what to expect from Su-27 module?

[F l a n k e r]

Your computer will be simulating the FCS computers and radar processors anyway. I don't think the computer in a computer = boring argument can ever make sense.

 

Yes of course, if fact I speak for me, is my point of view: I don't like the MFD cockpit and too modern planes which it is very difficult to find performance and technical information (often this is also true for very old aircraft!).

 

There are a lot of planes "forgotten" to be simulated: MiG-23/-27, Su-15, F-4, A-4, F-105 ...

Edited August 23, 2013 by F l a n k e r

[Pilotasso]

I think when anyone jumps on a server should be grateful to play for free. Now if the mission doesn't suit everyone of us, that's too bad because its the owner prerogative to design the mission as he sees fit.

 

To me it is a bit of paradoxal to complain. If its too hot get out of the kitchen.

 

Those with skill will always prevail even when the loadouts aren't the best. A bit of variety is good for the soul. Having said this I disagree that SU-27S isn't of same Era as F-15C+120C as Ruaf still has great numbers of them, but it doesn't have to be. Designing missions sometimes requires straying away from reality. Otherwise we would simulate peace time operations 99% of the time :D

Edited August 23, 2013 by Pilotasso

[Prophet]

Agree, probably as frequent as aerobatics or guns only servers, because that what youll be doing if pitting stealth fighters VS legacy types.

 

Why? The mission designer could easily just not include the legacy types... :smilewink:

[nap0leonic]

btw, will there be more advanced system on the stand alone Su-27 module other than flight model compared to the current FC3?

[Pilotasso]

There will be a DCS level Su-27S further down the line, we will only get the AFM for now plus a few fixes.

[FlankerNation]

Flanker forever !

 

[YOUTUBE]<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/hu_iATSYckI?list=UUyr7fgL6ATr2VVhktQdAqmw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>[/YOUTUBE]

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hu_iATSYckI&feature=share&list=UUyr7fgL6ATr2VVhktQdAqmw

[verana_ss]

The F-15 radar was constantly upgraded. It's not about MSIP, v(Whatever), etc. It has always been receiving upgrades. The TWS upgrade happened sometime in '87 (if not earlier - AMRAAM was delivered in '87), and this capability in the '88 eagle -34.

 

Sorry for the late bump, just for the others who is skeptical that needs double confirmation, it looks like TWS indeed existed.

it cost me some just to get an access to the document.

 

This is going to be a bit(big) derail and a nitpick about version of the F-15C in FC3, I came across interesting read about integration of JTIDS and its capability in F-15C.

https://www.hsdl.org/?view&did=2570

From page 21

 

Installation :

- MISP was done in 80s and were waiting funds for 10 years. = only limited or test squad had it in 1996?(encouraging purchase of JTIDS is the purpose of this document right..? Page6)

- The only hardware changes (done with JTIDS installation..?) were replacing old stick with F-15E's and some panels. -> Stick in FC3 F-15C is new one and JTIDS panel is there on the left side of the pit.

 

Features :

- Is capable of sharing fuel, armament, radar, positional data and etc of wingman.

- Throttle and stick is used to update overall picture(?)

- Sharing own radar picture between wingman is done automatically

- Can even receive target info from Aegis and others.

 

I cant wait for the DCS F-15C :P

Anyway, getting back on the track, isnt F-15C in FC3 somewhat considerably new judging from the document?

[GGTharos]

The MPCD is not JTIDS

[Teknetinium]

Sorry for the late bump, just for the others who is skeptical that needs double confirmation, it looks like TWS indeed existed.

it cost me some just to get an access to the document.

 

This is going to be a bit(big) derail and a nitpick about version of the F-15C in FC3, I came across interesting read about integration of JTIDS and its capability in F-15C.

https://www.hsdl.org/?view&did=2570

From page 21

 

Installation :

- MISP was done in 80s and were waiting funds for 10 years. = only limited or test squad had it in 1996?(encouraging purchase of JTIDS is the purpose of this document right..? Page6)

- The only hardware changes (done with JTIDS installation..?) were replacing old stick with F-15E's and some panels. -> Stick in FC3 F-15C is new one and JTIDS panel is there on the left side of the pit.

