TIL about WSPS on the Apache

[Lazerhawk]

Hi,

 

Until recently I didn't even know what a helicopter's WSPS is and I only learned of its existence when it was mentioned in one of Casmo's Apache videos.

 

Wikipedia: "The Wire Strike Protection System (WSPS) is a mechanical wire cutter designed to mitigate the risk of wire strikes whilst flying helicopters at low-level":

 

 

Looks like these things cut through wires like butter.

 

Apparently the Apache has installed multiple cable cutters:

 

(from: https://www.reddit.com/r/EngineeringPorn/comments/l3n720/wirestrike_protection_system_wsps_cable_cutter_in/, I think there is also an additional one installed directly on the gun mount)

 

 

Although I doubt there will be functioning cable cutters implemented in DCS I still find it interesting to find out and learn about this kind of stuff

 

Cheers!

 

 

[kgillers3]

Best wsps is the wsps that isn't used

[QuiGon]

6 hours ago, kgillers3 said:

Best wsps is the wsps that isn't used

 

Unless you do fly into a cable...

 

Same thing with every self-protection system: Auto-GCAS, CMS, DECM, ...

Edited October 10, 2021 by QuiGon

[kgillers3]

1 hour ago, QuiGon said:

 

Unless you do fly into a cable...

 

Same thing with every self-protection system: Auto-GCAS, CMS, DECM, ...

 

I think you misunderstand my statement but sure.  

[QuiGon]

27 minutes ago, kgillers3 said:

I think you misunderstand my statement but sure.  

 

Feel free to enlighten me

[kgillers3]

2 hours ago, QuiGon said:

 

Feel free to enlighten me

If you were to hit another car with your car and the airbag deployed.  Would you still want to drive it? The airbag not used is the best airbag. 

Edited October 10, 2021 by kgillers3

[QuiGon]

1 hour ago, kgillers3 said:

If you were to hit another car with your car and the airbag deployed.  Would you still want to drive it? The airbag not used is the best airbag.

 

Then I did understand you exactly right and you just added another "defense system" to my list to prove my point

Edited October 10, 2021 by QuiGon

[kgillers3]

43 minutes ago, QuiGon said:

 

Then I did understand you exactly right and you just added another "defense system" to my list to prove my point

 

Ok so we are in agreeance? Because maybe I don't get what you are getting at. 

[QuiGon]

12 hours ago, kgillers3 said:

Ok so we are in agreeance? Because maybe I don't get what you are getting at. 

 

I said that your argument statement applies to every defense system, not just WSPS and airbags. If you have CMS (chaff and flare) that's good, but even better if you don't get fired at and you don't have to use it.

Edited October 11, 2021 by QuiGon

[kgillers3]

11 hours ago, QuiGon said:

 

I said that your argument applies to every defense system, not just WSPS and airbags. If you have CMS (chaff and flare) that's good, but even better if you don't get fired at and you don't have to use it.

It' wasn't an argument it was a statement, I wanna use this as a growing exercise for me! 

 

So I have two options to go forward from here.  

 

Option 1: I could list logical reasons and in-depth knowledge and reasoning on why my statement was a statement.

 

Option 2: I could just say "Yeah you're right" 

 

 

 

You're right! 

Edited October 11, 2021 by kgillers3

[stormrider]

Dont waste your time trying to argue with these kids... they're always "right".

[QuiGon]

1 hour ago, kgillers3 said:

It' wasn't an argument it was a statement, I wanna use this as a growing exercise for me! 

 

So I have two options to go forward from here.  

 

Option 1: I could list logical reasons and in-depth knowledge and reasoning on why my statement was a statement.

 

Option 2: I could just say "Yeah you're right" 

 

 

 

You're right! Not worth my time 

 

Oh, now I understand your issue: It was the word "argument", which I used a bit too careless it seems.  It was not my intention to imply that you were arguing, so scratch "argument" and replace it with "statement".

