ILS Tutorial and Mission

[NC_Cyborg]

I created this mission and video over the weekend. Please let me know what you think.

 

Tbilisi ILS Training - Easy.miz

[Midnight]

Good show James, IFR flight sometimes get neglected.

[FreeFall]

I skipped some parts of the video, but did you contact the tower?

[NC_Cyborg]

I did contact the tower but was informed I was cleared for the visual. It didn't make much sense being cleared for the visual when you can't see anything. So, I edited it out.

[Evil.Bonsai]

Next, try the same misson with dense fog :) My first (and so far only) landing with IFR/ILS

 

[NC_Cyborg]

Evil,

 

I liked the landing. I was really expecting a landing on the runway. Soft field landings are important too.

 

Thanks for the chuckle.

[Mortifa]

Thanks!

[adese]

Man that is some soupy stuff. Great video James, clear and good information.

 

In the spirit of sharing, here's one from a group training mission.

[sobe]

James

I have watched your video several times and tried your mission also several times. While I find the runway, I cannot seem to get the ILS to work. Which side do you leave the Able/Stow switch in the MSNP? I also do not hear the beeping from the ILS. In the MSNP, do you have both the steerpt and ILS buttons presses as you get closer to the runway? I know I am doing something wrong but I don't know what it is.

[Zenra]

If you do not hear the Morse Code ID signal for the ILS then first check to make sure you have turned the ILS receiver ON, have the proper channel selected and that ILS is enabled on audio panel.

 

On the NMSP press the ILS key and check that it is lit with the little triangle indicating you have the system set to track the ILS. Enable (not Stow) the needles

[HattoriHanzo]

I enjoyed this. thanks for posting!

[NC_Cyborg]

James

I have watched your video several times and tried your mission also several times. While I find the runway, I cannot seem to get the ILS to work. Which side do you leave the Able/Stow switch in the MSNP? I also do not hear the beeping from the ILS. In the MSNP, do you have both the steerpt and ILS buttons presses as you get closer to the runway? I know I am doing something wrong but I don't know what it is.

 

Sobe,

 

I keep the needles stowed. Glideslope indication can be found on the left side of the ADI. Before you intercept the glideslope, you will see the glideslope indicator with the triangle pegged out at the top. The closer you get to the glideslope that triangle will drop down. Just before the triangle hits centerline, you should be adjusting pitch, power and last set of flaps. Keep adjusting all the way down until you can see the runway.

 

Stow the needles - I have been digging into that and found on that most posts on this forum suggest that needles act like a flight director. The flight director uses the waypoints entered into the flight computer to tell the pilot where he/she should pilot the aircraft in order to get to the next waypoint.

 

I will try to confirm this in the next couple of days.

 

No beeps - Make sure you are tuned to the right frequency and that the ILS panel is on. You might have to wait a few seconds for the broadcast.

 

Let me know how this works out for you.

[NC_Cyborg]

Sobe,

 

Were you able to figure it out?

[ptako]

Stow the needles - I have been digging into that and found on that most posts on this forum suggest that needles act like a flight director.

 

As far as I know they're not. They should work like flight director (and they do for steerpoint navigation selected on NMSP) but for ILS they're just repeaters of ADI/HSI indications. So if you will try interpret needles positions as you do for steeropint navigation you're gonna to have a bad day...

[sobe]

James R. Wright

I got the beeping working on the ILS and read a lot of threads on the needles. I am used to the needles working fine in BMS and just assumed that I was doing something wrong. However, it appears that the needles in A10 do not work properly for ILS landings. Too bad.

 

Still a little unclear about your statement "Glideslope indication can be found on the left side of the ADI. Before you intercept the glideslope, you will see the glideslope indicator with the triangle pegged out at the top. The closer you get to the glideslope that triangle will drop down."

 

One of the problems that I had was trying to turn on the ILS in IControl for the Ipad, but the developer responded by stating that you cannot turn the ILS on with IControl, only adjust the numbers.

[FreeFall]

Still a little unclear about your statement "Glideslope indication can be found on the left side of the ADI. Before you intercept the glideslope, you will see the glideslope indicator with the triangle pegged out at the top. The closer you get to the glideslope that triangle will drop down."

