kingneptune117 Posted August 15, 2010 Author Posted August 15, 2010 I say we just lock this thread up and let it die, maybe even sticky it as im sure when the product releases it will be quite the popular question. The answer is within the first page of this thread. "When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long to return." - Leonardo da Vinci Intel i7-4790k | Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo heat sink | Thermaltake Core V71 case | 750W EVGA PSU | 8gb G.SKILL Ripjaws DDR3 RAM | MSI Z97 Gaming 5 LGA 1150 motherboard | Samsung SSD | ASUS STRIX GTX 970 | Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog | TIR 5 | Razer Deathadder | Corsair K70
EtherealN Posted August 15, 2010 Posted August 15, 2010 (edited) Again I say: DRM does not prevent piracy. True, but do you not think it may reduce it? Mower, you are right: DRM does not "prevent" piracy. However, as Nate says, it does reduce it. And the reduction in significant. I cannot go into specifics here (I hope your understand why), but DRM can be a life-and-death thing for developers even if the product does end up "cracked" anyhow. And if you don't understand how, you've never worked in this business and should suspend your judgement until you have. Thanks. ;) If you do work in the industry and feel like countering this argument, feel free to PM me. Otherwise this is the absolute end of that part of the discussion in this thread. Edited August 15, 2010 by EtherealN [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Daniel "EtherealN" Agorander | Даниэль "эфирныйн" Агорандер Intel i7 2600K @ 4.4GHz, ASUS Sabertooth P67, 8GB Corsair Vengeance @ 1600MHz, ASUS GTX 560Ti DirectCU II 1GB, Samsung 830series 512GB SSD, Corsair AX850w, two BENQ screens and TM HOTAS Warthog DCS: A-10C Warthog FAQ | DCS: P-51D FAQ | Remember to read the Forum Rules | | | Life of a Game Tester
key_stroked Posted August 19, 2010 Posted August 19, 2010 I don't understand why some people are crusading on here against Steam? Would you like to start a new movement, lock arms and barracade Steam headquarters to prevent the whole world from using it? If new users wants to use Steam, let them. And likewise, no one is forcing you complainers to buy any DCS product through Steam. So all the "if A-10 is on steam I'm out" comments are just stupid.
sweinhart3 Posted August 19, 2010 Posted August 19, 2010 I hate steam. Cant stand having to log in everytime I boot up to be able to play a game. Ill stick with the regular digital download burned to dvd. Intel i7 990X, 6GB DDR3, Nvidia GTX 470 x2 SLI, Win 7 x64 http://picasaweb.google.com/sweinhart
Lio Posted August 19, 2010 Posted August 19, 2010 Trying to argument with people who favor DRM is like trying to argue with a heroin addict that he shouldnt take his next fix. DRM solves nothing. It only shows you care more about the pirates then your legit customers. Im in the software business, all i can say is DRM that rely on device drivers is effectivly rootkits which equals that ED is involved in whats effectivly hacking of customers computers. If it wasnt for no-clue politicians who dont know anything about the digital era we would have some proper laws that protected customers rights when they bought software and all companies who used these kind of DRM schemes would be off to jail. 1
GGTharos Posted August 19, 2010 Posted August 19, 2010 I guess some people are not getting the point. I'll be issuing warnings and bans when something like the above happens again. I think the moderators have been quite clear on this. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
kingneptune117 Posted August 19, 2010 Author Posted August 19, 2010 maybe its my place to apologize for starting a full-blown forum based war? "When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long to return." - Leonardo da Vinci Intel i7-4790k | Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo heat sink | Thermaltake Core V71 case | 750W EVGA PSU | 8gb G.SKILL Ripjaws DDR3 RAM | MSI Z97 Gaming 5 LGA 1150 motherboard | Samsung SSD | ASUS STRIX GTX 970 | Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog | TIR 5 | Razer Deathadder | Corsair K70
Rebel44 Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 For me its simple: I buy games only from Steam No Steam version = no money from me (ohh.. and NO Starforce - because of that crappy DRM I cannot play my Silent Hunter game in Win7 64bit). Also availability on Steam can significantly increase games exposure to its potential buyers - IMO its better to sell 5 copies and get 70% of price from each sale (Valve takes 30% cut from final price of games sold via Steam) than to sell 1 copy and get 100 of price. Selling A10C for 10€ during Steam Xmas sale would IMO likely get more money to ED than what they ever make from direct download.
