Possible Stutter With Windows 8

[martinistripes]

After reverting back to Black Shark 2 v 1.1.1.1 and being surprised to find I still had the same stutter I've been grumbling about recently, I decided to install DCS World on my older previous laptop running Windows 7. Although the frame rate's a little lower the stutter's gone. I would say with certainty that the cause was Windows 8, if it weren't for the fact it was an NVidia system. I'm still confident it is, since the recent stutter I've had (on the newer laptop) was never there until several weeks back (around about the time I moved to Windows 8).

 

Just to clarify, this is a big stutter I'm talking about, ie from between 40 - 50 fps down to about 9 - 15 fps. It occurs for 4 - 5 seconds, before returning to good fps. It's not the stutter/fps loss associated with smoke and objects.

 

Solved: Caused by CPU Thermal Throttling

Edited August 29, 2013 by martinistripes
Solved

[Cedaway]

I don't understand. Did you installed BS2 version 1.1.1.1? Why not have downloaded the last version, 1.2.5? (Or I've badly understoood).

 

And what are your PC's specs? (CPU, RAM, GPU, Windows version 32/64bits,...)

 

EDIT: I play under W8-64 bit and I don't experience those stutters. (AMD catalyst 13.8b)

[martinistripes]

I don't understand. Did you installed BS2 version 1.1.1.1? Why not have downloaded the last version, 1.2.5? (Or I've badly understoood).

 

And what are your PC's specs? (CPU, RAM, GPU, Windows version 32/64bits,...)

 

EDIT: I play under W8-64 bit and I don't experience those stutters. (AMD catalyst 13.8b)

 

I was tired of fps stutter in 1.2.5 so I decided to use BS2 v1.1.1.1 but I still got the same stutter. This made me realise, it's not the DCS build but something system related.

 

My specs on system with stutter: Intel Core i7-2760QM @ 2.40GHz, 8.0GB RAM, AMD Radeon HD 6990M, Windows 8 x64

 

Older system not showing stutter: Intel Core2 Duo P9700 @ 2.80GHz, 4.0GB RAM, Nvidia GeForce GTX 280M, Windows 7 x64

 

Note: I used v1.1.1.1 on the newer system without this stutter when v1.1.1.1 was current. The only major thing that's changed is video driver and OS.

Edited August 26, 2013 by martinistripes

[SkateZilla]

Things to try.

 

1. Make sure DCS isnt Using the Intel HD Adapter.

2. Disable XFire

[martinistripes]

SkateZilla, DCS is obviously using the AMD card... I wouldn't get up to 50 fps with Intel HD adapter. Also, I don't have XFire, but are you saying it can still be disabled in some way?

[SkateZilla]

AMD Radeon HD 6990M is a Dual GPU Card.

[martinistripes]

I'm sure the chassis I ordered didn't have any XFire options. I made a point of getting a more powerful single card to avoid complications and overheating.

 

I just ran GPU-Z which actually shows sensors for 3 GPUs all with different readings. :huh: But isn't having multi-GPU different to having multi-cards (and thus XFire configurable)?

[RagnarDa]

I'm having a new issue since 1.2.5 (I believe) with around 7 second intermittent freezes. It happens mostly when firing rockets or something firing at me in the Su-25S. It has so far only happened in this plane, possibly because I havent had time to try the others so much yet. Problem is I can't really reproduce the problem as it only happens sometimes and not again under the same conditions. I haven't had this problem before as my machine used to manage DCS quite comfortably (my FPS is 40-60 and capped with VSYNC) since I bought the machine in December. My specs:

 

- ASUS P8Z77-I Deluxe

- I5 3570K currently clocked at 4.3Ghz with a Noctua NH-D14 cooler and maxtemp ~75C on hottest core after an hour in Prime95. No stability problems.

- 16Gb RAM

- Geforce GTX 670

- Samsung 830 SSD disk on which DCS and Windows 8 is installed.

- TrackIR 5

- Saitek X36F/X35T HOTAS

[SkateZilla]

I'm sure the chassis I ordered didn't have any XFire options. I made a point of getting a more powerful single card to avoid complications and overheating.

 

I just ran GPU-Z which actually shows sensors for 3 GPUs all with different readings. :huh: But isn't having multi-GPU different to having multi-cards (and thus XFire configurable)?

 

There are GFX Cards with 2 GPUs on them, instead of individual Cards with their own circuit boards, both GPUs are put on one circuit board, w/ the PCI Express Chip and Crossfire cicuits.

 

HD6990M has 2 GPUs with 1120 shaders each.

 

AMD HD 6990M Home Page

 

It detects 3 GPUs:

2x HD6990 GPUS

1x Intel HD GPU

 

 

Power Profiles in windows can effect some things too,

 

if you leave the laptop plugged in, you should set it to max performance in the adv options, turn off USB Suspending, Make sure CPU and GPUs run Full speed, fans on full etc.

 

otherwise, whenever the CPU and GPUs hit a certain temp they downclock themselves to save power and heat.

Edited August 27, 2013 by SkateZilla

[martinistripes]

Thanks for the suggestions. Now tried it with 'High Performance' and 'full control' permissions. No change.

[PeterP]

please post a screen shot of your in-game settings.

[martinistripes]

Weird, just tried to do that but I captured my desktop rather than the DCS World UI.

