"Flag is True"

[ericinexile]

What does that mean?

 

I've gone through the GUI manual and Flag is mentioned a hundred times but never defined. Maybe to most it is too obvious to need further explanation but I missed the memo.

 

Help is appreciated.

 

Smokin' Hole

[Dusty Rhodes]

What does that mean?

 

I've gone through the GUI manual and Flag is mentioned a hundred times but never defined. Maybe to most it is too obvious to need further explanation but I missed the memo.

 

Help is appreciated.

 

Smokin' Hole

 

I am watching this thread for the answer because I can't figure it out either and it seems to be an integral part in making a realistic, action filled mission.

[EvilBivol-1]

A flag is simply a logical variable you can use to manipulate events or create trigger dependencies.

 

The simplest example:

Trigger1 - If Unit In Zone -> set flag1 to true.

Trigger2 - If flag1 is true and time since flag1 is greater than 20 seconds -> activate Group A (SAM)

[Dusty Rhodes]

Can't you just do that with a Trigger Event? What does the flag need to do? Color me stupid when answering because I can't wrap my pea brain around the Flag thing.

[EvilBivol-1]

In the example above, you could have activated the SAM group without using a Flag, but the Flag allows you to introduce the time delay. Again though, this is only the simplest example.

 

You can also use flags to determine random probabilities. For example, if you want to set up three possible SAM groups when the player enters a zone, but you want to randomize their appearance (which ones appear), you can do the following:

 

Trigger1: Mission Start -> Random = 50% -> Set Flag1 True

Trigger2: Mission Start -> Random = 50% -> Set Flag2 True

Trigger3: Mission Start -> Random = 50% -> Set Flag3 True

 

Trigger4: If Player in Zone and Flag1 is true -> Activate SAM1

Trigger5: If Player in Zone and Flag2 is true -> Activate SAM2

Trigger6: If Player in Zone and Flag3 is true -> Activate SAM3

 

This way, when the player enters the zone, any of the three SAM goups might appear, depending on which flags got set to true at mission start. You could have done the same thing by simply setting the SAM groups to randomly appear at mission start, but if you only want them to appear after the Player/Unit enters a specific zone, you have to use flags. This can be important in simulating a delayed reaction to an attack, for example. In my missions, I used it to simulate a MANPAD ambush, where the SAM group would only activate after the player overflew it, so he would get attacked from behind.

 

In case you're wondering why you couldn't just say...

If player in zone -> random =50% -> activate SAM

 

...the answer is, because randomness would not work in that rule. The player will likely be in the zone for an extended period of time and since the trigger events are checked by the simulation every 5 seconds, it would eventually hit true. Using flags eliminates this problem, because they were only run once at mission start.

 

A Flag is basically a way to link triggers together.

Edited January 1, 2009 by EvilBivol-1

[Dusty Rhodes]

OK, I just read that and THINK I have an ideer of what you are saying. I am going to go watch some more Sharks Hockey and then come back and read it again and see if I understand. One question I do have is.........What stops all 3 SAM units from activating at once or two activating at once instead of the desired one if you have all the Triggers and Flags saying the same thing?

[EvilBivol-1]

Nothing, but you could use flags for that, too. :)

 

You make additional triggers that say if flag1 is true, set flag2 and flag 3 to false; if flag2 is true, set flag1 and flag3 to false and so on.

[Weta43]

(Already typed this then saw EB beat me to it)

Or (as I mentioned somewhere in another thread) for setting scenarios in a mission -

Say you want 8 different possibilities. If you give each a mission start random probablility of (1/8)%, each one will only appear (on average) 1 in 8 starts, but you might get all 8 on the same flight - or none..

But if you try:

Trigger1: Mission Start -> Random = 50% -> Set Flag1 True

Trigger2: Mission Start -> Random = 50% -> Set Flag2 True

Trigger3: Mission Start -> Random = 50% -> Set Flag3 True

 

then...

