What to expect after owning a WinWing product for 1 year

[Keith Briscoe]

Ugh. Sorry to hear the above story. Sounds like many others have been quite satisfied. I recently placed an order... fingers crossed.  At least I can't blame anyone buy myself if there are problems after reading these posts. 

[-Sledgehammer-]

To underline my story: 

how the lcd display worked out: (They promised me the refund of about 100 dollar)

they just not stand by their word. remember: the lcd screen was 4 days old and part of 900 dollar set. and this story is goin on for 3 months now.

Edited November 27, 2023 by -Sledgehammer-
update

[-Sledgehammer-]

and for the ka50 grip / gemini base disaster (the combo is 3 months old): 

i opened a support ticket with the title Ka50/Grip on Gemini Base not working.

They don't even read what you write, they ask me if i can open the right grip (of what), i sent them pics of the opened up base where the details are seen and i also sent them a video with the led blinking. 

they already start to wear me down, it's always the same crap:

this will go on for the next 3 weeks until i give up. thats their tactics. very sad. i feel like an idiot spending so much money with them.

Edited November 27, 2023 by -Sledgehammer-

[Potato]

This thread opened my eyes. I was up to buying Winwing products today. 

This chat experience is hair-raising. I will not give them a chance. 

[-Sledgehammer-]

just for the amusement:

i waited basically the whole 4 days for this stupid answer. 

 

[Phantom711]

@-Sledgehammer-

Are you colorblind or something? And I don‘t mean that in a mean way…but seriously…

You do see, that they indicated it on the picture with arrows where to connect the connectors…?

Edited November 28, 2023 by Phantom711

[MustangSally]

See my Avatar

[-Sledgehammer-]

i made that picture with the arrows. just to clarify for facepalm sally.

they (winwing) provided me with absolutely nothing so far, the one plug connector is pretty clear to me.

and if you smart guys looked closely, you would have seen, that the left one is a 3pin connector to a 6pin socket. and there are many 3pin sockets on that pcb. so it‘s not clear, where to connect this plug to. or can you guys with your infinite wisdom tell me? (where to plug a 3pin connector to 6pin socket?) 

got it?

and i don‘t understand why i must open a device, i‘m a customer with an obviously broken device within warranty (3 months of use)?

the ka50 grip has 21 screws on it, how tf should i know which one to open? their answer: you must open some screws.

i expect something else, that combo cost me 500 bucks with shipping.

would you open a 500 dollar microwave-oven when asked by the customer support of kenwood and fiddle around with cables and connectors inside?

 

 

 

Edited November 29, 2023 by -Sledgehammer-

[Vector1]

you figured it out right? if yes enough said

[MustangSally]

...and TM/Virpil expect you to open their devices to replace switches etc as well.....it is what it is.

Edited November 30, 2023 by MustangSally

[-Sledgehammer-]

vor 8 Stunden schrieb Vector1:

you figured it out right? if yes enough said

no, i don‘t. that‘s the problem. 

[justAflankerFAN]

On 11/26/2023 at 9:08 PM, Potato said:

This thread opened my eyes. I was up to buying Winwing products today. 

This chat experience is hair-raising. I will not give them a chance. 

TM is no better either. On the contrary, TM charge you an outrageous price for an inferior product with less functionality than WW ( I'm talking about the TM F-16 TQS that cost 550 USD compared to WW 330 ).
Virpil / VKB also first ask you to open their devices for a self-diagnosis and replace broken components as well. And if you can't do that then you can ask them for a refund, only differences here is these 2 brands are well-established in the flight sim community & has a far older history in flight sim peripheral market than WW, has better logistic as both VKB / Virpil has warehouse in EUR & The US, and thus have better customer support. Meanwhile, WW still stuck with having people with poor grasp of English as their customer support & is still in the process of opening up a warehouse in US. Also, the leadership of VKB / Virpil are Westerner with an already good understanding of how business is conducted in the West, WW AFAIK is mostly Chinese owned and they have a different business culture there compared to the West

Bottom line is, if you want to have a Hornet or F-15 or F-16 replica sim peripheral then Winwing is your only choice. TM F-16 throttle is pure garbage for its money, their joystick base can't be customized and overprice compared to what is currently in the market. Meanwhile, WW base can be adjusted with extra cam and spring. TM Warthog is known for <profanity>ty switches, and it took them a decade to replaced the TDC slew with a better one. Pick your poison

Edited November 30, 2023 by justAflankerFAN

[justAflankerFAN]

1 hour ago, -Sledgehammer- said:

no, i don‘t. that‘s the problem. 

