above 250km/h?

 

I always put a big sign in the cockpit of my 25T. It says, in big letters:

PATIENCE

Use patience when landing, use patience when attacking targets... without patience you'll suffer from pilot overload and mess up... badly.

[Shaman]

PATIENCE

and humility

[Boberro]

Don't you also rip the parachute apart if you use it at any speed above 250km/h?

 

I always put a big sign in the cockpit of my 25T. It says, in big letters:

PATIENCE

Use patience when landing, use patience when attacking targets... without patience you'll suffer from pilot overload and mess up... badly.

 

Parachute is R.I.P. above 300+km\h ;]

[Renato71]

If runway is getting too short, and parachute is MIA, KIA or RIP, shortly after touchdown retract your gear (while all three rubbers are on the ground). You will skid and stop on RWY surface (or nearby), but will not drive into the cabbage field next door, and to far away to repair.

 

Retract gear while you are still going above 300, as you will keep your rudder control. Otherwise you could skid to a side as wheels could retract assimetrically at the lower speeds.

[GGTharos]

You're doing it wrong. ;)

Although N/A LOMAC, high landing speeds are bad for the tyres, and present a skidding hazard in weather. In addition, it may cause you to bounce and give you trouble with the wing-in-ground effect. Learn to land properly! ;)

 

so I land from 350-about 450 if enough runway

[Boberro]

You're doing it wrong. ;)

 

I know I am doing it wrong. Many things in LO I do wrong (example usually I fire R-27EM from helmet mode lol), application let you do it so why not :D

 

Although N/A LOMAC, high landing speeds are bad for the tyres, and present a skidding hazard in weather. In addition, it may cause you to bounce and give you trouble with the wing-in-ground effect. Learn to land properly! ;)

 

Hahah GG mate what for? If LO can't represent it properly (which u mentioned, about bad for tyres, skidding hazard ect....) so there is no any need to do it. Of course I know that IR this in this brick you wouldn't land at 450 and fly cabrio :D But for now it is as it is ;]

Edited July 14, 2008 by Boberro

[nscode]

If you even ask that it's useless trying to explain why :)

[Vekkinho]

 

Landing for the first time... well... let's just say that I'm not dead. My random airbase did not have an ILS so I had to land by eye my first time.

 

:huh: No ILS?!!

 

Which airbase is that?!

 

IIRC, all airfields in LOFC have ILS, right?!!

[Esac_mirmidon]

I think a more suitable approach speed is around 280 km/h and contact speed about 260 km/h.

 

In this speed ranges i never have a problem if the vertical speed is near 0, and you do not abuse using breaks. My tires must last long enough, if not my commander in chief in the squad could ask for pay new ones.

[RedTiger]

I know I am doing it wrong. Many things in LO I do wrong (example usually I fire R-27EM from helmet mode lol), application let you do it so why not :D

 

 

 

Hahah GG mate what for? If LO can't represent it properly (which u mentioned, about bad for tyres, skidding hazard ect....) so there is no any need to do it. Of course I know that IR this in this brick you wouldn't land at 450 and fly cabrio :D But for now it is as it is ;]

 

I think his point might be that you're gonna wish you learned the right way when you snap your landing gear like twigs when you hit it that fast in a future DCS module. ;) Not that I did, mind you. Three blown tires, one ripped chute, and a skidding stop perpendicular to the runway is a successful landing for me in that tub. Anything above that is gravy! :D

Edited July 14, 2008 by RedTiger

[GGTharos]

Oh, I'm just waiting to see a bloopers video after Black Shark comes out - with people's landings. Learn paying attention to detail TODAY and do it right, and you'll suffer less in the future. ;)

You're playing a FLIGHT SIMULATION, so what's the deal with gaming it? ;)

[Vekkinho]

IIRC...there was a thread entitled "Every landing you walk away from"...

 

LOFC let's you decide conditions you'll face in game...so in the begining set no winds at all, no turbulence, max visibility. Believe me you'll have to hammer out those landings in perfect conditions to move onto more sophisticated conditions like "no flaps" or "single engine" landings which you might experience in combat!

 

Believe me RL pilots do the same thing in simulators, so start without weather...

 

Also practice race track legs over airbase of choice (run in, break perpendicular to runway, downwind, final). Remember, runway lenghts differ in LOFC so bear that in mind!

 

Practice Touch and Go, with different fuel qtys. There's a huge difference in the way plane behaves when low on fuel compared to heavy fuel laden plane!

 

So when you accomplish 10/10 succesful landings upon each flight for 3 day in a roll, move onto more demanding conditions. Add some nosewind, crosswind, turbulence, turn off one of your engines, kill both of your engines, simulate a hydro failure by leaving your flaps raised, try maintaining a ideal airspeed and AoA without dragbrake help.