Further I have not said that your statement is wrong. I just said it applies to all kind of defense systems, from WSPS over CMS to airbags. That's all and I'm a bit startled by the big fuss everyone here makes of such a simple comment

Edited October 11, 2021 by QuiGon

[Yuto]

the best WSPS is the Rotors that should be more then good enough 

Edited October 11, 2021 by Yuto

[kgillers3]

5 hours ago, QuiGon said:

 

Oh, now I understand your issue: It was the word "argument", which I used a bit too careless it seems.  It was not my intention to imply that you were arguing, so scratch "argument" and replace it with "statement".

Further I have not said that your statement is wrong. I just said it applies to all kind of defense systems, from WSPS over CMS to airbags. That's all and I'm a bit startled by the big fuss everyone here makes of such a simple comment

 

You’re right 

Edited October 11, 2021 by kgillers3

[kgillers3]

8 hours ago, QuiGon said:

 

Oh, now I understand your issue: It was the word "argument", which I used a bit too careless it seems.  It was not my intention to imply that you were arguing, so scratch "argument" and replace it with "statement".

Further I have not said that your statement is wrong. I just said it applies to all kind of defense systems, from WSPS over CMS to airbags. That's all and I'm a bit startled by the big fuss everyone here makes of such a simple comment

 

Got the baby to sleep and have a moment to burn on this.  I found it pretty amusing at the end of the day even if I was a bit facetious.  I'll admit I'm still kinda confused of what the goal of your original statement was but either way it's all fun.  I would say at the end of the day if you wanted to look at it like safety features yes, it's an added feature.  So to me CMS would be like antilock brakes on an icy day.  If it kicks on and nothing happens I continue my day. Where as the airbags would be like a WSPS with a wire strike, I'm not planning for it, I'm hoping it works as advertised and doesn't break my nose or knock out a tooth or whatever craziness occurs and afterword's I'm done driving, and that's where WSPS sits in my opinion.   

 

But yeah I have no argument, you can call me stupid if you want I guess if you don't agree  It don't matter it's just a forum. At least you didn't forget what grayscale is called. 

8 hours ago, Yuto said:

the best WSPS is the Rotors that should be more then good enough 

 

Tail rotor is vertical specifically for cutting wires 

[QuiGon]

53 minutes ago, kgillers3 said:

Where as the airbags would be like a WSPS with a wire strike, I'm not planning for it, I'm hoping it works as advertised and doesn't break my nose or knock out a tooth or whatever craziness occurs and afterword's I'm done driving, and that's where WSPS sits in my opinion.

 

Ohhh, now I get what you were referring to with your original statement!

In that case I don't see the WSPS in the same category as an airbag. The airbag can affect you and the vehicle directly if it sets off.

The WSPS (as well as CMS) don't do that, instead it's the it defends against that can ruin your day, which is the wire (or missiles in case of CMS).

 

 

53 minutes ago, kgillers3 said:

But yeah I have no argument, you can call me stupid if you want I guess if you don't agree

 

I might have a slightly different view on this than you, but that doesn't mean you're stupid and I'm not aware that I have called you that. I'm really sorry if I did!

[kgillers3]

4 minutes ago, QuiGon said:

 

Ohhh, now I get what you were referring to with your original statement!

In that case I don't see the WSPS in the same category as an airbag. The airbag can affect you and the vehicle directly if it sets off.

The WSPS (as well as CMS) don't do that, instead it's the it defends against that can ruin your day, which is the wire (or missiles in case of CMS).

 

 

 

I might have a slightly different view on this than you, but that doesn't mean you're stupid and I'm not aware that I have called you that. I'm really sorry if I did!

you're good homie.  Reason I say that with the WSPS, if you have a wire strike (knock on wood that I never do) you can't confirm the amount of damage done while flying.  Even with a wingman he can't verify components around the rotor, so while the wire didn't immediately drag you down, you're likely gonna want to land as soon as possible. Just like you don't intentionally hit things with your car (I hope) I don't plan to intentionally flying into wires. If CMS works you don't get hit, if WSPS works you got hit I guess is a way of saying it. IDK.  My opinion on the matter

Edited October 11, 2021 by kgillers3

[Blinky.ben]

On 10/10/2021 at 4:41 PM, Lazerhawk said:

Hi,

 

Until recently I didn't even know what a helicopter's WSPS is and I only learned of its existence when it was mentioned in one of Casmo's Apache videos.