 

Features :

- Is capable of sharing fuel, armament, radar, positional data and etc of wingman.

- Throttle and stick is used to update overall picture(?)

- Sharing own radar picture between wingman is done automatically

- Can even receive target info from Aegis and others.

 

I cant wait for the DCS F-15C :P

Anyway, getting back on the track, isnt F-15C in FC3 somewhat considerably new judging from the document?

 

This is what I have been saying, F-15C in FC3 is from 1996 whit AIM-120C. While Su-27 is based on 1986, 10 years difference, still some want to push even more. No wonder people are screaming for something modern on Russian side or keep it to same timeframe.

 

There was many squads that had their stock Su-27/33S upgraded to test today's Su-27SM/SM3/Su-37/Su-35. But that was only testing because no funds was there to buy them.

Edited August 31, 2013 by Teknetinium

[Pilotasso]

1986 era flankers is what Ruaf still has most.

[Teknetinium]

1986 era flankers is what Ruaf still has most.

 

 

Yes, But if you combined all squads of Su-27SM/SM3/Su-30M/Su-34/Su-35

they will have more modern fighters than many EU countries together + on top off that they still have Su-27S.

[Pilotasso]

Ruaf only purchased a handfull Su-30 AFAIK (the rest belong to sukhoi bureau), and Su-27SM/35 only make a few squadrons. Hardly a comparison like you made above. They still have about 200 units of Su-27S planes, which is close to the numbers of F-15C's the US still has (they retired quite a few already).

 

There are a lot more F-22's and Eurofighters than Su-27SM or 35's ;). Infact there are more F-35's than those modernised flankers combined. :D

Edited August 31, 2013 by Pilotasso

[Teknetinium]

Ruaf only purchased a handfull Su-30 AFAIK (the rest belong to sukhoi bureau), and Su-27SM/35 only make a few squadrons. Hardly a comparison like you made above. They still have about 200 units of Su-27S planes, which is close to the numbers of F-15C's the US still has (they retired quite a few already).

 

Su-27SM 241 fighters :)

[Teknetinium]

There are a lot more F-22's and Eurofighters than Su-27SM or 35's ;). Infact there are more F-35's than those modernised flankers combined. :D

 

I'm sure there is, but that doesn't matter in a simulator. if ED took warplane approach and charge for etch aim-120 they would get millionaires in a weekend:)

Edited August 31, 2013 by Teknetinium

[Frostie]

JTIDS appeared on the MPCD.

 

http://vnfawing.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2447&sid=9c4782f261220e689dd4e72d97b94c3f

 

 

 

 

 

MSIP didn't have TWS it was MSIP II which had TWS. MSIP II came with the improved APG-63 named the APG-70 which was installed on 40+ F-15C, that is the F-15C in FC.

 

The APG-63(v)1 without AESA was fitted on 180 F-15's between 1998 and 2005, the APG-63(v)2 with AESA has been fitted on 18 F-15's. The rest have the basic APG-63 without TWS and are still operational.

 

In the last 5 years 180 F-15C's have been fitted with the APG-63(v)3 with AESA radar.

Edited August 31, 2013 by Frostie

[Pilotasso]

APG-63(V1) which is a misleading name replaced APG-70 which was an entirely different radar than the early APG-63 (not just a modification), and both APG-63V1 and APG-70 had TWS.

Edited August 31, 2013 by Pilotasso

[Pilotasso]

Su-27SM 241 fighters :)

 

Incorrect, they still have over 200 basic SU-27S and a few dozen SM's (last time I heard they were like 32 units with more upgrades coming at a slow rate).