Try bring this on r/hotas & the hotas discord community https://discord.gg/szqaJE7. There are WW people there with better understanding of English so maybe you will get better support there than on WW site' customer support. Until WW opened a warehouse in the US & have the local as representative for their brand then there's not much you can do

Edited November 30, 2023 by justAflankerFAN

[justAflankerFAN]

On 10/28/2023 at 8:48 AM, Keith Briscoe said:

I'm interested to hear more success stories about WW.  I have my eyes firmly directed at the f16/orion stick + f15ex/Orion throttle.  

Talk me into it.

 

On 11/22/2023 at 11:09 PM, Keith Briscoe said:

Ugh. Sorry to hear the above story. Sounds like many others have been quite satisfied. I recently placed an order... fingers crossed.  At least I can't blame anyone buy myself if there are problems after reading these posts. 

Its the pick your poison thing...if you want Western replica sim peripheral then they are the only one in the market for that. Thrustmaster is pure garbage for the outrageous price & has worse quality ( stemmed from outdated design & components. See my post above for more details )

Edited November 30, 2023 by justAflankerFAN

[-Sledgehammer-]

vor 7 Stunden schrieb justAflankerFAN:

Try bring this on r/hotas & the hotas discord community https://discord.gg/szqaJE7. There are WW people there with better understanding of English so maybe you will get better support there than on WW site' customer support. Until WW opened a warehouse in the US & have the local as representative for their brand then there's not much you can do

 

thanks for tip, i‘ll try. customer service in china sucks, they dont get it. 

[-Sledgehammer-]

vor 7 Stunden schrieb justAflankerFAN:

 

Its the pick your poison thing...if you want Western replica sim peripheral then they are the only one in the market for that. Thrustmaster is pure garbage for the outrageous price & has worse quality ( stemmed from outdated design & components. See my post above for more details )

 

the difference is, i can buy them (tm) at a retail store and return them and they have warranty. i have a warthog hotas since 7 years and it still works as new. it‘s not as nearly as good as the winwing orion stick (at least in terms of functionality).

winwing is destroying their own reputation with this customer service, besides the poor quality of their products (at least the gemini throttle is joke). i‘m not an electronics guy, i‘m just not qualified to open a device and fiddle around with connectors and cables. 

these are niche products and this is a lot of money for me. 

[Keith Briscoe]

Early stage company vs. late stage company.  Just a choice each of us gets to make, like said above (pick your poison).  And a reminder that the experience noted in this thread is, I'm sorry to say and don't want to offend anyone, not reflective of the full population of WinWing customers.

 

All that said, I feel for you and hope you end up with a good/satisfying solution with your gear.

[Vector1]

O.K!

Edited November 30, 2023 by Vector1

[Dangerzone]

8 hours ago, Keith Briscoe said:

Early stage company vs. late stage company.  Just a choice each of us gets to make, like said above (pick your poison).  And a reminder that the experience noted in this thread is, I'm sorry to say and don't want to offend anyone, not reflective of the full population of WinWing customers.

This may certainly be the case, but TBH - I've wondered about winwing (I haven't purchased anything from them... yet) - but the customer service correspondence gives me the chills.

Most people have no issues with their purchased product, therefore only experience a portion of the whole companies experiences. Then there's the odd product that will come through where mistakes have been made. (Leads not connected, poor packaging, damage, etc). I can understand mistakes, I make a few of them myself, and provided they're easilly sorted, I'm OK with them. 

I also have no problems if instructed opening up the item (shouldn't have to... no - but I get that if it's not difficult and it's far easier than dealing with postage back and forth, etc - it's a viable options). I understand that even with some good quality products the odd lemon can get through QC and get out there.

But one thing that really scares me is the run-around customer support, where it's like talking to a wall, and not getting questions answered, or where you feel like they're deliberately trying to hinder the conversation so you'll give up and will go away. 

Another thing I'm not entirely convinced about is the $10 value on the return, which sounds dodgy, and not something I'd expect from a more reputable company. When I ship expensive goods, I like to insure them, and it's a bit hard to do so when undervaluing the product.  I would have thought that if an item was marked as 'returning defective item', or 'replacement item' that custom charges aren't a thing as it's a back and forth issue in that case. Is this not so? 

Even though I don't have winwing products, I'm grateful a company exists that is willing to make these peripherals. I just hope that they're able to grow and learn quickly from their mistakes, and cull out poor customer service staff and replace with people who can offer better service that will reflect better on their public image, and give their customers a better experience.

Edited December 1, 2023 by Dangerzone

[Vector1]

Had my WinWing products over 2 months now, no problems so far, guess it must be luck of the draw, As far as I can see great product with lots of versatile features, for less cost!

