Kusch Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 Indian Su-30MKI enroute to Red Flag '08 Over Italy: http://livefist.blogspot.com/ Give me "flying telephone pole" (SA-2)! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vekkinho Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 Thanks Kusch! IIRC Indian Flankers already participated in some exercise over UK during spring! It's been mentioned that Su-30MKI was ECM stripped during the exercise or pilots weren't allowed to use ECM and certain N011P Bars radar modes during the participation! I wonder how true was that! Another interesting reading can be found a bit lower in the link Kusch posted or here: http://livefist.blogspot.com/2008/07/force-mag-lch-prototype-by-october.html 1 [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mvsgas Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 Oh man really, thanks Kusch. I wish I was there to see them up close. To whom it may concern, I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that. Thank you for you patience. Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kusch Posted July 18, 2008 Author Share Posted July 18, 2008 A member of the Indian air force marshals in a Sukhoi Su-30 MKI on the flight line, July 13, here at Lajes Field. http://www.lajes.af.mil/shared/media/photodb/photos/080713-F-4964T-01.JPG http://www.lajes.af.mil/shared/media/photodb/photos/080713-F-4964T-02.JPG Give me "flying telephone pole" (SA-2)! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulman Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 Thanks Kusch! IIRC Indian Flankers already participated in some exercise over UK during spring! It's been mentioned that Su-30MKI was ECM stripped during the exercise or pilots weren't allowed to use ECM and certain N011P Bars radar modes during the participation! I wonder how true was that! Another interesting reading can be found a bit lower in the link Kusch posted or here: http://livefist.blogspot.com/2008/07/force-mag-lch-prototype-by-october.html I don't believe it was a matter of permission, more mutual consent. The Typhoon's also had cold noses for the exercise. If you think about it from an operational security standpoint, both parties benefit from it. I'm sure the IAF doesn't want the RAF gaining vital intel on that radar set; likewise the crabs won't be happy if the Russians learn about the Typhoon kit prematurely. I saw one of those MKI's at Fairford. They really are bloody enormous! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 This is silly; they can be fitted with versions of software that do not contain war reserve modes - I guess you might learn of the actual radar operating frequency and PRF, and perhaps some 'always on' ECCM features such as PRF and frequency hopping, but all that can be re/de-programmed. The Russians probably know more about the Typhoon that RF would probably provide already - Tiffies have intercepted bear bombers, and if you think that those bombers weren't packed to the GILLS with ELINT equipment to capture radar and radio signals, well ... ;) I don't believe it was a matter of permission, more mutual consent. The Typhoon's also had cold noses for the exercise. If you think about it from an operational security standpoint, both parties benefit from it. I'm sure the IAF doesn't want the RAF gaining vital intel on that radar set; likewise the crabs won't be happy if the Russians learn about the Typhoon kit prematurely. I saw one of those MKI's at Fairford. They really are bloody enormous! 1 [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kusch Posted July 23, 2008 Author Share Posted July 23, 2008 Give me "flying telephone pole" (SA-2)! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eurofor Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 Those beasts are beautiful! Thanks for sharing! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mvsgas Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 Man those things are huge. To whom it may concern, I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that. Thank you for you patience. Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedTiger Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 I must admit, I'm a sucker for LERXs! Almost too pretty to be a fighter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mugatu Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 I hope the F-22s will be hunting them down on their A2G sorties :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 IIRC the F-22's won't be participating. I guess they have to make it fair somehow ;) [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nscode Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 Or the new Service Pack is late? ;) 1 Never forget that World War III was not Cold for most of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 Rather unlikely. I don't see how participants would get anything out of RF by getting shot down by F-22's. The USAF would, but not the other participants; it would be very let's say, rude of the USAF to waste the commitment of their guests in that fashion. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team Groove Posted July 24, 2008 ED Team Share Posted July 24, 2008 2 on 2 F-22s vs Su-30MKI`s WVR anyone ? Would be interesting to see the results. Our Forum Rules: http://forums.eagle.ru/rules.php#en Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 Dead Su-30's. The F-22 has huge excess TWR. 2 on 2 F-22s vs Su-30MKI`s WVR anyone ? Would be interesting to see the results. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team Groove Posted July 24, 2008 ED Team Share Posted July 24, 2008 you wish ;) AF says even F-5s are dangerous for F-22s in WVR^^ Our Forum Rules: http://forums.eagle.ru/rules.php#en Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 F-5's can't even stay in a turn with an F-22 at altitude ... what are you talking about? ;) We only have one pic of a raptor in a gunsight, and a that, out of all the WVR engagements there's something like 2-3 raptor kills vs. how many bandit kills? ;) [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nscode Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 (edited) Niice. Care to check it out? It sure would make allot of people button up their yaps. <<< USAF :P ;) Edited July 24, 2008 by nscode 1 Never forget that World War III was not Cold for most of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 I guess you have to be a hen if you're going to drop eggs all over someone's backyard ;) [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boberro Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 Niice. Care to check it out? It sure would make allot of people button up their yaps. <<< USAF :P ;) Hahah :megalol: Reminder: Fighter pilots make movies. Bomber pilots make... HISTORY! :D | Also to be remembered: FRENCH TANKS HAVE ONE GEAR FORWARD AND FIVE BACKWARD :D ಠ_ಠ ツ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4c Hajduk Veljko Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 F-22 is not built for super maneuverability. It will lose to TV flankers in WVR fight. Thermaltake Kandalf LCS | Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD3R | Etasis ET750 (850W Max) | i7-920 OC to 4.0 GHz | Gigabyte HD5850 | OCZ Gold 6GB DDR3 2000 | 2 X 30GB OCZ Vertex SSD in RAID 0 | ASUS VW266H 25.5" | LG Blue Ray 10X burner | TIR 5 | Saitek X-52 Pro | Logitech G930 | Saitek Pro flight rudder pedals | Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 ^^^^ You absolutely must have missed the F-22 demos out there, and completely misunderstood the specs. Yes, the F-22 is built to be very maneuverable. Very typical statement of you :D What's a TV flanker going to do? Assuming it 1. Knows that F-22 is coming 2. Has similar TWR (the MKI doesn't) to stay in the fight at altitude 3. Gets eyes on the 22 before the 22 gets in an advantageous position. What's the TV going to do for it if all those prerequisites don't magically line up? Try a kulbit? Talk about suicidal. And I'm not even talking about HOBS missile use here, in which the F-22 has an advantage - just guns. WVR fights will still look just how they looked in WWII. The details of slow speed fighting will change a little, but in general the dogfight will remain as it has. It'll still be about turn circles and energy. MKI's are energy-deficient compared to an F-22, especially at altitude. What are they going to do with the TV while dropping out of the sky? No, seriously. What is it they can do that the F-22 can't? [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilotasso Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 (edited) F-22 is not built for super maneuverability. It will lose to TV flankers in WVR fight. Your giving us a shoking knews because we all thought the Raptor was considered the only pane in the world that can use thrust vectoring for a barrel roll in 60º AOA and remain controlable. (for example);) Supermanueverability inlucludes high speed not just low speed, and the flanker is the king os controlled stalls the F-22 however is king of aerodynamic authority WITH TVC. All in all WVR who wins is the best pilot and that includes not going into the best part of the F-22's evelope up high where the flanker would be utterly unable to match, however down low to middle altitudes better BFM would spell de victor. I have seen enough drills to arrive the conclusion that this is tru even with highly dissimilar aircraft (to a degree of course, quoting an f-5 as an example is a pure abuse). However BVR is another ball game alltogether, and whoever disctates the rules at BVR will merge at a huge advantage. ;) Edited July 24, 2008 by Pilotasso [sigpic]http://forums.eagle.ru/signaturepics/sigpic4448_29.gif[/sigpic] My PC specs below:Case: Corsair 400C PSU: SEASONIC SS-760XP2 760W Platinum CPU: AMD RYZEN 3900X (12C/24T) RAM: 32 GB 4266Mhz (two 2x8 kits) of trident Z RGB @3600Mhz CL 14 CR=1T MOBO: ASUS CROSSHAIR HERO VI AM4 GFX: GTX 1080Ti MSI Gaming X Cooler: NXZT Kraken X62 280mm AIO Storage: Samsung 960 EVO 1TB M.2+6GB WD 6Gb red HOTAS: Thrustmaster Warthog + CH pro pedals Monitor: Gigabyte AORUS AD27QD Freesync HDR400 1440P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team Groove Posted July 24, 2008 ED Team Share Posted July 24, 2008 (edited) F-5's can't even stay in a turn with an F-22 at altitude ... what are you talking about? ;) We only have one pic of a raptor in a gunsight, and a that, out of all the WVR engagements there's something like 2-3 raptor kills vs. how many bandit kills? ;) Im talking about a official AF paper i saw somewhere. If i can motivate myself to find it, i know where to find you :D Heck, they even consider F-22s alone are not suitable for A2A, so a war deployment would be mixed up with F-15s. I think this one in the latest Air Force Montly or Janes Defence weekly, i cant remember anymore :| Edited July 24, 2008 by Groove Our Forum Rules: http://forums.eagle.ru/rules.php#en Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts