My TARDIS

[Panthro]

@MacFevre lol no, I meant it the other way. I'm stealing the idea of making a recess in the back of the button to help secure it onto the momentary, from your post.

 

I plan on using a flange on the base & an extra layer as a guide if there is more travel in the button press. I have yet to have my UFC cut so no idea as to glue yet.

[MacFevre]

X, was thinking on what you've described. First off, on the "button jig," I'm assuming that the scrap metal for the vice would be to keep the button from slipping down? Just trying to picture the purpose. When i worked for the majors, I was only a line A&P mechanic so never got over into the hangar much to watch the machinist and the like.

 

I just received this drill press for Christmas, and as noticed by my pictures I'm still learning how to use it correctly. Haven't been able to get a dial gauge or anything yet to check the runout. So as one that sounds like he knows quite a bit about this stuff, would one of those slot drill cutter be better than this Dremel router bit? You can see by my picture (I think) what kind of hole it makes. I thought it did alright, especially with it only being glue that holds the cap on, so the hole in the cap basically discourages any lateral movement.

 

I have a good friend that lives in Almeria. Do you know him? :) I jest, of course.

[Extranajero]

X, was thinking on what you've described. First off, on the "button jig," I'm assuming that the scrap metal for the vice would be to keep the button from slipping down? Just trying to picture the purpose. When i worked for the majors, I was only a line A&P mechanic so never got over into the hangar much to watch the machinist and the like.

 

I have a good friend that lives in Almeria. Do you know him? :) I jest, of course.

 

I live about an hour and half's drive north-east from Almeria, I expect you know that's where the Good, Bad and Ugly trilogy were filmed ? ;)

I have never been myself, but I will at some point this year...

 

The purpose of the parallel is twofold, it stops the button slipping down under drilling pressure, but also serves to locate it at right angles to the cutter.

If your Dremel router bit isn't leaving a 'pip' in the centre of the hole - or if the 'pip' isn't causing problems when gluing the buttons then scratch my advice on the slot drill.

 

I'll keep checking in on your thread and I'll be happy to answer any questions about machining - I was a gunsmith and custom rifle builder so it's my area of expertise. Building cockpits however isn't :D

 

Tomorrow I can draw up a plan for an easy to make jig that would turn button drilling into a mini production line for you, if you like.

[MacFevre]

Excellent! Thank you. That would be extremely helpful. One thing you might also want to think about if your pretty good at jig designing is knobs.

 

There have really been a lot of different ways that people have tried to make those deceptively simple little holes, but as I know all to well, when you finally place that knob on the potentiometer, what you thought was a small error becomes a huge cockeyed mess.

 

Again, thanks for your assistance, and if you happen to need anything at all, don't hesitate to ask.

[Extranajero]

Here is a drawing that explains ( I hope ) the use of a parallel. Picture on the left without, picture on the right with. A set of machinist's parallels is pretty expensive, but what you can do instead is buy a length of precision ground O-1 tool steel and make your own. The precision ground steel is easily available in lots of sizes and doesn't cost much.

 

 

Drilling round buttons....hmmm....thats another kettle of fish entirely if you don't have access to a lathe. But it's do-able, check this out -

 

http://www.hobbylinc.com/htm/squ/squ10253.htm

 

I'm pretty sure you can get them cheaper than that, it was just the first link I found.

 

You would use it like this ( I've put a cola bottle cap in there as I don't have any suitable knobs :) )

 

On the underside is a square boss that you can grip in your drill vise

 

 

That gives you a solution for holding the knob, but you'll still have to be very careful when marking it out so you find the centre. Once you have found the centre though you can use it as a jig and drill any amount of knobs, assuming they all have the same outside diameter.

 

But if you can find a friendly machinist you could get him to make a centre setting device for you, like this :-

 

Let's say you have 50 knobs to drill, all 20mm outside diameter for a 6mm shaft size. You ask your friendly machinist to turn a dummy 20mm O\D knob from steel and drill it 6mm with his lathe - and that's your centre setting device.

Clamp that in the vise and adjust the whole setup ( small vise clamped in your larger vise ) on the drill press table until your 6mm cutter or drill bit enters the hole cleanly, take it out, and you are good to go for drilling your batch of 50.

 

Drilling tapered knobs - now that is more complicated. Holding tapered objects for drilling or machining is quite a challenge. I know how I'd do it, but I have a small machine shop...I'll see what I can think up.

 

I hope all the above is understandable and helpful :)

Edited January 9, 2014 by Extranajero

[Extranajero]

Here, as promised, are plans for a drilling jig for square buttons. Isometric view and a top down view of how it works. You'll only need two pieces of precision ground stock and to drill three holes and tap two of them. Actually the stop piece that contacts the vise jaws could be made from anything you have lying around.