Edited December 2, 2023 by Vector1

[eFirehawk]

On 11/30/2023 at 8:13 AM, justAflankerFAN said:

TM is no better either. On the contrary, TM charge you an outrageous price for an inferior product with less functionality than WW ( I'm talking about the TM F-16 TQS that cost 550 USD compared to WW 330 ).
Virpil / VKB also first ask you to open their devices for a self-diagnosis and replace broken components as well. And if you can't do that then you can ask them for a refund, only differences here is these 2 brands are well-established in the flight sim community & has a far older history in flight sim peripheral market than WW, has better logistic as both VKB / Virpil has warehouse in EUR & The US, and thus have better customer support. Meanwhile, WW still stuck with having people with poor grasp of English as their customer support & is still in the process of opening up a warehouse in US. Also, the leadership of VKB / Virpil are Westerner with an already good understanding of how business is conducted in the West, WW AFAIK is mostly Chinese owned and they have a different business culture there compared to the West

Bottom line is, if you want to have a Hornet or F-15 or F-16 replica sim peripheral then Winwing is your only choice. TM F-16 throttle is pure garbage for its money, their joystick base can't be customized and overprice compared to what is currently in the market. Meanwhile, WW base can be adjusted with extra cam and spring. TM Warthog is known for <profanity>ty switches, and it took them a decade to replaced the TDC slew with a better one. Pick your poison

 

Mind telling me what is the issue with TM switches? Are you referring to throttles or grips? I will stop using my WW base + A-10 grip and go back to Virpil + A-10 grip from TM, with one of the reasons being the buttons and switches feel much better on my 10 year-old TM Warthog grip ( plus the Virpil is way more precise and smooth, and the metal grip of the WW feels like plastic to me for some reason ). The WW feels slightly cheaper in comparison. For the throttle itself I agree that TM charges too much nowadays for what you get, and the original TDC slew was terrible - although with the Deltasim upgrade mine was incredible, way better than the 'slightly less crap' TDC of the WinWing.

Edited December 3, 2023 by eFirehawk

[-Sledgehammer-]

and it goes on. i do appreciate, that they want to send me electronics (pcb, cables). but i am in no way an electronics guy. we shall see. i wonder what that will cost me, import taxes and fedex fees.

 

 

[zack]

On 11/25/2023 at 5:10 PM, -Sledgehammer- said:

To underline my story: 

how the lcd display worked out: (They promised me the refund of about 100 dollar)

they just not stand by their word. remember: the lcd screen was 4 days old and part of 900 dollar set. and this story is goin on for 3 months now.

 

In this case, I would still go ahead and send them back the panel even with only half a refund, even if they do not keep their word and refuse to send you the full refund, HALF a refund is still better than a completely wasted 100 USD. Working with CN business before, I know that the level of trust between customer and business is not really that high in CN compared to Western countries. I think the reason why they want you to send it back is so they can fix it and resell it since these guys don't really want to waste anything.

[Keith Briscoe]

Just a note to say, as a recent buyer of WW Hotas Max (Orion2, 15ex throttle, 16ex stick), I noticed after 6 days that the TMS hat on stick would not register UP.  I accessed Customer Service and YES, I did have a time delay due to time zones.  BUT, they responded every day as we exchanged notes.  I sent a video to show the issue.  This morning, the CS rep suggested, "remove the cap and see if it still has no values in Simapp".  I gently lifted the cap and immediately noticed the Hat now has full functionality.

So, small issue and easy resolution.  This can be a heads up that the Hat switches can have the cap pressed too far in and then create an issue with direction pushes.  Hope this helps someone else.

 

[-Sledgehammer-]

after 2 weeks of not hearing anything from customer support regarding my problem with the ka50 grip (they told me to send a new pcb and cables), nothing happened. i asked them what is going on and then they sent something, which i will receive on dec 28th. so, roughly one month of back and forth went by providing me with a hopefully functioning solution. 

btw. bc i needed a collective desperatly (some of you can understand that), i ordered the virpil rpc plus base with the sharka50 grip. the collective movement is out of the box supersmooth and very precise, the grip though is crappy compared to the winwing. plasticy clunky simple stuff. 

i gave my winwing base, while i‘m waiting for the repair stuff, to a friend who is more talented with electronics‘n‘stuff and he took it apart and put some nyogel onto the clutch, reassembled it and gave it back to me. what can i say, PERFECT, just perfect. if my winwing ka50 grip is working again, i will switch back to the winwing collective. and will probably sell the virpil.

Nyogel is magic stuff, i put also between the damper and the axle of my orion2 joystick base which i use as a cyclic, as described in another thread here. wow, just wow.

Edited December 20, 2023 by -Sledgehammer-