External Lights procedure

[Tulkas]

Has anybody the knowledge on how are the real procedures regarding the usage of the external lightning of the A10 on start up, taxi, take off?

 

Thanks

 

Tulkas

[RogueRunner]

If I should venture a guess, manual on startup, auto on ops flights and off once cleared in.

[Furia]

If I should venture a guess, manual on startup, auto on ops flights and off once cleared in.

I would call that a wild guess :megalol:

 

Where is the Auto switch for lights? :thumbup:

[Tulkas]

I mean something more especific, like strobos and posicition on start up to warn that bird is coming to live ore something like that, what lights you turn on/off, dim/bright, flash/steady for every situation. We have all these choices must be a reason and I would like to use in a realistic manner.

 

No guessing here please, I can do that ;) hard, plain real procedures if you know

 

Thanks!

 

Cheers

 

Tulkas

[effte]

Normal procedure is nav lights on as soon as you think you need them, including when parked if you are afraid of having trucks driving into your wingtips. As you are ready to start cranking the engines, beacon on. Taxi etc as you need them. Strobes left off until you are cleared onto the active runway, both to let others know you are taking the active but also as an airport full of flashing strobes makes life difficult for the ground/tower controllers.

 

Depending on the threat level, either lights out as soon as you expect enemy contacts, as you cross the fence or as you approach a target area. If you are more concerned about collisions in the air than about being seen, you can leave it all on.

 

Obviously formation lights should stay on as long as you are in formation at night. :)

 

First paragraph from civvie real life, second educated guess. The key point is, use the lights you think give you the best safety margin for the mission, so there are unlikely to be any hard and fast rules - only recommendation and suggested normal procedures.

 

Cheers,

/Fred

[Tulkas]

Thanks Effte.

 

As far as I know the A10 doesn't have separated beacon/strobes but only anticollision. Looking for information and reading around I got the impression also that there is not so fixed rules, maybe depends on the uses of the unit/airbase you are?

 

Some times I read is normal to flash your navegation lights as long as you are starting up and configure the system, together with the A/C light to warn for the running engines and then change to steady nav.lights when you are ready to go...

 

There are not real hog driver's around?

 

Cheers

 

Tulkas

[twobells]

Entering cockpit on warm startup:

 

Formation Lights on max, Nav Lights steady, Anti collision flash on till take off then off till finals then back on AC flash, Nav lights on steady and formation lights on.

Fence in Nav lights off. Fence Out: Nav Lights on.

 

On cold apply settings during your start up procedure.

Edited February 3, 2011 by twobells

[RogueRunner]

I would call that a wild guess :megalol:

 

Where is the Auto switch for lights? :thumbup:

 

Pinky switch forward I think it is. Auto is prob the wrong description, default might be the correct term :D

[Steel Jaw]

There are FPS issues online with various light settings so we have not decided yet what the lighting policy will be until we have a RC in hand.

[S77th-konkussion]

Difference between anti collision and nav lights is the flashing?

 

Thanks to effte for the clarification on the strobe..

[Steel Jaw]

No, nav lights can be set to flash or steady.

 

When I flew Falcon online, we would set nav/position lights to flash during engine start and then to steady until engine shutdown.

 

Strobes go on when taking the active for reasons mentioned above.

[S77th-konkussion]

No, nav lights can be set to flash or steady.

 

I'll look for the switch.. (jeopardy theme)

 

 

 

 

 

OK So ctrl+P to bring up nav lights, but then the position switch on panel to steady. Flip to flash for takeoff..

 

The bright/ dim switch is a judgement call, yeah? Bright for daytime, etc..

[Yoni63]

RW procedure (when I was in the AF)

 

Position lights (nav red/green) on anytime power is applied to aircraft. This notifies all ground personnel that control surfaces could move without warning. In some cases, I've seen it amended to "just prior to engine start" until engine shut down. Aircraft that have a "beacon" usually apply nav lights upon any power (apu/battery etc) then prior to engine start, the beacon will be activated and used until engine shut down.

 

Strobes are only activated when rolling onto the runway for take-off, and only in flight when not in formation, and not during any significant cloud cover due to the flash back off of cloud surfaces. Strobes off upon leaving the runway upon landing. (don't think this has changed)

 

Nav/position lights flash/steady I've seen a variation of it's usage at different bases, however when an aircraft is remaining in the pattern ie: touch and go's, I've seen alot go to flash then on steady out of the area in normal flight ops.

 

As for lights "out" operation, that has recently changed, and I have NO idea what the SOP is for that. I do imagine active theater would be common sense lights out however..

 

I'm sure other's have seen a variation of usages. Just my two cents for FYI.

[RodBorza]

All good info on the lights procedure.

However, when getting into the area of aperations, it's lights out, minus the formation lights. The formation lights you can dim or bright them as you need.

Leaving the nav lights on would be madness when over enemy territory. If you look at the civilian aircrafts you can see them miles away (that's exactly the idea).