In use as long as you make sure that the stop on the end is in firm contact with the vise jaws, and the button is in contact with the head of the allen bolt on top you'll get what we call " repeatability " - enough for this kind of job anyway.

Never throw a jig away when it's done it's job, you can recycle them into other useful tools or holding fixtures :)

 

Edited January 9, 2014 by Extranajero

[MacFevre]

This is awesome. Thank you. I do appreciate the time you've dedicated. If you have a PayPal account, I'll buy you a beer! :D

[Extranajero]

This is awesome. Thank you. I do appreciate the time you've dedicated. If you have a PayPal account, I'll buy you a beer! :D

 

My pleasure, I'm sure you'll have some helpful advice for me one day ;)

[Devon Custard]

Really nice to see skills being shared. Ill be needing that level of guidance soon Mac so take notes ;)

[MacFevre]

Always happy and willing to help anyone when I can! Don't know a huge amount yet, but learning every day.

 

X, is it important that the button be wider than the steel bar? I have a stock bar that is exactly the width of the button, so the vice kind of tightens on both. Was also thinking of the solution to the round button cap and applying it to the square. (We're actually talking about 99 total caps needing drilled, so a jig, I believe, is a good investment.) Anyway, what if you were to place two pins on either side of the square cap? That way, you wouldn't need to find the center of each cap. Simply place the cap on your bar stock, between the two pins every time.

 

One other thing. Your a machinist that has a shop? Bet you could find a bit of work in this community if you wanted! I'm not sure who else works or hobbies a lot in that field. I think MetalNWood does, or at least dabbles. I'd love to, but don't know a grand amount. There's a few items that really need a machinist touch, were few have gone before. Some things include creating and fabricating a stick extension, landing gear handle and mechanism, and the fuel refill lever and mechanism. Just a thought! :)

[Extranajero]

Having the parallel the same width as the button isn't really an ideal situation, but you may well get away with it.

The modellers vice would certainly work really well for the square buttons too.

 

I actually wouldn't mind taking on jobs for the pit building community. I'm working on flight controls for myself at the moment ( it's been a hobby of mine for quite a while )

I've given up gunsmithing due to the insane paperwork and regulations I had to go through, so my machine shop isn't being used nearly enough.

If you have good reference materials I would enjoy working with you on the landing gear and fuel refill, just send me a PM with more details, or post them here if you prefer.

The stick extension probably wouldn't be possible for me to do, not having physical access to the existing parts it would have to mate with. But maybe theres a workaround for that, who knows ?

 

Good luck with your 99 caps ;)

[llama]

Absolutely stunning work! Keep on with the updates. You are giving me many ideas. However, allocating funds from "KitchComm" will affect the final decisions....lol

[MacFevre]

Thank you! I hadn't realized how long it's been since I did any updates. :eek: And thank you for the kind words, really. And, what high command doesn't know, well, you know.

 

Mainly been going back and forth on the I/O situation. I do have a Bodnar board, as well as a Brydling, but I also wanted to have more of an individual, "per-panel" solution. So I've been looking into using Arduino. However, a sketch coder I am not. I've been trying to read up on it, but it hasn't quite clicked yet.

 

Fortunately, or unfortunately in the way you look at it, there are several people currently engaged in coming up with an I/O solution. Some based on EOS and using EOS specific boards, others with just Arduino, etc. Again, not knowing how to code Arduino I'm kind of at their mercy and awaiting those wonderful, incredibly gifted individuals. ;)

 

So I guess I'll just show a couple panels I've completed lately. The environmental panel I'm just using three Ethernet cables for a wiring harness. I'm running both the pots and the switches to the Brydling board.

 

The VHF panel is a little odd, sure. First, I wanted to try it with the analog display. I've realized that matching up the display with the aircraft would be a nightmare. So I thought I'd see how 7-segment LEDs would look. Looks alright I think, though I'd have to expand the first and last digit to have two LEDs show instead of just one. I'm hoping to get an Arduino or EOS board for that one soon.

 

So that's it for me lately. Again, thanks for the compliment.

 

[Hansolo]

That look great Mac. Yeah I think it is possibly best to use the 7-segments. I am eventually trying to go same way.

 

Keep up the good work :thumbup:

 

Cheers

Hans

[Duckling]

Looking good Mac. VHFs analog dials sure looks sweeter than 7segments.

You got rotaries or encoders for the freq settings ? When you say nightmare to correlate the position with ingame settings i guess you use encoders. Creating (somehow) physical stops on the dials start/end positions might be a way with encoders. Would need an additional code sequence to set sim same as on the panel (say you set a predetermid freq on the dials and then use a 'button' to write same to the sim, would be ok as long as a encoder step is not missed by the sim after that)

 

Cheers

Gus

[MacFevre]

Looking good Mac. VHFs analog dials sure looks sweeter than 7segments.

You got rotaries or encoders for the freq settings ? When you say nightmare to correlate the position with ingame settings i guess you use encoders. Creating (somehow) physical stops on the dials start/end positions might be a way with encoders. Would need an additional code sequence to set sim same as on the panel (say you set a predetermid freq on the dials and then use a 'button' to write same to the sim, would be ok as long as a encoder step is not missed by the sim after that)

 

Cheers

Gus

 

I am using encoders. I was going to use the rotary switches, but how would you use the rotaries? In the game setup, as you know, it's strictly an up/down selection. Do you know how? Is it possible using code or HELIOS or whatever to make a rotary act like a encoder? Otherwise, I found the smallest 7-segs I could find to fit in the window without making modifications and keeping it as original size as possible. They are green .28", and not the easiest to find.

[Hansolo]

I am using encoders. I was going to use the rotary switches, but how would you use the rotaries? In the game setup, as you know, it's strictly an up/down selection. Do you know how? Is it possible using code or HELIOS or whatever to make a rotary act like a encoder? Otherwise, I found the smallest 7-segs I could find to fit in the window without making modifications and keeping it as original size as possible. They are green .28", and not the easiest to find.

 

I would be interested in this also. I have a TACAN from a C-130 which looks pretty close to the A-10 one. And it has mechanical freq. indication. Using rotary switches would be so cool as the freq. would then be locked to the particular position (input) of the rotary switch

 

Cheers

Hans

[Duckling]

Freq setting can also be made to a fixed value. As long the dial and encoder has same angle per step. Sending a prespecified value by choice when the dial is set to known position whould sync the sim to the panel. From then on it's back to the inc/dec again.

The problem is to limit the movement of the rotary/dial to not pass the limits. A pin through the dial (through a cutout in the dial) might be the easiest way.

 

Hans, same approach for the tacan. Long time since I digged into my Tacan panel. Away from home now and can check it up on monday. As long the position can be tracked corresponding value can be send through clickabledata

(edit: I think the freq rotaries in the tacan are either binary or octocal anc connected to the geartrain, should be possible to extract and use)

Edited May 2, 2014 by Duckling

[Duckling]

Mac. Check out "wonderco_buy" on ebay. Sells .28 green 7segments in 5packs. Ordered them for my fuel and altimer (height) digits. A bit to wide but will do.

[Sceptre]

how did you get the MFD screens to work like that and what did you use for it?

[MacFevre]

Sorry Sceptre, but the MFD to work like what, exactly? I'm just using a 7" screen on the left, and the right is using the 22" monitor, the same that drives the gauges. I use Icemaker's EMC for placement. Apologies if this isn't what you mean. Let me know.

[MacFevre]

Realize it's seems like forever since doing an update, so thought I'd take advantage of sitting in a hospital waiting room waiting for my wife to have a procedure done. Currently trying to get some panels working with a Bodnar board. Didn't really like soldering a diode to a switch output, decided to give a try in making a circuit board. It actually worked quite well! I was surprised.

For simplicity, used Fritzing for layout to laser printer and ironing to the copper board

 

 

After tinning and drilling

 

Completed board with diodes and connectors installed.

 

This made connecting to the Bodnar much easier, neater, and can quickly change anything a lot quicker. Now if I had only 5 or so more, I'd be set. That is, of course, if I don't decide to change the I/O to one of the upcoming Arduino solutions. Deadman also has me thinking about using the PCCockpit solution. Need more info before deciding that, however.

 

More updates on the way!

[Deadman]

mice work Mac that looks slick.

[Duckling]

Looks good Mac. Clean and operational. Couple of those will save the day. You plan to have the boards seated in a rack/slot or likewise ? Hope all well with your wife

 

All the best

Gus

[MacFevre]

Thank you DM and Gus. And wife is well and just waiting for her to wake so we can leave!

Tell the truth, I haven't even begun to think about gear storage. Now I am though. (Like there's not enough to think about! ;) ) have to ponder that for awhile. If anyone wants the PDF or even a Fritzing/Eagle file just shout. Think it could be shrunk a bit. It's my first PCB, so still learning. It would be neat to be able to just CNC a bunch. Ah well, one day.