 

In what regards aviation world, wikipedia is NOT your friend. ;)

[Teknetinium]

Incorrect, they still have over 200 basic SU-27S and a few dozen SM's (last time I heard they were like 32 units with more upgrades coming at a slow rate).

 

In what regards aviation world, wikipedia is NOT your friend. ;)

 

I was incorrect there, The order is not more than 55 SM there will be more Su-35, around 140.

It doesn't matter that it only one or two squad that are using them it has been like that since the development of Su-30MKI.

I rather play by same rules and by same timeframe where we can judge pilot skills and not politics and wallets.

Edited August 31, 2013 by Teknetinium

[Pilotasso]

You can judge skill by flying the same airframe others are that's the easy part. :)

The hard part is convincing anyone that F-15C isn't of same era of Su-27S because they co-existed at the same time ever since they both entered service.

 

But I say DACT is more interesting and that will always imply differences in capability.

 

 

Cheers!

[verana_ss]

The MPCD is not JTIDS

 

No, what I meant and what the document says is that MISP was already installed in 80s to get ready for the further upgrades however the budget issue didnt allow them to purchase JTIDS for 10 years after that, thus encouraging purchase of JTIDS for F-15C in 96.

[FlankerNation]

FC3 Style Su35s Module ?

 

OK if had to say that someone is trying to make a Su-35s FC3 style module, how much will you pay for it ? knowning that it will have a payload of R-VV AA missiles and Smart A/G weapons plus it will have extreme maneuverability with 3D vector nozzles (including cobra) and some more detail will also take notice as follows:

 

* Accurate external 3D model.

* Advanced flight model ( Same as Su27s but little tweak to match the 35s characteristic ) Also need ED support on this one because they are making AFM for S version only.

 

So, again how much would you pay for a Su35s fc3 style module ? :thumbup:

[FlankerNation]

My Answer

 

I will gladly pay 50$ - 90$ if I can fly a Su35s with FC3 Style module because mostly i play multiplayer and I want balance in that because of upcoming DCS f18, f35a, f15e and so on.

 

 

OK if had to say that someone is trying to make a Su-35s FC3 style module, how much will you pay for it ? knowning that it will have a payload of R-VV AA missiles and Smart A/G weapons plus it will have extreme maneuverability with 3D vector nozzles (including cobra) and some more detail will also take notice as follows:

 

* Accurate external 3D model.

* Advanced flight model ( Same as Su27s but little tweak to match the 35s characteristic ) Also need ED support on this one because they are making AFM for S version only.

 

So, again how much would you pay for a Su35s fc3 style module ? :thumbup:

[FLANKERATOR]

I will gladly pay 50$ - 90$ if I can fly a Su35s with FC3 Style module because mostly i play multiplayer and I want balance in that because of upcoming DCS f18, f35a, f15e and so on.

 

I'd agree with you Sir. The future of the Russian 'air superiority' fighters is compromised in DCS to say the least. More advanced opponents are in development (F-22/35/18, EF2000...) while at the same time a single and much less capable MiG-21 appears to be the only planned reinforcement for Red pilots. One more threat to multiplayer IMO.

[TaliG]

I would donate no more than 10$ for a nonclickable LOMAC .lua mod, maybe less or even nothing. After BS and A10C I am not willing to go back to anything nonclickable, only reason I supported FC3 was because of the promise of AFMs and the ability to continue BVR online. I am against of milking a near dead cow...Sorry but this is how I personally feel...

Edited September 6, 2013 by TaliG

[Pilotasso]

I'd agree with you Sir. The future of the Russian 'air superiority' fighters is compromised in DCS to say the least. More advanced opponents are in development (F-22/35/18, EF2000...) while at the same time a single and much less capable MiG-21 appears to be the only planned reinforcement for Red pilots. One more threat to multiplayer IMO.

 

Don't agree those being threats for multiplayer since most servers are owned by red squads. I doubt the F-22/35 will be used for much more than aerobatics or guns server since there is no BVR possible for those :D