F/A18E/F Super Hornets block 1 and BLock 2 E/F ( lot 26)

[SilentSparrow]

12 hours ago, SkateZilla said:

2018 we still had USN Legacy Sqns deploying,

USMC C+ Airframes were never deployed (Full Time).

As for the MIG-29, there are other operators, so the Ministry wouldnt have a leg to stand on, however many might see it as poor taste to put out a fighter involved in a current conflict.

 

VFA-34 was the last one, and it left carrier service in 2018. The F-35 never was fully introduced until 2019.

Yes, they were never deployed full time. I believe this makes it seem like the Super Hornet is more necessary.

The MiG-29SMT and MiG-29M (The current variants) are very different than a MiG-29A 9-12, so that may not be totally right.

And finally, I can't find a way to differentiate between the Super Hornet Lots. Can someone please tell us all the differences between the Lot 20 and Lot 29 Hornet?

[F-2]

I get that the Marines didn’t want the Super Hornet because of the F-35. But with the hornet fleet basically being done and all those block 1 super hornets not doing anything it just seems like a waste.

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

19 hours ago, SilentSparrow said:

I know that. At the same time, if they make the MiG-29 9-12 and come under fire by the Russians, it wouldn't be the first time they've come under fire from a government (See: ED employee gets some F-16A/B manuals and ends up being considered as one of the most dangerous criminals in the world. No, I'm not joking.)

Yes, I think everyone's aware of that particular oopsie. But, there's a difference between getting the unfavorable civil attention of the US DoD and getting it from the RF MoD.

[SilentSparrow]

2 hours ago, F-2 said:

I get that the Marines didn’t want the Super Hornet because of the F-35. But with the hornet fleet basically being done and all those block 1 super hornets not doing anything it just seems like a waste.

As the USN has shown with VFA-97, they are entirely willing to retire a Super Hornet for an F-35. So, with the USMC's limited budget, they had to buy only F-35s. Their thinking was because of the aforementioned "There's nothing super about the super hornet" why buy F/A-18E/Fs and replace them with F-35s when you can just get the Panthers wholesale? (The F-35 is a better dogfighter, BVR fighter, basically better in everything. And yes, the F-35 can beat an F-18 in a one circle.)

2 hours ago, MiG21bisFishbedL said:

Yes, I think everyone's aware of that particular oopsie. But, there's a difference between getting the unfavorable civil attention of the US DoD and getting it from the RF MoD.

What exactly is that difference? None of ED's employees are in Russia anymore IIRC and even if they were the Russian MoD knows there's an FC3 MiG-29 that gives a near-perfect simulation so it won't be a big risk.

[F-2]

I get that, I just mean they seem so determined to keep the legacy hornet till 2030.

[SilentSparrow]

IIRC the USMC has said time and time again that they'd rather fly the Legacy Hornets instead of the Super Hornets. And the USMC has no interest in doing a ton of work for the Super Hornet (Logistics, Maintenance, ETC) when the F-35s are replacing everything by 2030. That's just 8 years out.

Edited December 2, 2022 by SilentSparrow

[SkateZilla]

Scroll Up and review pages, we literally discussed this for several pages.

5 hours ago, F-2 said:

I get that the Marines didn’t want the Super Hornet because of the F-35. But with the hornet fleet basically being done and all those block 1 super hornets not doing anything it just seems like a waste.

Most of LRIP1-3/Block Is have already trapped out, so they wont be able to goto the carriers anyway,
Several were transferred to USNFDT for Eval to be reserve units. The rest moth balled. there's not enough to send to the USMC for any type of usable capacity. they'd be in the same boat they are in now with the C+ Airframes.

[SilentSparrow]

Anyways, what are all the differences between Lot 20 and Lot 29 (Last Lot that came off the line with APG-73) Hornets?

[F-2]

19 minutes ago, SilentSparrow said:

Anyways, what are all the differences between Lot 20 and Lot 29 (Last Lot that came off the line with APG-73) Hornets?

