spotting targets/threats without labels on low-resolution (1280x800)

[ShuRugal]

so, i've recently begun playing online, and have found that my survivability is damned close to zero once i enter the engagement area. whether i fly fast or slow, the enemy AI sees me and engages me before i am able to locate the enemy AI. Twice this evening the only reason i even knew i was being fired upon was because the hog pilots were calling out missile launches at me.

 

so, i would like some advice on how to spot targets when i am playing on a server that has labels disabled. I have to run the game on 1280x800 for the sake of having usable framerate, and my monitor is only 17" even when i use F10 map to get the general location, the AI spots me and begins firing before i have visual on the hostile units.

[PeterP]

Some links on this matter:

 

Labels Aren't Cheating!

 

 

Cheating AI.

 

Isnt zooming on the HUD kind of cheating?

 

in short:

 

even if I have quiet a good experience with this resolution....

I use a triple head setting with a fourth monitor under the the middle one. in 3840x1792. So the middle-top one is running in 1280x1024.

 

...

But I can't imagine how you can come along without labels,

... as when I'm on 90° FOV you need to zoom in to around 25° on your 1280x800 to see the same as I on my screen(s), but than you are don't have the peripheral vision I have, that makes it again much harder for orientation.

 

I can't image how you can do missions you don't know without labels.

Edited May 25, 2012 by PeterP

[ShuRugal]

so far, i don't, i just get blown to bits

[Daniel M]

What's your approx range and altitude? I usually "refuse" to fly above 100 m for more than a few seconds, and really like to stay below 30 if possible. Engage targets starting from 7km (been getting better at engaging above 7.5 k after lots of practice...).

 

My basic sop is fly to foward edge of battle. If enemy units are known(fog of war and all taken into consideration), get within that radius, then start search from a low hover.

 

Edit: Maybe I should ask first; can you still identify targets in the shkval at that resolution? (I would assume yes...)

[ShuRugal]

approximate range at which i am taking fire is 5-15 kliks. When i know i am nearing a target, i stay below 50m. I've had a couple tunguskas engage me from further than i could rangefind with shkval, and a couple T-80s have blasted me from a good ways out as well.

 

I can spot and ID targets with shkval, but i have to be head-down to get shkval big enough to to do it, and it takes a long to sweep an area.

[159th_Viper]

....and a couple T-80s have blasted me from a good ways out as well.....

 

A T-80's deadliest toy is the 9M119M Refleks: Any closer than 6km and your life-expectancy will be measured in seconds.

[ShuRugal]

yes, i had noticed that. spotting them before i am within that range is what is giving me trouble.

[Puddlemonkey]

I learned that it is not just a case of spotting but of being able to avoid being spotted until you have seen them. A subtle but important distance. I was constantly flying into deadly situations. A few things I have found help:

 

1. Map the zoom anologue axis to a slider on your HOTAS. You can easily zoom in and out. On max zoom, you can spot very distant targets.

 

2. Avoid the temptation to stay low and use terrain masking constantly. You can't spot targets when you are low. When you pop up over terrain, you are suddenly ambushed. Equally, flying high poses the threat of you being easily spotted.

 

3. Keep moving. Set the heli up in a stable forward flight of 60 - 80 kph. If you are hovering, you are a sitting duck. Autopilot is your friend here. Use the turn on target or other method to adjust your heading without effort.

 

4. Situational awareness. Know where you have been, where it is safe to turn in an emergency and where you haven't scanned.

 

5. Learn evasive manouvers. Have the autopilot director handy. Pay attention to your location and direction of flight. When you get lased, note the direction it came from. Director mode on, dive, turn 90 degrees and fly low and fast. Snake around. If you have missiles or bullets coming at you, sideslip but keep up speed. Keep resetting the laser warning until it stays off. Now use terrain masking. Let flares go but not excessively as they give your location away. If the laser warning won't stay off, you are probably being chased by a chopper. Don't worry, you can out-run it if you are above 200kph.

 

If you are cooperating with another player, you have a few more options too:

 

6. One scans the skies whilst the other scans the ground. The ground scanner is up higher. The skies scanner can stay low and covered.

 

7. When one is tracking a target or firing, the other scans for threats.

 

8. Move from safe spot to the next safe spot. When you move out. One goes whilst the other plays overwatch. The front man stores or shoots targets and threats. The overwatcher watches for missiles etc firing. Any firing are locked up and shot. If the front man gets into trouble, he heads back fast and low whilst often the overwatcher can shoot the threat which is absorbed in chasing the front man and hasn't spotted the overwatcher.

[Daze]

Download and install these labels from winz: http://forums.eagle.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=50318&d=1302950310

I've modified my lables to only show a small dark ~ symbol (looks more like a square in game) for ground and air units, so no magic missiles spoting with labels, and I find navy targets to be well visible from afar.

 

Air units labels are vissible from 30km away, while ground from only 10km away. And I use the same color for both red and blue coalition.

 

You can give them a try if you want.

I personaly turn them off at start of every mission and only turn them on rarely.

[sjpateys]

yes i've been shot down by those as well. the T-72's carry them as well.i had no idea that tanks fired ATGM'S. There's an irony there somewhere.

[PeterP]

1. Map the zoom anologue axis to a slider on your HOTAS. You can easily zoom in and out. On max zoom, you can spot very distant targets.

Maybe you want to try something like described in this thread.

Much more convenient/quicker for me than adjusting a axis:

Zoom-In/Zomm-Out on PAC1 to make your life easier !

 

Use a button to zoom in/out seamlessly to a set FOV without to need to adjust a axis , just by simply hold/toggle a button.

[Damage]

The Laser Warning Receiver [LWR] is your friend. (DCS BS2 Manual EN.pdf / page 121-122) If it starts to warn you that you you have a threat, move in the opposite direction and keep pushing the Reset LRW button until the warning stops. Then you can turn around and attempt to identify and destroy the threat from a safe distance. You can switch from auto to manual mode on the Weapon Control Panel to use the Vikhr from 9500 m @ 500' AGL which is out of range of T-80's, BMP-3's, AAA, IR SAM's, etc. If your getting bagged by Radar SAM's, then the SEAD guys haven't done their job :smilewink:

Edited May 28, 2012 by =Damage=

[TurboHog]

The Laser Warning Receiver [LWR] is your friend. (DCS BS2 Manual EN.pdf / page 121-122) If it starts to warn you that you you have a threat, move in the opposite direction and keep pushing the Reset LRW button until the warning stops. Then you can turn around and attempt to identify and destroy the threat from a safe distance. You can switch from auto to manual mode on the Weapon Control Panel to use the Vikhr from 9500 m @ 500' AGL which is out of range of T-80's, BMP-3's, AAA, IR SAM's, etc. If your getting bagged by Radar SAM's, then the SEAD guys haven't done their job :smilewink:

 

Partially true. Sometimes there is an ATGM already on it's way depending on unit skill level. Best thing to survive is to move away in a zig zag pattern with your attacker at your 3 and 9 o'clock. ATGM's will lose the laser beam or do not have the sufficient manoeuvrability to hit a target moving at 200 km/h perpendicular on the direction of the missile.

 

Moving away with the attacker at your six makes you a non moving target. You can only hope to be out of range before the missile is there.

 

Also check if the laser is in guidance mode or laser range find mode. For example: if a vikhr is fired at you, the LWR will indicate that something is lasing you in guidance mode. However, the most common and most deadly laser beam riding ATGM's will not use a guidance mode that can be detected by the LWR.