 

Textures: HIGH

Scenes: HIGH

Civ traffic: OFF

Water: MEDIUM

Visib range: MEDIUM

Heat blur: OFF

Sahdows: HIGH

1920 x 1080

16:9

1 screen

512

2x

OFF

 

150 m

6000 m

150000 m

 

Checked options:

V-SYNC

FULL SCREEN

COCKPIT SHADOWS

 

Ran another test, this time flying straight and level instant action, ground attack: first run dumped fps 45 seconds in, second run dumped fps 19 seconds in. So it doesn't appear to be related to my position, or where I'm looking.

 

Also, turned off system restore, UAC and SmartScreen. Should I turn off indexing for my SSD? Paging file is managed by Windows.

Edited August 27, 2013 by martinistripes

[SkateZilla]

Traditional Laptop HDDs are usually 5400RPM too.

 

SSDs should have Indexing Disabled.

 

they are fast enough, they dont need to maintain the index, and all it does is maintain a database of where files are located, alot of small read/writes, which arent needed.

 

Disable Indexing on SSDs.

 

The Windows 7/8 Search Service may also be causing some issues.

 

Other than the CPU and GPU, is the SSD being used in both Systems?

Edited August 27, 2013 by SkateZilla

[martinistripes]

Ok, I've disabled indexing. Should I disable Windows search service? I'm also going to make my user account an offline one.

 

No, my older system without the stutter has traditional 7200RPM.

Edited August 27, 2013 by SkateZilla

[SkateZilla]

Ok, I've disabled indexing. Should I disable Windows search service? I'm also going to make my user account an offline one.

 

No, my older system without the stutter has traditional 7200RPM.

 

 

oops, hit the edit instead of quote button the first time.

 

Disable Search Service (I've actually done this on alot of my systems, as it seems to alot of HDD activity for nothing).

 

 

Also Look into moving the Pagefile and Temp folders to a traditional HDD or RAMDisk.

[martinistripes]

Ok, indexing & windows local account made no difference. I ran DCS windowed alongside the resource manager. The peaks and troughs coincide with the stutters I'm experiencing. They happen more frequently in windowed mode but to the same scale (ie dropping to similar fps for a few seconds). Ideas anyone?

[SkateZilla]

I'd be interested in seeing the CPU Frequency during that time on a graph too.

[martinistripes]

See attached.

[PeterP]

Did you notice that the multiplier jumps between 32 an 8 ? - this changes the core-speed from 3192 MHz to 798 MHz. This is causing the stutters.

I don't know why it does this on your system while DCS is running , but here is one possible fix :

 

Disable Enhanced Intel SpeedStep Technology (EIST)

 

Open the BIOS settings during a reboot and look through the advanced or chipset settings and turn off EIST there.

 

Another option is to examine you power-profile and change it to 'high performance' or similar and/or create a power-profile that disables EIST when the DCS.exe is running. - please look also into your motherboard documentation for more info.

Edited August 28, 2013 by PeterP

[martinistripes]

No EIST settings in BIOS. And I disabled anything that might be saving power in Power Options. (ie Minimum processor state 100% and Link State Power Management Off). I also re-installed any intel drivers for my system from the Clevo site. No change.

 

Before I take the plunge and re-install Windows 7. Anything else that could be choking the CPU to reduce heat/power consumption?

[SkateZilla]

use HWiNFO64 to Monitor Temps.

 

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say the CPU throttling is the source of those Drops.

[PeterP]

 

Before I take the plunge and re-install Windows 7. Anything else that could be choking the CPU to reduce heat/power consumption?

 

No - some sort of CPU throttling is at work. This is the only answer how your multiplier can change dynamically.

And at least a sentence about this App must be found in your motherboard/manufacture documentation.

[SkateZilla]

Yeah, Changing to Windows 7 is not gonna fix the throttling if it's a Mainboard Setting.

 

 

Also,

Cooling Options should be ACTIVE. (PASSIVE DOWNCLOCKS)

 

What's the Model# of your Laptop?

 

 

And what Are your bios options?

 

C1E, C6 State?

 

 

 

 

Speed step shouldnt be kicking in underload. it could be downclocking to prevent overheating.

 

Turning off EIST without BIOS (dunno if this works)

Go to C:\Windows\System32\drivers

Find intelppm.sys

Right click, Properties>Security>Owner>Edit>Set your profile, back to properties, click ur profile and edit permissions: Full Control

Make a Backup copy (intelppm_back.sys)

Change this file name to something else (intelppm_off.sys)

Restart your notebook

Check status, Right-click ‘Computer’, select Properties. Check the status of processor speed (GHz)

EIST ON would read (ie) 2.6Ghz ~ 2.3 Ghz

EIST OFF would read (ie) 2.6 GHz ~ 2.6 Ghz.

Edited August 28, 2013 by SkateZilla

[xracer]

I'm using a variable multiplier from 12 to 21 all the time after testing things like stuttering etc. etc. I have no micro or macro stutters at all. But will be interesting to see what's causing his stutters.

[martinistripes]

use HWiNFO64 to Monitor Temps.

 

It seems thermal throttling is responsible for my woes. I recorded a log using this program. It won't let me upload the log file, but the cores had thermal throttling status which changed from No to Yes on cores #2 and #3 at approx. 85 degrees. I haven't had the back off for a while now so I'll give her a dust out (and try connecting my laptop cooler which I usually leave off). :music_whistling:

 

Apologies to Microsoft. :P