 

Doesn't sound as a pure general rule to me either. Quote from the Manual:

 

Glide Slope Deviation Scale and Glide Slope Indicator.

 

Located along the left side of the ADI, this fixed scale and moving caret indicator displays the position of the glide slope in relation to the aircraft. Basically, the caret is the glide slope. If it is high, you are low.

For example: if the caret is on the bottom dot, you are above the glide slope. The common

terminology would be “you are 2 dots high”. Conversely, if the caret is on the first dot

above middle you are below the glide slope. The term would be “you are 1 dot low”. It is a

general rule that if you go more than 1 dot low or more than 2 dots high you go missed

approach and try again.

[NC_Cyborg]

Sobe,

 

Please reference the images below.

 

Again when you turn to final, line up on the localizer first and then the glideslope.

 

When lining up with the glideslope let the needle drop to you and then follow it down. Just like the video.

[NC_Cyborg]

I was able to get the time and try and few things out this afternoon.

 

First, I made a very simple mission with one A-10C with no waypoints and made use of the ILS at Kutaisi. With no waypoints in the CDU for the needles to use as a flight director, I also turned the Steerpoint off (to be safe) and ILS on. I enabled the needles and they acted like they should have. Localizer came in and matched the same rate of the CDI on the HSI. I joined the localizer above the glideslope and had to drop down to get it. But it worked like I have seen the in real world. The glideslope is just as touchy as the real world.

 

Second track is the one where I made my video from. This mission has waypoints to identify the turnpoints in a traffic pattern. When I made my turn to line up with the localizer, I turned off the Steerpoint mode, turned on ILS mode and enabled the needles. Everything worked just liked the first track. (Minus the landing gear, wireless keyboard is running low on juice)

 

Sobe, you are correct in enabling the needles and turning off Steerpoint Mode. The needles work like they should in the real world with regards to the ILS approach.

 

I will make another video with the new information.

Kutaisi ILS No Waypoints.trk

Tbilisi ILS Landing 02.trk

[Ranger79]

Good stuff!

[sobe]

This just goes to demonstrate that "we" virtual pilots have a lot to learn as to how the systems really work in the A10. This is going to be a long struggle.

 

Thanks for putting so much effort into my confusion. I will try out your tracks later today.

 

The next big hurdle is understanding the CDU. Boy is that a mess. I have watched videos on the CDU, but they assume a little too much prior knowledge. Is there any chance that you can produce some videos on the CDU going from one stage to the next?

 

This is like the panhandler asking for a dollar and when he gets it, he then asks for another $5.

[NC_Cyborg]

I am glad we got this figured out.

 

Another video covering the CDU? That is a big step. Where to start? In the manual the CDU is about one third of it. There is so much to cover. When I finally break it down into manageable pieces, I would be happy to some videos to cover that subject.

[StrongHarm]

Quote from one of my more polite RTFM posts(there are many):

 

Agree with OP, nothing comes close to this. I haven't felt this great since flying ball sims when I was in the Navy.

 

There are a lot of things to learn and some things are more important than others, true. The question is; what is an acceptable level of understanding? Enough to kill effectively? Enough to feel like you accomplished something significant? Undefinable?

 

I read the manual before flying, and have read it four times since, cover to cover. Once I surrendered to the manual, I found that I really enjoyed it. It's a shame how many people use it purely for reference. I can't tell you how many people I've met in multiplayer that didn't know there was a divert page in the CDU where you could get ILS/TACAN/RADIO/NAV information for every airfield. Besides that fact that three buttons gets you on the ground quicker than searching through waypoints or slewing the CDU. That's just one example.

 

I don't mind answering questions in multiplayer. As a matter of fact, I often open a server to the community to do just that. I am glad however, that I'm the one answering more questions than I'm asking. It's very frustrating to me personally to not understand the task I'm about.

 

RTFM... it satisfies!

[NC_Cyborg]

Strongharm, that is a great find. For A-10C, it took me a week to read the manual and learn just how to start up the aircraft. There is so much information in that manual.

[StrongHarm]

ED really did a great job on the manual. It's in a vaguely military format with just enough civilian polish to make it consumable. It gave me perspective on the subsystems and set the stage for how complex and capable this aircraft is. That really added to the immersion for me. I wish they'd do a binder print. It would be on the shelf next to my old NATOPS.