 

Trigger11: (Trigger 1 = True & Trigger 2 = True & Trigger 3 = true) -> Set Flag11True

Trigger12: (Trigger 1 = True & Trigger 2 = True & Trigger 3 = False) -> Set Flag12 True

Trigger13: (Trigger 1 = True & Trigger 2 = False & Trigger 3 = true) -> Set Flag13 True

Trigger14: (Trigger 1 = True & Trigger 2 = False & Trigger 3 = False) -> Set Flag14 True

Trigger15: (Trigger 1 = False & Trigger 2 = True & Trigger 3 = true) -> Set Flag15 True

Trigger16: (Trigger 1 = False & Trigger 2 = True & Trigger 3 = False) -> Set Flag16 True

Trigger17: (Trigger 1 = False & Trigger 2 = False & Trigger 3 = true) -> Set Flag17 True

Trigger18: (Trigger 1 = False & Trigger 2 = False & Trigger 3 = False) -> Set Flag18 True

 

Then you have 8 equally likely mutually exclusive triggers for different scenarios.

Flag 11 = true,(optionally + unit in zone etc ) -> start Scen 1

Flag 12 = true,(optionally + unit in zone etc ) -> start Scen 2

etc.

(2 initial randoms @ 50 % gets you 4 scenarios, 3 = 8, 4 = 16 etc...)

Edited January 1, 2009 by Weta43

[Dusty Rhodes]

OK, I understand that. So basically you are introducing randomness to a Trigger Event thus creating a dynamic atmosphere? And you control your Triggers and Flags with other Flags?

 

BTW, thank you for your patience and I would bet I am not the only one wanting to know this but I am the class dunce who asks :)

[Weta43]

Yep, and Yep, & no problem

 

This ^ is used in (among others) the Clear Tkvarcheli mission if you want a worked example.

Edited January 1, 2009 by Weta43

[Dusty Rhodes]

Kewl, I will dissect that mission so I can see how this all works. I want to make dynamic missions that don't play the same way every time. I would think you could even add dynamics to your mission goal, i.e. you are sent to a sector on call CAS and you get a message from one of, say, 3 ground units of needing help and you set the triggers and Flags so that the attack comes from one of three places and you use a trigger with 3 percentage flags of where the attack comes from, which also triggers the call from the correct unit being attacked. Does that sound right?

[Highwayman-Ed]

You can also use them for mission objectives.

 

I'm making a reconnaissance mission that you have to fly along a certain path to, and fly through certain areas.

 

I set triggers so that when the player enters a zone, the flag is set to true, if at the end of the mission, you've flown through all 4 zones, the mission is a success, if not... fail!

There are many, many uses for them :)

[EvilBivol-1]

Does that sound right?

Yes, that should be possible. I would only caution you though, it gets very complicated very quickly and requires a lot of hand work to put all of the pieces in place. You will essentially end up making three (or nine?) missions all wrapped into one and the workload is roughly proportional.

 

To begin with, my advice would be to start simpler and get some experience with both the way the AI works and the way the triggers work. I'm sure there's still plenty more for you to discover before diving deep into a multi-scenario mission.

 

P.S. It's interesting that with the new editor, there is much more flexibility to create different styles of mission gameplay. The two campaigns included in the English version are good examples. The Deployment campaign is relatively short and static, but thoroughly scripted for presentation. It's basically hand-crafted to take the player through the campaign almost like a character in a novel. I personally enjoy the approach and don't miss the lack of replayability. Georgian Oil War, on the other hand, is a much larger campaign that includes much more replayability in both individual missions (many unit positions are randomized) and campaign phases. Each mission is wider in scope and geography than the Deployment missions, but does not feature the kind of "role playing" scripts of radio chatter that you get in Deployment.