 

I know it takes a lot of time, but practice makes perfect!

[cobrabase]

:huh: No ILS?!!

 

Which airbase is that?!

 

IIRC, all airfields in LOFC have ILS, right?!!

 

There is one in the mountains that is isolated that does not have ILS. It's featured in Ironhand's tutorials.

[cobrabase]

I think a more suitable approach speed is around 280 km/h and contact speed about 260 km/h.

 

In this speed ranges i never have a problem if the vertical speed is near 0, and you do not abuse using breaks. My tires must last long enough, if not my commander in chief in the squad could ask for pay new ones.

 

ESac I love your Clint Eastwood flash! Request permission to use it. Firefox is one of my favorite movies and books. Have you read the Sequel?

[RedTiger]

Oh, I'm just waiting to see a bloopers video after Black Shark comes out - with people's landings. Learn paying attention to detail TODAY and do it right, and you'll suffer less in the future. ;)

You're playing a FLIGHT SIMULATION, so what's the deal with gaming it? ;)

 

:lol:

 

I've decided that one of the first things I'm going to do with Black Shark is hop into a Ka-50 on the tarmac, already running, and just try to fly it. No reading the manual or anything...just to see if I can. I plan on recording a track of it for everyone's amusement! :clown_2:

[Vekkinho]

There is one in the mountains that is isolated that does not have ILS. It's featured in Ironhand's tutorials.

 

?!!

 

Perhaps a road?!

 

Can you post a map screenshot (F10) of that runway with coordinates, please?!!

 

 

I know that every default AB in LOFC has an ILS provision! But not every runway! There are two airstrips in Sochi/Adler AB but only 24-06 has ILS! Landing on a 20-02 requires visual! Is that what U mean?!

[Dunkan Aidaho]

You guys just lucky that Su-25 is very forgiving aircraft especially in terms of hard landings. You need to do something very extraordinary to crash her without crosswind.

Ka-50 will be much more strict in landings. It is not the thing which you can throw from third floor and expect to find it in one piece on the ground, like Su-25.

[GGTharos]

I only have a couple pieces of advice to offer you:

 

Trim, trim TRIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIM! :D

And, be proactive and precise on the rudder.

 

If you can pull these off, you can do it! :D

 

Ok, I'll add a couple more things ...

If you need full collective, you're doing it wrong.

If the chopper screams at you, you're also doing it wrong (potentially too fast, or in vortex ring).

 

Anyway, you can do it! :D

 

:lol:

 

I've decided that one of the first things I'm going to do with Black Shark is hop into a Ka-50 on the tarmac, already running, and just try to fly it. No reading the manual or anything...just to see if I can. I plan on recording a track of it for everyone's amusement! :clown_2:

[Renato71]

Back to the topic...

 

As for ILS - I think cobrabase approached from opposite direction. When you choose approach mode you have to follow skiny arrow on HSI.

 

As for speed, yes you can land as low as 250, but you have to align RWY from far away, or you will not be able to maneuver. What Boberos forgot to mention, and we both learned that online, during fast rotation combat missions you do not align from 15-25 km away. You align over inner or max middle marker, turning from a sharp banked turn. And you cannot make such turn bellow 300 km/h, especially if you are damaged. You have to keep your speed around 320-350.

 

Simultaneously there is no point in stopping the plane too early, as you will have to short RWY in front of you for take off, or you will have to taxi back. You make high speed run (100-120 km/h) to the far end. It take less time to rotate and you are clear of RWY sooner. And large number of airports does not have properly aligned taxiways which you could use to clear the RWY. You have to go further then you would like to.

 

I use only fast and low approach, doing bellow 350 up to 1-2 km from RWY, slightly under GP. Aribrakes, touchdown around 280-320, brakes, parachute out at 250, parachute jettison at 100, rolling until I see taxiway, turn off engines, still rolling on, and by the time I turn into taxiway engines are at 0%. If I'm alone or with small number of squadron buddies on my side, I shut the engines off before or at the moment of touchdown.

[GGTharos]

350 is a bit too high for touch-down ... 260 is marginal, 240 sound like proper aproach speed. But you're right, you do your maneuvering at 350 or so. The proper aproach is an overhead aproach, starting your pitch-out over the runway at 630 or so.

 

EDIT: I just tried it. Overhead landings with the Su-25T work beautifully, and you'll land easily at 260 or 240 even. I tried with a clean Su-25T, full of fuel. This is probably the most efficient and elegant way to land your frog.

Edited July 15, 2008 by GGTharos