BaronVonVaderham Posted June 17, 2023 Posted June 17, 2023 Hey guys, Being new to DCS there’s probably a lot for me to learn. I’m wondering about the general behaviour of the free aircraft. (Tf51, su25, A4e). I noticed that when flying, I have very big turning circles. I can’t pull the stick very hard, or even medium hard. If I do I get high speed stall behaviour. Interestingly this behavior is at all speeds, soo not just slow or very high speed. And not very high, but typically around 3000ft or so. i would have thought that I would be able to make more aggressive manoeuvres. Am I misunderstanding the physics here, and should I learn to fly less aggressively, or is there a realism setting that is set to “unrealistic stall behaviour”?
Hiob Posted June 17, 2023 Posted June 17, 2023 (edited) No, everything works as intended. The P51 (or TF51 for that matter) can easily be pulled in a wing stall. The problem is, that you don't experience the resistance forces that would exist in real life. You would need to invest a serious amount of strength to pull the stick. It's just a matter of building the right feeling and muscle memory. Once you figure it out, you can pull pretty tight circles in the 51. Just remember, that there is a difference between tightest circle and most degrees/second in a turn, and the best cornering speed is well below the top speed. Depending on your Joystick setup, you might find it helpful to put a curve on your pitch and roll axis to smooth put the response to your inputs. Edited June 17, 2023 by Hiob 1 "Muß ich denn jedes Mal, wenn ich sauge oder saugblase den Schlauchstecker in die Schlauchnut schieben?"
BaronVonVaderham Posted June 17, 2023 Author Posted June 17, 2023 Yeah, I saw something about using curves for moderating extreme stick positions. I might do that. Currently I’m still flying with a Saitek yoke and pedal set, but I’m about to pull the trigger on a winwing setup with extension rod, which should help moderate stick deflection.
Hiob Posted June 17, 2023 Posted June 17, 2023 For warbirds and helicopters in particular, a long, well built stick (preferable with different sets of springs) is a real game changer. The centering force on most common gaming joysticks is far to strong in my opinion. Apart from Winwing, take a look at Virpel or VKB. "Muß ich denn jedes Mal, wenn ich sauge oder saugblase den Schlauchstecker in die Schlauchnut schieben?"
BaronVonVaderham Posted June 17, 2023 Author Posted June 17, 2023 (edited) so I tried again with the A4e, and I simply cannot turn. the turn rates are insanely slow compared to civil aircraft. it takes about 5 minutes or more to go through a complete turn. I don't believe an a4e has wing stall at 250kts and a turn rate of 5 minutes. Tried with the su25, same story. tried with the bronco: worse. Mind you, in the training tutorial I can’t get it to speed up beyond 120kts, and it won’t climb. what am I doing wrong? Edited June 17, 2023 by BaronVonVaderham
Hiob Posted June 17, 2023 Posted June 17, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, BaronVonVaderham said: so I tried again with the A4e, and I simply cannot turn. the turn rates are insanely slow compared to civil aircraft. it takes about 5 minutes or more to go through a complete turn. I don't believe an a4e has wing stall at 250kts and a turn rate of 5 minutes. Tried with the su25, same story. tried with the bronco: worse. Mind you, in the training tutorial I can’t get it to speed up beyond 120kts, and it won’t climb. what am I doing wrong? The Bronco isn‘t that fast after all. But 5 min turn for the A4? Should be no more like, what, 30 sec. or so. Have you checked your input bindings? Double bindings on axis? Bring in the control indicator overlay and see if the virtual controls actually are fully deflecting. Check Landing gear, speedbrakes, flaps etc. Maybe load up a video or a track file for us to take a look. Edit: Ok, just checked. A-4E, Caucasus free flight. Turns out my estimate wasn‘t to bad. First and only try, I managed to zip around a full circle east to east in ~32 seconds. Speed just shy of 400 kts. Have‘t flown it in ages. There is something of with your settings I assume. I would check the input settings. (And provide a track) Edit2: Dang it, now you got me hooked. In my second try I managed ~29 sec @ 300 kts and ~25 sec @ 400 kts. Edit3: With the TF-51, I managed ~18 sec. for a full circle, starting with 300 mph. It looses a lot of speed in the process though. Ok, last but not least. With the Bronco, I hit 235 knots at the end of the runway (free flight Anderson AF base. My guess is, that your throttle axis is faulty. You probably don‘t give full throttle. As I said before. Double check your bindings and provide tracks. Going to bed now. Good Luck! Edit (again Last thought. Have you checked your propeller pitch in the Bronco? Edited June 17, 2023 by Hiob 1 "Muß ich denn jedes Mal, wenn ich sauge oder saugblase den Schlauchstecker in die Schlauchnut schieben?"
BaronVonVaderham Posted June 18, 2023 Author Posted June 18, 2023 I tried looking for the prop lever, but couldn’t find it. And if it’s hidden behind or under the throttle that means moving the throttle to idle to advance the prop lever. in any case, I’ll make some recordings today of some flights. I suspect the tf51 is behaving as you described. But the others, I’d say there must be something wrong with the settings somehow. throttle moves ask the way forward in my cockpits soo I assume the actual thrust is set accordingly.
Hiob Posted June 18, 2023 Posted June 18, 2023 Do you know how to bring up the controls overlay? (r-ctrl+enter) There you can see, what the virtual controls are doing and if you really are at full throttle. "Muß ich denn jedes Mal, wenn ich sauge oder saugblase den Schlauchstecker in die Schlauchnut schieben?"
razo+r Posted June 18, 2023 Posted June 18, 2023 The best thing would be to make a short video or even better, attach a short track to showcase the issue.
Ironhand Posted June 18, 2023 Posted June 18, 2023 (edited) 19 hours ago, BaronVonVaderham said: so I tried again with the A4e, and I simply cannot turn. the turn rates are insanely slow compared to civil aircraft. it takes about 5 minutes or more to go through a complete turn. I don't believe an a4e has wing stall at 250kts and a turn rate of 5 minutes. Tried with the su25, same story. tried with the bronco: worse. Mind you, in the training tutorial I can’t get it to speed up beyond 120kts, and it won’t climb. what am I doing wrong? If you provide a short track with either the TF-51 or Su-25T (the two aircraft everyone has access to), it’ll be a lot easier to figure out what the issue might be. 250 kts, in a jet, is fairly slow for a turn. It won’t allow much back pressure on the stick without falling out of the sky. You might find some of this helpful: Edited June 18, 2023 by Ironhand 1 YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCU1...CR6IZ7crfdZxDg _____ Win 11 Pro x64, Asrock Z790 Steel Legend MoBo, Intel i7-13700K, MSI RKT 4070 Super 12GB, Corsair Dominator DDR5 RAM 32GB.
BaronVonVaderham Posted June 18, 2023 Author Posted June 18, 2023 Did another dogfight training with the a4e. Looks like it behaves like you described, I.e. turning at 250kts is slow and close to stall (buffering of the aircraft). I never managed to get a clean shot circling around each other at low speed. Not sure how to deal with such scenarios without turning my back to an enemy gun. i also tried the bronco again, and this time it went fine. It was indeed the prop lever. The instructions do call it it, but not all areas in the cockpit are clickable soo I could not move the levers. I mapped it to a spare lever and managed to operate it. the pedals are still unusable for differential braking.
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