That’s what Flight says but others mentioned 27, so I’m not totally sure.

[SilentSparrow]

I think it's Lot 29.

[SkateZilla]

14 hours ago, SilentSparrow said:

Anyways, what are all the differences between Lot 20 and Lot 29 (Last Lot that came off the line with APG-73) Hornets?

Like I said, Scroll up, back pages.

14 hours ago, F-2 said:

That’s what Flight says but others mentioned 27, so I’m not totally sure.

Flight is correct,

The ones in the BuNos list for block II w/ AESA have a small "1" next to them (barely visible unless you zoom in due to pixel density/font), and the "1" denotes the APG-79 was installed after roll off in the foot notes.

Edited December 3, 2022 by SkateZilla

[SilentSparrow]

The ACS I believe is only classified for the Block III. MSFS2020 has an F/A-18E modeled and has almost all of the ACS systems. Those that aren't there are used for combat and are already unclassified because the F/A-18C Lot 20 has a nearly identical cockpit to the MSFS2020 F/A-18E.

Furthermore, what exactly is the AMCD?

Also, in what page can I find the Lot 29 details? The link you shared only goes up to Lot 26, then pretty much left me in the dark.

Edited December 3, 2022 by SilentSparrow

[SkateZilla]

18 minutes ago, SilentSparrow said:

The ACS I believe is only classified for the Block III. MSFS2020 has an F/A-18E modeled and has almost all of the ACS systems. Those that aren't there are used for combat and are already unclassified because the F/A-18C Lot 20 has a nearly identical cockpit to the MSFS2020 F/A-18E.

Furthermore, what exactly is the AMCD?

Also, in what page can I find the Lot 29 details? The link you shared only goes up to Lot 26, then pretty much left me in the dark.

 

I can tell you right now, the VRS Super Bug has a lot of "we'll make it look official" features, but they aren't accurately emulated to the real thing.
The VRS Super Bug is also the most accurate of the MS Super Hornets, 

Also ACS is only in the F/G, not the E

Super Hornets from other developers are far from accurate, systems and flight models wise.

The ACS is classified wether it's Block II or Block III Airframe.
The System is the same, the only difference is instead of 2 MCDs and a 8x10 Display, the Block III Uses the Single Large Area Display.

Edited December 3, 2022 by SkateZilla

[SilentSparrow]

Are you sure that the ACS is the exact same? (I was talking about the inbuilt F/A-18E in MSFS2020 not the VRS one for FSX)

So is the Block I ACS unclassified? If so, what are the differences between Block I and II ACS?

[SkateZilla]

Lots 28+ Didnt have major changes, most of them are the export BuNos to Austraila and Kuwait, and USN Growlers 
Then the Block III Shift.

[SkateZilla]

21 minutes ago, SilentSparrow said:

Are you sure that the ACS is the exact same? (I was talking about the inbuilt F/A-18E in MSFS2020 not the VRS one for FSX)

So is the Block I ACS unclassified? If so, what are the differences between Block I and II ACS?

ACS was introduced in Block II,

ACS is The Rear Cockpit Systems for the WSO.

Replacing the Triple MCDs with a Dual MCD + 8x10 ACS Display

Block I WSO Cockpit:

 

Block II WSO Cockpit (ACS Station):

 

Block III WSO Cockpit(ACS Station w/ Large Area Display):

Edited December 3, 2022 by SkateZilla

[SilentSparrow]

Yeah, I'd guess that the ACS could be unclassified pretty soon and we can make a Lot 29 Hornet in DCS. But until then, we don't have one.

ED could make a Lot 25 then a Lot 29 when things unclassify, but I don't think ED is interested right now in making a regular model plane, Super model of the plane, and a Super Super model of the plane. Way too much work.

[SkateZilla]

Anything over Lot 26 has Classified components.

I don't know where anyone would assume Lot 29 is de-classified.

ACS isn't going to be de-classified anytime soon.
ACS is also not simulated in ANY FSX, FS2020 Aircraft.