Yellonet Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 For me its simple: I buy games only from Steam No Steam version = no money from meGood for you, helping to create and promote less competition, just wait until STEAM is where all games are and they can dictate the prices any way they want :thumbup: i7-2600k@4GHz, 8GB, R9 280X 3GB, SSD, HOTAS WH, Pro Flight Combat Pedals, TIR5
Krippz Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 Good for you, helping to create and promote less competition, just wait until STEAM is where all games are and they can dictate the prices any way they want :thumbup: Prices on Steam have always been set by the publisher... [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 64th "Scorpions" Aggressor Squadron Discord: 64th Aggressor Squadron TS: 195.201.110.22
Rebel44 Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 Good for you, helping to create and promote less competition, just wait until STEAM is where all games are and they can dictate the prices any way they want :thumbup: LOL... another "genius" who is too lazy to even google what he is posting about.... - prices of all games in Steam store are decided by publishers/developers of those games.
Yellonet Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 Prices on Steam have always been set by the publisher...Not that much difference, as it is with physical media games, there's a recommended price, but the shops can still lower their margins to compete with other shops. If there's only Steam the prices will be set without any competition. Digital distribution systems like Steam are not created to make anything better for the consumer but rather to increase profit margins. The advantages to the consumer with easy installation, automatic updates and so on can be a good thing, but IMO it is offset by the limitations and privacy issues that it causes. Less competition is seldom good for the consumer. i7-2600k@4GHz, 8GB, R9 280X 3GB, SSD, HOTAS WH, Pro Flight Combat Pedals, TIR5
Yellonet Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 (edited) LOL... another "genius" who is too lazy to even google what he is posting about.... - prices of all games in Steam store are decided by publishers/developers of those games. What's the difference to the consumer if who sets the prices can do so without any competition? Off topic: And yeah, laugh all you want, you even say "google" instead of search, that says something about you, already trapped in another "customer" created (near)monopoly. If you can't find it on google it doesn't exist, right? How do we know if our searches are filtered or not? Edited September 18, 2010 by Yellonet i7-2600k@4GHz, 8GB, R9 280X 3GB, SSD, HOTAS WH, Pro Flight Combat Pedals, TIR5
Yellonet Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 error! i7-2600k@4GHz, 8GB, R9 280X 3GB, SSD, HOTAS WH, Pro Flight Combat Pedals, TIR5
Rebel44 Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 What's the difference to the consumer if who sets the prices can do so without any competition? Off topic: And yeah, laugh all you want, you even say "google" instead of search, that says something about you, already trapped in another "customer" created (near)monopoly. If you can't find it on google it doesn't exist, right? How do we know if our searches are filtered or not? You clearly dont realize that there are tons of games from many developers and publishers available at Steam. Well they all compete againts each other. Steam is often (on average twice every week) running some sale when game XY is (most of the time) 50-75% cheaper compared to normal price. Plus huge Summer and Xmas sales.
Steel Jaw Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 Again I say DRM does not defeat piracy. And Steam is bad news. It is faaaar too intrusive and not to be trusted. Those who would say otherwise simply do not understand how Steam interacts with an OS. "You see, IronHand is my thing" My specs: W10 Pro, I5/11600K o/c to 4800 @1.32v, 64 GB 3200 XML RAM, Red Dragon 7800XT/16GB, monitor: GIGABYTE M32QC 32" (31.5" Viewable) QHD 2560 x 1440 (2K) 165Hz.
Rebel44 Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 Again I say DRM does not defeat piracy. And Steam is bad news. It is faaaar too intrusive and not to be trusted. Those who would say otherwise simply do not understand how Steam interacts with an OS. Nobody is forcing you to use it. Myself (and others) want this OPTION. I already have around 200 games in my Steam account and I dont have any problem with Steam.
