Issue with July 5th firmware- users beware!

[dburne]

This morning I decided to upgrade my VKB Gunfighter with Ultimate Grip with the July 5th software and firmware. For whatever reason now DCS sees mine as a new stick - it shows it as a Gunfighter with MCG Pro grip rather than the Ultimate Grip as it showed previously, requiring all new assignments. I verified I did use the correct firmware for the Ultimate Grip, so I am sure I have the correct one flashed. Even re-flashed it to be sure. The VKB software does list it properly as Gunfighter with Ultimate Grip, but DCS sure does not. I imagine maybe has something to do with a new PID it has been assigned with that DCS reads as being the MCG Pro grip. 

Going to have to re-assign everything apparently for my modules, not pleasant.  Tried finding the previous firmware on VKB site with no luck, all I can find is the July 5th firmware and software. The VKB site is not very easy to navigate either. I thought maybe if I could flash it back to previous version I would get it back in DCS. Guess I will be stuck with having to do my control assignments again.

Edited July 20, 2022 by dburne

[okopanja]

Thanks for the warning, but why did you update it in the first place?

I see you posted in their forum:

http://forum.vkb-sim.pro/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=6889

E.g. I own the Gladiator EVO, and would like to see better macro support.

[dburne]

Well I typically like to stay current on firmware/software, no other reason.

They have given me a link to download some previous firmware versions, have to head out of town for a bit and will try when I return later on this evening.

[FoxTwo]

37 minutes ago, dburne said:

Going to have to re-assign everything apparently for my modules

Nope, just change the file name of the config files to the new device udid.

You can use something like bulk rename utility to just find the old ID and replace it with the new one.

[dburne]

Ok so I flashed back to firmware version 2.11.1 and all is well again, showing appropriately in DCS as Gunfighter with Ultimate Grip - and most importantly all my settings intact once again - whew!

[Blatherman]

For what it's worth, I always archive old firmware (not just for VKB) that I know has worked for instances just like this.

[Dallas88B]

4 hours ago, Blatherman said:

always archive old firmware (not just for VKB)

Absolutely. Keep your own copies of the firmware for future use.

Irritatingly there is zero information on VKB site as to what the firmware update does (despite users repeatedly asking for same) so its a mystery.

I guess we are supposed to just try and see.

Nope.

Also there is no access to old firmware revisions on the VKB site so you cannot go back. 

And no way to read the VKB device VID and PID using the VKB software and no way to change same. (Unlike Virpil which allows the user to do both)

Lucky you found a user with a copy of the old firmware.

@dburne Thanks for sharing your experience. Re-assigning button mapping for every module is just awful.... so glad you escaped the problem. A salient warning to others.

 

 

[okopanja]

Personally, aside from missing information, I am not sure if the old firmware can be used with newer configuration application.

Their sticks are simply brilliant from pure hardware, but software practices looks a bit dubious.

[Dallas88B]

For what its worth, I have a Gunfighter Mk.III Modern Combat Edition Ultimate, excellent build quality and its a great stick to use. The software is good for firmware updates... but IMO, sub optimal else wise. VKB has YT videos but they have no voice over and just text on screen. One must stop, read, rewind, stop, read, rewind - I gave up on them. VKB says that is what people like.... I have my doubts.  I also have a CM3 Virpil throttle and it too is great hardware. VPC software is excellent and I make use of it's capabilities extensively. In addition there are many 3rd party YT videos (Havoc and others) available for Virpil and that really improves the Virpil experience.  

[dburne]

4 hours ago, Dallas88B said:

Absolutely. Keep your own copies of the firmware for future use.

Irritatingly there is zero information on VKB site as to what the firmware update does (despite users repeatedly asking for same) so its a mystery.

I guess we are supposed to just try and see.

Nope.

Also there is no access to old firmware revisions on the VKB site so you cannot go back. 

And no way to read the VKB device VID and PID using the VKB software and no way to change same. (Unlike Virpil which allows the user to do both)

Lucky you found a user with a copy of the old firmware.

@dburne Thanks for sharing your experience. Re-assigning button mapping for every module is just awful.... so glad you escaped the problem. A salient warning to others.

 

 

 

Yeah I learnt my own lesson there, with VKB I will now always keep a copy of existing firmware that I know works when updating. I should have known that already but apparently forgotten how hard it is to find previous versions. Thankfully that was a VKB employee that got me three firmwares to try. I think it was a bug in the latest firmware that caused my issue. I am now running firmware 2.11.1 that is working properly, it was firmware 2.11.5 (the latest) that messed me up.

Thanks,

Edited July 21, 2022 by dburne

[imacken]

As I have said before, the answer to this problem is JoyPro. It is THE essential utility for DCS binding. In the case of a GUID change - as here - it’s a one click job to swap your binds to the new ID and export to DCS. 

