Make the Modifier settings window work like the other control settings windows

[Captain Orso]

When you open Options -> Controls -> Aircraft you have an input area that, if you have a key or button already defined, if you assert that key or button, the display will jump to the line on which that key or button is used, and it is highlighted. You can also see exactly on which device the button is, and whether there are modifiers.

It would be useful to have the same functionality in the Modifier window, so that asserting a button or key jumps to the line where it is used, and the exact device is displayed.

[SharpeXB]

Not sure how this would work since the modifiers can be used with multiple commands. 

[Captain Orso]

Go look at the modifier settings. You don't seem to know what they are.

[SharpeXB]

4 hours ago, Captain Orso said:

Go look at the modifier settings. You don't seem to know what they are.

I use a modifier so I’ve seen the screen. It shows which keys or buttons you have assigned for this of course. The main controls menu will also highlight which commands you’re using this when you press these as well as for the single buttons. That’s useful since there could be dozens of them. But I imagine most people have only one modifier button, it’s not hard to know which it is. There’s only a few others on the modifier section, not hundreds. So I guess I just don’t understand why you’re asking. You can easily see which buttons you’ve got assigned already. 

Edited March 14, 2023 by SharpeXB

[Captain Orso]

Well, please show me which controller/s is/are used for Button1 & 2, and which buttons on the controllers

                                                                                                                             x

 

Edited March 14, 2023 by Captain Orso

[SharpeXB]

31 minutes ago, Captain Orso said:

Well, please show me which controller/s is/are used for Button1 & 2, and which buttons on the controllers

                                                                                                                             x

 

 

It’s not a bad suggestion but how hard is that to figure out? Just look at the main menu. Which commands do you see two buttons assigned to? One of those is your modifier. 

Edited March 15, 2023 by SharpeXB

[Captain Orso]

WHAT BUTTON ON WHAT CONTROLLER IS Button1?

Edited March 15, 2023 by Captain Orso

[Vakarian]

@Captain Orso Why argue with a troll? Just ignore him.

On the other hand, interesting suggestion. I've only used one modifier so far so haven't run into that issue, but if you use them frequently I can easily see how knowing which button on what device is used as a modifier can be handy.

[SharpeXB]

3 hours ago, Captain Orso said:

WHAT BUTTON ON WHAT CONTROLLER IS Button1?

If you want to know what Button 1 is on any controller just click into an empty field under each controller, start pressing buttons and you'll figure it out. If the button you pressed is a modifier that assignment will show up under "Add Modifier". If you find Button 1 on the controller and nothing appears then it's unassigned.

Or if you're already using it and have forgotten, search the main menu for a command with two buttons assigned to it. See which two are the same and match the button description on the modifier menu. Solved. If you haven't got it assigned already, then this doesn't matter just delete it and assign a new one.

[Captain Orso]

3 hours ago, Vakarian said:

@Captain Orso Why argue with a troll? Just ignore him.

On the other hand, interesting suggestion. I've only used one modifier so far so haven't run into that issue, but if you use them frequently I can easily see how knowing which button on what device is used as a modifier can be handy.

Thanks for the reasonable reply.

I primarily use only two, sometimes three modifiers. But some aircraft I don't fly very often I've discovered that I've used some odd modifiers, and since I set them years ago, I had no idea what they were exactly and no way to find out easily.

I discovered since then that I can locate the modifier.lua file for the aircraft and read it from there, but 1) that's a PITA while in-game, and 2) many players are OS-challenged, and this would make life easier for them, and 3) it just makes everything conform to the same paradigm.

[Captain Orso]

32 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

If you want to know what Button 1 is on any controller just click into an empty field under each controller, start pressing buttons and you'll figure it out. If the button you pressed is a modifier that assignment will show up under "Add Modifier". If you find Button 1 on the controller and nothing appears then it's unassigned.

This is actually a reasonable suggestion, although not entirely correct. It doesn't matter under which controller the empty bind is; just open it and start pressing buttons, when you hit a modifier button, it will appear in the modifier field.

32 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

Or if you're already using it and have forgotten, search the main menu for a command with two buttons assigned to it. See which two are the same and match the button description on the modifier menu. Solved. If you haven't got it assigned already, then this doesn't matter just delete it and assign a new one.

This is just time-consuming busy-work.

If the MODIFIER PANEL were constructed like the CONTROLS assignment panel it would be much easier and quicker and conform to the already established standard.

The idea is to make the lives of the users better, and not find excuses for doing nothing.

[SharpeXB]

1 hour ago, Captain Orso said:

This is just time-consuming busy-work.

It only takes a few seconds to do this, really. Just press any modifier/key combo and the main menu will instantly show you what they’re assigned to. Or just press controller buttons until you see which button # it is. 

1 hour ago, Captain Orso said:

The idea is to make the lives of the users better, and not find excuses for doing nothing.

ED isn’t “doing nothing”. There’s already a nearly infinite amount of development work and bug fixing they’re engaged in. 
I would rather see them working on this than tailoring the menus to user-specific “problems” than can be easily worked around. 