Erdem Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 Again I say DRM does not defeat piracy. And Steam is bad news. It is faaaar too intrusive and not to be trusted. Those who would say otherwise simply do not understand how Steam interacts with an OS. I can't believe how you guys can make comments like "Steam is intrusive" while you're happily buying ED games which are Activation/Deactivation limited, but also were Starforce protected in the past. I personally feel shafted by ED after BS was put on Steam because it didn't have the Activation/Deactivation protection.
sweinhart3 Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 I believe people were told to drop the DRM subject. This isnt the thread for that. 1 Intel i7 990X, 6GB DDR3, Nvidia GTX 470 x2 SLI, Win 7 x64 http://picasaweb.google.com/sweinhart
GGTharos Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 I believe sweinhart is right, and the CAP is now established. :P [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
Succellus Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 (edited) No NO no NO no NO no NO!!! No Steam ever! Steam is single handedly ruining the PC gaming market: -games release late -updates are inconsistent -inability to perform manual version management is troublesome -if steam goes down you cannot play the game you paid for!!!! -if there is a problem with multiplayer, steam will never care. And the developer can blame steam. Down with Steam!! They are the WORST thing to happen to PC gaming, EVER!!! Just my 0.02 Your wrong, i got a lot of games on steam even prefering other ways, and i never had trouble with steam. I m not a big fan of multiplayer due to bad connection anyway. The worst thing that happened to PC games are Consoles, dumbed down games for tards. The quality of the games has never been the same since PC producers found the console market. Edited September 18, 2010 by Succellus 1 HaF 922, Asus rampage extreme 3 gene, I7 950 with Noctua D14, MSI gtx 460 hawk, G skill 1600 8gb, 1.5 giga samsung HD. Track IR 5, Hall sensed Cougar, Hall sensed TM RCS TM Warthog(2283), TM MFD, Saitek pro combat rudder, Cougar MFD.
Steel Jaw Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 I believe people were told to drop the DRM subject. This isnt the thread for that. That's not what I read. I saw to stop personal attacks. Which I was not involved in anyhow. "You see, IronHand is my thing" My specs: W10 Pro, I5/11600K o/c to 4800 @1.32v, 64 GB 3200 XML RAM, Red Dragon 7800XT/16GB, monitor: GIGABYTE M32QC 32" (31.5" Viewable) QHD 2560 x 1440 (2K) 165Hz.
Succellus Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 Not if Steam isn't working (eg their authentication server is down). If steam doesn't load or connect properly then you can't load your game unfortunately. Once Steam has taken control, you lose it. The days of simply running an executable are over with Steam games. Your wrong, i don t know when your experience was. But your are someone outdated on the subject. Many times when my net is down i still play my steam games. HaF 922, Asus rampage extreme 3 gene, I7 950 with Noctua D14, MSI gtx 460 hawk, G skill 1600 8gb, 1.5 giga samsung HD. Track IR 5, Hall sensed Cougar, Hall sensed TM RCS TM Warthog(2283), TM MFD, Saitek pro combat rudder, Cougar MFD.
Guest Posted September 24, 2010 Posted September 24, 2010 (edited) People who have had a negative experience with Steam are so unwilling to bend their bias against the program it's ridiculous. Its enemies are primarily composed of old-timers so unwilling to adapt to changing times and the end of the eco-unfriendly era of boxed games and modems rated by baud. Steam is an excellent platform for PC game distribution, and in a sense, helped consolidate and save a market that was slipping only a few years ago. Steam has provided a way for users not only to manage and store large collections of games, but has also provided an excellent venue for publishers to sell their games to a wide audience of users that would never have known about their software otherwise. I personally own over 100 games on Steam and am a proud proponent of the distribution software and its parent, Valve. Claims of unreliability are based on a Steam from years ago (the days when only Valve games were provided on Steam), something us long-term Steam users have already known of and seen pass. Rather than embracing a new, useful technology, the old-guard has decided to toss out the idea of even distributing *their* precious software through a more efficient and logical method. By the way, the irony of those complaining about Steam being intrusive -- you do know Starforce's history has been, right? -- is absolutely palpable. There is a reason it is being phased out by nearly all major developers. EDIT: And Steam is bad news. It is faaaar too intrusive and not to be trusted. Those who would say otherwise simply do not understand how Steam interacts with an OS. Do me a favor and elaborate on "how Steam interacts with an OS" and its intrusiveness. Edited September 24, 2010 by ColumboRumble
T.Goat Posted September 24, 2010 Posted September 24, 2010 While I'll admit that Steam isn't perfect, it's a great tool for game distribution. And while there are some horror stories, keep in mind that at peak times every day, Steam has over 2 million users online. The couple stories you hear are a very small percentage of users. 1
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