[dburne]

34 minutes ago, imacken said:

As I have said before, the answer to this problem is JoyPro. It is THE essential utility for DCS binding. In the case of a GUID change - as here - it’s a one click job to swap your binds to the new ID and export to DCS. 

Yeah and I had a look at it back when you mentioned it and it just was not for me, can not remember exactly why. What I would really like is if VKB tested their firmware to insure they are properly recognized. Don't much care for my Ultimate Grip being identified as a MCG Grip. Out of three firmwares VKB sent me to try after my posting about this, only one was recognized properly as the Ultimate Grip.

I have really loved VKB in the past but of late I seem to be getting more frustrated with them than usual. Or ever for that matter. So this has now been reported to them, will see how they do with it going forward. I will say I am loving my Virpil gear even more and more these days.

Edited July 28, 2022 by dburne

[Dallas88B]

2 hours ago, dburne said:

Yeah and I had a look at it back when you mentioned it

So did I. 

@imacken thank you for your comments and advice about JoyPro.

@dburne I looked up JoyPro
https://github.com/Holdi601/JoystickProfiler 
git hub seems targeted at software developers.... but the site is way too complicated for me to bother with. I looked at Grim Reapers video but its out of date now. I found this one https://www.youtube.com/c/GottHoldNicetomeet/videos that has 18 separate videos on JoyPro (now thats dedicated ! ) 
No doubt JoyPro is ok when one can get it all set up but it aint for me. IMO its another bit of code to support, software incompatibilities to worry about. If ED update DCS and the middleman software joypro doesn't work then I am truely screwed. 

I remain disappointed in VKB for the reasons described. Especially given the premium price. Its great hardware, but if it died, I realise I wouldn't purchase another. I would satisfy myself with a Virpil plastic stick with and Virpil's far superior software and support.

Edited July 28, 2022 by Dallas88B

[imacken]

Guys, obviously if you don't want to use JP that is entirely up to you, but let me just comment on a couple of things.

Firstly, getting it from github couldn't be simpler, just go to JoystickProfiler/Builds at master · Holdi601/JoystickProfiler · GitHub  and download the latest version.

You will not be 'screwed' by a - very unlikely - change in DCS's controls format. If that happened, then you would be in the exact same position you are in now.  JP and DCS work totally independent of each other.

I can honestly say, that JP is a life saver for any DCS user.  The ability to simply swap your devices in the case of a GUID change - which happens a lot with firmware updates - is worth the few minutes of installing alone.  If you don't want to use any of the huge number of functions this software has, all you need to do is install JP, tell it where your DCS install is, import your bindings and save the profile.  Even at that very basic level, you are saved all the grief of a GUID change, as if that happens, when you run JP, it will ask you if you would like to replace the 'new' device with one of your existing ones. Select the previous one, export bindings to DCS and you are done! Couldn't be simpler.  Even just using that once saves you hours of rebinding.

And, there are many many other incredibly useful time saving functions.

 

[Svsmokey]

A few weeks ago , i had to make a decision whether to go VKB or Virpil for a new stick . I chose Virpil because my impression is that they are more customer-facing . 

Virpil's pre-order system , the fact that they accept PayPal , the more user-friendly software , and more understandable product descriptions (at least for me) are what tipped the balance .

All of which is not to knock VKB . They are doing some interesting things , and i hope they continue to flourish . But they need to elevate their customer experience to the level of their hardware .

[dburne]

4 hours ago, Svsmokey said:

A few weeks ago , i had to make a decision whether to go VKB or Virpil for a new stick . I chose Virpil because my impression is that they are more customer-facing . 

Virpil's pre-order system , the fact that they accept PayPal , the more user-friendly software , and more understandable product descriptions (at least for me) are what tipped the balance .

All of which is not to knock VKB . They are doing some interesting things , and i hope they continue to flourish . But they need to elevate their customer experience to the level of their hardware .

 

Yeah I would agree with that.

Again - my issue with VKB on this one is down to the Ultimate Grip not being recognized properly. I am sure I could without much effort get the new identity of MCG Pro grip to work ok with the two modules I have. But I want it to show as an Ultimate Grip like it always did previously. Not a MCG Pro grip. And that I believe is on VKB.

 

Edited July 28, 2022 by dburne

[Dogmanbird]

I haven't had anything unusual with July 5 and have falshed it into 3 x GFIII bases (two ultimates and space grip)

If you are brave enough to try it again some time, your issue might be related to what I've posted in bottom of this thread and VKB have done it intentionally to help folk connecting two identical grips at the same time - in my case, one setup for helicopters and one for jets

I would certainly agree that VKB have a significant lack in info/documentation for how the configuration software works. I sense the software development is a one man band. I hope nothing happens to him  otherwise VKB could be stuck at July 5 for e v v e e e e e e r r r r r r r r r r r r

Edited July 29, 2022 by Dogmanbird

[dburne]

Nah think I will leave mine as it is now as it is recognized properly in DCS.