 

Wikipedia: "The Wire Strike Protection System (WSPS) is a mechanical wire cutter designed to mitigate the risk of wire strikes whilst flying helicopters at low-level":

 

 

Looks like these things cut through wires like butter.

 

Apparently the Apache has installed multiple cable cutters:

 

(from: https://www.reddit.com/r/EngineeringPorn/comments/l3n720/wirestrike_protection_system_wsps_cable_cutter_in/, I think there is also an additional one installed directly on the gun mount)

 

 

Although I doubt there will be functioning cable cutters implemented in DCS I still find it interesting to find out and learn about this kind of stuff

 

Cheers!

 

 

This is actually on almost all armoured vehicles also.

[Lazerhawk]

7 hours ago, Blinky.ben said:

This is actually on almost all armoured vehicles also.

 

Thanks, I didn't know that either!

[QuiGon]

On 10/11/2021 at 9:52 PM, kgillers3 said:

you're good homie.  Reason I say that with the WSPS, if you have a wire strike (knock on wood that I never do) you can't confirm the amount of damage done while flying.  Even with a wingman he can't verify components around the rotor, so while the wire didn't immediately drag you down, you're likely gonna want to land as soon as possible. Just like you don't intentionally hit things with your car (I hope) I don't plan to intentionally flying into wires. If CMS works you don't get hit, if WSPS works you got hit I guess is a way of saying it. IDK.  My opinion on the matter

Makes sense

That actually happened just two years ago in my area, when a US Army Apache flew into some high voltage power lines and cut them off. They landed immediately, just like you said: https://www.armytimes.com/news/your-army/2019/09/26/us-apache-helicopter-damaged-in-accident-in-germany/
Pics: https://www.nordbayern.de/militarhubschrauber-kappt-stromleitung-im-landkreis-ansbach-sperrung-der-a7-1.9359863
More pics: https://www.nordbayern.de/region/ansbach/nach-ungluck-in-franken-tonnenschwerer-apache-wird-verladen-1.9387842

Edited October 13, 2021 by QuiGon

[kgillers3]

I actually just sat in on crew coordination brief about this specific incident. I can't go into details about it unfortunately. Crazy world @QuiGon

Edited October 12, 2021 by kgillers3

[QuiGon]

12 minutes ago, kgillers3 said:

I actually just sat in on crew coordination brief about this specific incident. I can't go into details about it unfortunately. Crazy world @QuiGon

 

Ha, it is indeed!

[Remco]

As a pilot of 301 sq I can confirm we have thoroughly tested the WSPS and it works very well......

 

 

Just some slight damage to the TADS, back in the air a week later.

 

 

(Don't try this at home kids)

[NeMoGas]

Back when the Gazelle first came out the cutters actually worked. I used to go around and try to cut all the wires I came across for giggles.

 

The wires would just disappear but the helicopter was totally fine. If you lined it up wrong, then the wires would take you down.

 

Since we moved to 1.5 or 2.7 (can't remember) they no longer seem to function. It would be cool to see this modelled again.

[kgillers3]

On 10/13/2021 at 12:47 AM, NeMoGas said:

Back when the Gazelle first came out the cutters actually worked. I used to go around and try to cut all the wires I came across for giggles.

 

The wires would just disappear but the helicopter was totally fine. If you lined it up wrong, then the wires would take you down.

 

Since we moved to 1.5 or 2.7 (can't remember) they no longer seem to function. It would be cool to see this modelled again.

When I started down this journey of your comment I thought you were talking about real life, and I was thinking this dude is super crazy, and the wsps for the gazelle must be super amazing.  Then I got to the end and I was like OOOOOO he's talking about DCS.  Yeah if we can cut down wires in game I'm for it all day.  Make that a wish list, bring back randomly cutting shit down