I don't know if in the sim the enemy AI considers if you are with lights on or off (hmm...a good thing to test...) but i usually turn it off as soon as I get fence in.

As a note, there is a campaing that the fence in point is only 5 miles away from the base, so, after I take off all lights are off.

[Heli Shed]

Entering cockpit on warm startup:

 

Formation Lights on max, Nav Lights steady, Anti collision flash on till take off then off till finals then back on AC flash, Nav lights on steady and formation lights on.

Fence in Nav lights off. Fence Out: Nav Lights on.

 

On cold apply settings during your start up procedure.

 

correct!:thumbup:

[mvsgas]

Has anybody the knowledge on how are the real procedures regarding the usage of the external lightning of the A10 on start up, taxi, take off?

 

Thanks

 

Tulkas

 

Just look at the manuals and documents thread

3.19.2. Night Takeoff. For formation takeoffs, flight/element leaders will turn the anti-collision

strobes OFF and position lights BRIGHT (DIM as desired) STEADY when reaching the run-up posi-

tion on the runway. At the flight leader's direction wingmen may leave anti-collision strobes OFF until

brakes release subsequently turning the anti-collision strobes ON and position lights

BRIGHT--STEADY for takeoff. The flight/element lead may direct wingmen to turn or leave the

strobes OFF anytime the lights cause distraction. All aircraft will turn formation lights ON. During a

night formation takeoff, call brake release and configuration changes over the radio. Following take-

off, each aircraft/element will climb on runway heading to 1,000 feet AGL and accelerate to 200

KIAS before initiating turns, except where departure instructions/local procedures/obstructions spe-

cifically preclude compliance.

[Stretch]

And if, in your squadron, you should desire to instruct your wingmen to set up their lights, be sure to use proper brevity!

 

LIGHTS - Position lights

SMASH - Anti-collision lights.

 

"Enfield 1, smash off."

"2!"

"3!

"4!"

[Jinro]

What's the procedure for broad daylight? Someone mentioned "common sense", but my common sense says that if the NAV lights aren't visible in broad daylight (in real life), why even turn them on in sunny conditions?

[ESzczesniak]

I can't speak to military operations. However, peace time operations often mirror civilian operations. FAA and ICAO light operations are:

 

1. Position/Navigation lights on once the aircraft has established electrical power.

2. Beacon light on immediately before engine start or pushback.

3. Taxi light on immediately before moving under the aircrafts own power.

4. Landing light and white strobe on when entering the active runway.

5. Landing lights on/off when passing above/below 10,000' MSL.

6. Landing lights and strobe off exiting the active runway.

7. Taxi lights off entering terminal gate area.

8. Beacon light off when fuel cutoff established

9. Navigation/position lights off immediately before disconnecting electrial power.

 

These are FAA and ICAO common and mandate rules, so all civilian aircraft will follow these rules. These rules apply in daylight, night, IFR and VFR.

 

I imagine likely modifcations fo the A-10 involve

1. If there is no beacon, this may be ommitted.

2. Landing lights on/off at 10,000' MSL make little difference...the A-10's landing lights are on the landing gear struts and are off once the gear is retracted (most civilian aircraft have a pair of lights on the wing roots).

3. All lights except the slime lights off at fence in and on at fence out.

[effte]

ESzczesniak,

 

do you have an ICAO reference? That's more detailed than what I can find in Annex 2 or Doc 9870 (of which the latter is recommenced best practices rather than mandatory anyway).

 

Specifically, Annex 2 does not mention e g landing or taxi light usage or on/off runways etc.

 

I'm not disputing that those are sound procedures - see my own post above if in doubt. However, I have not seen an ICAO document mandating them, so if there is one I'd like to fill in this gap in my knowledge.

 

Jinro,

Annex 2 essentially states that if equipped, aircraft shall carry the same lights as they would from sunset to sunrise during daytime as well. That's an ICAO "shall", or in other words mandatory unless you have an exception in writing.

 

Cheers,

Fred

[ESzczesniak]

ESzczesniak,

 

do you have an ICAO reference?...

 

I may have been a bit overzealous including ICAO. These are FAA part 91 procedures, with further stipulations in part 121 (not all of these rules apply to part 91 general aviation). I've only flown part 91/121/161 in the USA under FAA governance, but I've been used to these mirroring ICAO rules in the past and may have included ICAO incorrectly.

[effte]

ESzczesniak,

 

kudos for straightening that out! Rep inbound!

 

Cheers,

/Fred

[mic1184]

can anyone explain what the "default light" does when setting the pinky switch forward? manual doesn't say anything more about it?

[Stretch]

Position lights on, collision lights off. Keep your eyes outside the cockpit and see for yourself!

[hassata]

EDIT: Nevermind, it's in Paul's checklists.

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1122275&postcount=9

 

 

Any rw guidance as to when to Nav use steady vs. flash, and would below be correct?

 

Battery on, Nav on;

Beacon on; engine start

Eng. off, Beacon off

Nav off, Battery off.

 

Thanks

Edited March 2, 2011 by hassata