 

My point is that multiple scenarios are not the only solution to an enjoyable mission. I had also focused on this approach in the beginning, but there are other flavors of juice you can squeeze out of the editor. :)

Edited January 1, 2009 by EvilBivol-1

[MBot]

Weta43 basically already said it, but here it is again from me:

 

I am currently building a mission that will have 3 different setups of hostile forces. In order to set that up I do:

 

Trigger1: Mission Start; Random 33%; Set Flag 1

Trigger2: Mission Start; Random 50%; Set Flag 2

 

Defensive A: Once; Flag 1 True; Set Flag 3

Defensive B: Once; Flag 1 False, Flag 2 True; Set Flag 4

Defensive C: Once; Flag 1 False, Flag 2 False; Set Flag 5

 

Overall chance of each setup is 33%. Every units of the A template require Flag 3 to be true (upon activation), B units require Flag 4 to be true and C units require Flag 5 to be true.

 

 

One of many uses of flags. Although I have to say that for some things I would prefer to have a more direct approach rather than flags. For example triggering a unit to appear mid-mission with a random chance. I would prefer to add the randomizer directly to the trigger, rather than having to run the randomizer separately, set a flag and then require the flag for the said trigger.

Edited January 1, 2009 by MBot

[CAT_101st]

That is but only one of the many uses for a flag. :book:

[Dusty Rhodes]

You guys have given me a great education on the ME and Flags. Thank you very much.

 

Cat - Well give us some of your nuggets. We are all here to learn and reading a manual isn't always the best way. I would have never gotten what I have gotten from a manual because I can't ask the manual questions :)

[Shepski]

You can also use them to set mission success conditions...

 

objective 1 destroyed set flag=1

objective 2 destroyed set flag=2

 

flag 1 and 2 are true= mission success trigger.

 

Many, many options and many new triggers coming in the patch for even more possibilities. :)

[Macka]

Shhhh!!!.......did I hear something??.....what????....did someone say "Patch"!!!!???? :) :) :)

[Dusty Rhodes]

Nice Nugget Shep and thanks for the info. I look forward to messing with the flags and triggers to make some truly dynamic missions. I just have to learn to fly this cursed machine first :)

[Dusty Rhodes]

OK, so I tried to set a Flag and can't understand where to set the Flag condition or is it set in the trigger? I can't figure out where to set the probability either. But my main thing is I have 9 groups of Recon elements that must be destroyed. How do I set it so that mission success comes up if they are all destroyed? Is the mission success or failure dependent on the score you receive as set by the Mission Goals where the points are assigned. I would like to see the people get a mission success if they destroy all the targets.

Edited January 1, 2009 by Dusty Rhodes

[Dusty Rhodes]

Bump for some more questions.

[CAT_101st]

:D

You guys have given me a great education on the ME and Flags. Thank you very much.

 

Cat - Well give us some of your nuggets. We are all here to learn and reading a manual isn't always the best way. I would have never gotten what I have gotten from a manual because I can't ask the manual questions :)

 

 

Ok so you want a message to display when a convoy gets in a trigger zone. Well they only have the option for Unit in zone not group in zone. So to have the message only triger 1 time you must add each unit as its own trigger.

 

unit 1, unit 1 in zone flag 1 false, message and set flag 1

unit 2, unit 2 in zone flag 1 false, message and set falg 1

unit 3, unit 3 in zone flag 1 false, message and set flag 1

 

So here you see if flag 1 is trigered by any of the 3 units the other 2 will not trigger the message. this goes for actaviting units as well.

 

I just redid a base defince for the DCS-mercenaries sever. where at 1 hour a flight of CH-47s ans a flight a SH-60 fly in to drop troops and humves with tows near the base. If you shoot down 1 choper you loose the equipment and men in it. but the others will still drop there loads. This is a easy one to do. just have to coraspond each choper name with the ground units it caries. So if it does not reach the trigger zone witch I make 100m. No troops are droped. It is a fun thing to watch sepecaly if no one sees them come in. I have 2 man pads that get droped behind our lines. and boom all fall down. :D

 

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