ACS w/ AESA Enables Station Decoupling, Pilot can be in A2A Mode, and WSO can be in A2G Mode Simultaneously.
This is not possible on the Legacy Hornets, nor the LRIP and Block I Super Hornets due to AL Programing, Radar, and Coupled Cockpit controls. 

Block I, Has 3 MCDs and Flight Controls w/ Rudder pedals disconnected. or Left/Right Hand Controls (Depending on Lot, initial LRIP had Flight Sticks for Training).
Block II, Has ACS (Advanced Crew Station), Replacing Flight controls with Left/Right Hand Controls, Replacing Middle MCD with a 8x10 AMCD (Advanced Mission Computers and Display), Moving UFCD from bottom to the Top of the Display Stack.
Block III, Has ACS Replacing MCD/AMCD/UFCD w/ Large Area Display.

Edited December 3, 2022 by SkateZilla

[SilentSparrow]

5 hours ago, SkateZilla said:

Anything over Lot 26 has Classified components.

I don't know where anyone would assume Lot 29 is de-classified.

ACS isn't going to be de-classified anytime soon.
ACS is also not simulated in ANY FSX, FS2020 Aircraft.

ACS w/ AESA Enables Station Decoupling, Pilot can be in A2A Mode, and WSO can be in A2G Mode Simultaneously.
This is not possible on the Legacy Hornets, nor the LRIP and Block I Super Hornets due to AL Programing, Radar, and Coupled Cockpit controls. 

Block I, Has 3 MCDs and Flight Controls w/ Rudder pedals disconnected. or Left/Right Hand Controls (Depending on Lot, initial LRIP had Flight Sticks for Training).
Block II, Has ACS (Advanced Crew Station), Replacing Flight controls with Left/Right Hand Controls, Replacing Middle MCD with a 8x10 AMCD (Advanced Mission Computers and Display), Moving UFCD from bottom to the Top of the Display Stack.
Block III, Has ACS Replacing MCD/AMCD/UFCD w/ Large Area Display.

 

A2A + A2G? The F/A-18F is OP! Now I get why there's no shot of a Block II Super Hornet, so maybe ED could make a Lot 25 (Most advanced Rhino that's entirely unclassified).

[SilentSparrow]

However, can the ACS be split between A/A and A/G for Pilot and WSO in Lot 26 Hornets (I assume they are unclassified if I understand you correctly) with APG-73?

[F-2]

33 minutes ago, SilentSparrow said:

However, can the ACS be split between A/A and A/G for Pilot and WSO in Lot 26 Hornets (I assume they are unclassified if I understand you correctly) with APG-73?

Lot 26 is covered in the publicly available super hornet manual but I don’t recall anyone ever mentioning it as a possibility. In curious if later lots before they got the apg-79 had any such ability.

[SilentSparrow]

I think that the ACS that was aforementioned stops anything more than a Lot 26

[SkateZilla]

4 hours ago, F-2 said:

Lot 26 is covered in the publicly available super hornet manual but I don’t recall anyone ever mentioning it as a possibility. In curious if later lots before they got the apg-79 had any such ability.

ACS in the WSO works with APG-73, Decoupled Cockpits require APG-79

5 hours ago, SilentSparrow said:

However, can the ACS be split between A/A and A/G for Pilot and WSO in Lot 26 Hornets (I assume they are unclassified if I understand you correctly) with APG-73?

ACS is only in the WSO Cockpit.

And ACS itself is Classified, parts of it are covered in the NATOPS, but not all of it.

As Stated, Block II has classified systems from the start, regardless of what they roll off with AESA or not.

Edited December 4, 2022 by SkateZilla

[SilentSparrow]

So we will have to have Lot 25 after all.

[SilentSparrow]

Ok, so the same weapons, same radar, but a few differences. ED's starting from scratch on this new module.

Let's hope the Lot 25 F/A-18E/F happens. We can't get a Block II, so we will have to settle for the last model Block I.