Edited March 15, 2023 by SharpeXB

[Captain Orso]

6 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

It only takes a few seconds to do this, really. Just press any modifier/key combo and the main menu will instantly show you what they’re assigned to.

Only if you know the key-combo.

6 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

Or just press controller buttons until you see which button # it is. 

Busy work.

6 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

ED isn’t “doing nothing”. There’s already a nearly infinite amount of development work and bug fixing they’re engaged in. 
I would rather see them working on this than tailoring the menus to user-specific “problems” than can be easily worked around. 

Are you saying that ED is so incompetent, they cannot assign someone to fix this minor bit of coding, because they are so inundated with work, trying to keep the wheel turning on their out of control vehicle?

I've worked in IT over 35 years, on both sides of the aisle (customer and manufacturer of IT products). The easiest way to make your customers believe you take their concerns seriously, is by showing that you take their concerns seriously. Sometimes this includes fixing those minor issues that are like a pebble in your shoe. It's tiny, but it will always bug you. You will always have to stop and take it out, and then ask yourself, why is a pebble always falling into my shoe. Why can't I have something to prevent that.

YOU seem to think, "it's a tiny pebble, it can't be a big issue, because the customer can fix it with some effort and time", regardless of how much it bugs him. That is the stench of a rotting company. Customers will gladly jump to another provider who takes their issues seriously, even if the new provider is not as far along as the old provider, because in a year or three the new provider will maybe have fixed some of the issues the customer has, of which there is ZERO chance of the old provider fixing his issues, because "let the customer do it", he can simple dump the pebble out of his shoe once again, interrupting his intentions yet another time, aggravating him yet again, a process without end and no hope of finding one.

God, I hope you don't have anything to do with customer-facing work.

[SharpeXB]

40 minutes ago, Captain Orso said:

Busy work.

Even if they changed the menu like you’re suggesting, it’s not going to show you which button is which on the controller. You’re on your own here… 

You could have figured it out in all the time it took you to write this stuff. 

Edited March 15, 2023 by SharpeXB

[Captain Orso]

10 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

Even if they changed the menu like you’re suggesting, it’s not going to show you which button is which on the controller. You’re on your own here… 

null

Add to Kneeboard...

OH SNAP!!

10 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

You could have figured it out in all the time it took you to write this stuff. 

 

smh so useless

[SharpeXB]

3 hours ago, Captain Orso said:

null

Add to Kneeboard...

OH SNAP!!

smh so useless

See you can figure this out all on your own. What was the point of this topic?

[Captain Orso]

I'm necro-ing this thread, because it's still a PITA.

For the Apache I had to assign a non-standard modifier for special usage. I haven't flown the Apache for a long time now, and I was just going to go through the binds to remind myself of what his what, and there it is... a modifier that I don't recall which switch/button/key it is assigned to and THERE IS NO WAY TO FIND IT OUT!! other than going to the modifier.lua file and reading it, with means switching out of the game in VR and navigating to the file for the Apache Pilot and reading it, when it could work just like all the binds and show me. *sigh*

[Tom Kazansky]

1 hour ago, Captain Orso said:

I'm necro-ing this thread, because it's still a PITA.

For the Apache I had to assign a non-standard modifier for special usage. I haven't flown the Apache for a long time now, and I was just going to go through the binds to remind myself of what his what, and there it is... a modifier that I don't recall which switch/button/key it is assigned to and THERE IS NO WAY TO FIND IT OUT!! other than going to the modifier.lua file and reading it, with means switching out of the game in VR and navigating to the file for the Apache Pilot and reading it, when it could work just like all the binds and show me. *sigh*

I feel you, but are you aware that you can rename the modifier e.g. to a name that gives you a clue where to find it?

(e.g. I use something like "btn6_pinky")

edit: this is done in the modifier setup window of the DCS controls settings

Edited July 5, 2024 by Tom Kazansky

[Captain Orso]

16 hours ago, Tom Kazansky said:

I feel you, but are you aware that you can rename the modifier e.g. to a name that gives you a clue where to find it?

(e.g. I use something like "btn6_pinky")

edit: this is done in the modifier setup window of the DCS controls settings

 

Thanks for the reply.

Yes, I'm aware of that ability and use it. I named the modifier KU_Switch. If I'd have named it KU_Switch_Thrl_BN24, aside from the fact that it makes the displayed bindings on the page super wide, I'd have still asked myself, "button 24? Button 24 on my 32 button/switch HOTAS throttle is.... ummm..." and still have to go into windows settings device calibration to try switches until I find it, or pull up a diagram from deep in my file system with the designations.

Even when you know the button, there is no positive feed back when activating it. It's just flying blind.

It would be sooo simply to simply have a column displaying the device and button/switch and have it highlighted when activated. So simple, so easy, and so useful.

[Exorcet]

I haven't run into this problem, but the request is a reasonable one. Personally I'd like ED to take a page from XPlane:

Having an image of controls available is really good. I think for the actual bind's DCS columns are better, but the ability to open an image of your controls would be great.

[Captain Orso]

There are so many things that would be useful for users. Getting ED to take any of them seriously sometimes feels like pulling hen's teeth.