My configurator software shows it in lower left as Ultimate Grip, DCS however reports it as MCG Pro Grip in those firmware versions I stated previously. Plus I only have the one VKB grip so it is not like anything should be getting confused.  If VKB can't be bothered with it, neither can I. I posted all details over on their tech forum. VKB could really take a lesson on how Virpil handles their software/firmware.

Thanks for the info though.

Edited July 29, 2022 by dburne

[Dogmanbird]

No worries

Did you replace your grip? Your sig says you have the MCG Pro Ultimate. Does that model exist? (Pro is plastic grip, Ultimate is metal grip and heavy).

Pros on left, Ultimate on right

null

If you have an Ultimate, I'm guessing it has twist and you have the black coloured black box (Mk2)? This is the firmware file name for that grip, from the July 5 .zip if you want to double check

_BB_Mk2_GunFighter_MCG_Ultimate_Twist_v2_11_5.vkb

Edited July 29, 2022 by Dogmanbird

[dburne]

Yes I have the Ultimate Grip and black colored box( Mk III) along with correct firmware. My sig states Gunfighter Mk III Pro L( which is the long extension)  and Ultimate Grip. This is VKB's nomenclature, not mine. It (my sig) does not state MCG Pro grip.

As previously stated only firmware version 2.11.1 identifies correctly in DCS as being the Ultimate Grip. I have reported everything to VKB over on their forums, ball is in their court whether they want to do anything about it or not. Looking like the latter, will see.

Thanks,

Edited July 29, 2022 by dburne

[Dogmanbird]

yes maybe my bad, thought pro L meant the plastic grip with long extension (MCG pro L)

have you tried doing a reset of the black box (pressing the grey button while connecting USB cable) then re flashing? 

your review here is of the plastic Pro grip. I haven't read the entire thread and  you've since  updated to the ultimate?

Anyway, hope you find a solution 

Edited July 29, 2022 by Dogmanbird

[dburne]

Yes I updated to Ultimate Grip when it was first released. Hence the Ultimate Grip in my sig. What I would be most curious about is if anyone running the Ultimate Grip has it properly recognized in DCS with VKB latest firmware - 2.11.5.

FYI there are two VKB Pro models of Gunfighter - Pro S and Pro L. Pro S is 100 mm extension, Pro L is 200mm extension. The Pro nomenclature just specifies it is with an extension. But we are getting way off course here.

I think the issue I am speaking of here is related to the firmware revision.

Edited July 29, 2022 by dburne

[Dallas88B]

17 hours ago, dburne said:

I would be most curious about is if anyone running the Ultimate Grip has it properly recognized in DCS with VKB latest firmware - 2.11.5.

TL:DR

I have a Gunfighter Mk.III Modern Combat Edition Ultimate with Twist and have updated to 2.115 successfully.

Only because you asked, and expecting trouble, I went ahead and updated. Much to my surprise and relief it actually worked.

DETAIL

I was running VKB device config v0.92.17 (Njoy firmware 2.08.0). The stick, a Gunfighter Mk.III Modern Combat Edition Ultimate with Twist, shows up as Gunfighter MCG Ultimate Twist XT v2.090 Mk2. Using USBDview to interrogate the device the stick has : no serial number (its blank) a Vendor ID of 231d and Product ID of 0125

I downloaded the Firmware, the applications Configurator and the Bootloader.

I deleted the pre-existing configurator and Bootloader software off my PC (used in the last firmware installation).

I then started the new Bootloader and I followed the instructions here  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5SoYSUYClE&list=PLDtbsvyzXZFDM720qqxDNlk-m_9Dgx8X6&index=7 After that was complete I started the new copy of the configurator  ( VKBDevCfg-C.exe ) and completed the steps including calibration per https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4WREzN19pE&t=16s

I did not reinstall the previous profile (it was just a default profile anyway with no special button or LED configurations. I checked all the button and mini stick functions using the VKBDevCfg-C.exe Test tab for Buttons and Axes and they showed up ok)

The stick is correctly recognized by DCS as VKBsim Gunfighter MCG Ultimate Twist (same as before the firmware update). All the previously keymapped the buttons and ministick function correctly.

Using USBDview still says the stick has : no serial number (its still blank) a Vendor ID of 231d and Product ID of 0125

 

Edited July 30, 2022 by Dallas88B
added detail about test tab, fixed typo

[dburne]

@Dallas88B 

Thanks so much for checking. Now it gets even stranger, not sure why mine is not doing the same. I may give another try here soon.

[Dallas88B]

Dont know. Maybe a corrupted download file?