Get_Lo

well if you're flying straight they can be a problem, but in a direct comparison to the R3R, the R3R is far more capable at hitting a turning aircraft as it retains the controls from the R3S missile and should accelerate a lot better, also the R530 runs with a sustainer motor that should produce a smoke trail for most of its flight. The F1CE's radar has a good range but should struggle with ground clutter as the Cyrano IV didnt receive any sort of "look down" until the Cyrano IVM which will be coming on the F1EE. It should all depend on the simulation of the R530, but in real life the R530 was more dangerous to the launch plane than the target.

Unfortunately R530s are quite poor missiles, on par with R3Rs. Super 530s on the other hand, oh boy!!

Sounds to me like after they get their next FM feedback from their pilot and tweak the FM, they are gonna go for EA. Sounds good to me

Brand new video from Spanish Air Force!

+1 from me obviously If not new pictures/videos than perhaps a new Q&A forum? (also on a side note, I noticed in the first post, the one with the Mirage F1CE cockpit screenshots, I noticed it has an AA refueling probe, is that supposed to be there?)

Super glad you're feeling back in it! got my friend to buy PG and the F-5 just to join me on your server

I dare say it competes very well against the MiG-21 in a dogfight, you out turn him at 320knts and you retain energy better.

For me I kind of view it as a step up from including certain skins on modules, its so you can pretend to be the variant another country used, and if you choose not to do that, just go back to the native camoflaouge of the aircraft you're using. As we've seen, Aerges is giving us liveries from many nations that operated the F1, I just think this would step up the immersion for those looking to fly Mirages that arent directly modeled. And obviously im not wanting every weapon ever used on any Mirage F1 to be included in the simulation, but perhaps ones that arent completely un-feasible such as the Super 530F I mentioned? unsure what this would require. if it takes anything more than a software change in the plane I dont think it should be included. the fear I have of this is that it could turn in the F-16 situation where we get a Frankenstein plane, but I feel like I would be more okay with that about the F-16 if I could somehow turn it off and it took no development time away from the core of the plane, perhaps done after the competition of the core modules. Of course if turning it off is not possible I believe we should skip this approach entirely. the integrity of the base model should always be the primary focus. I think a more orderly way to discuss this would be, what are the Pros and what are the Cons, Im still unsure about this as I am personally a huge fan of the realism and simulation aspect and have always been for the accurate representation of modules but often find myself wondering what the Cons would be so long as there is a way to disable it. What are the concerns of people who are heavily against this idea? and for those in favor of it, why is that?

well for me its the same, but perhaps this could help the devs to develop more versions of the plane? This would simply be a hold-over until that is possible. and as for wanting the variants to remain what they are, that option would still retained. you could still fly the Spanish Mirages exactly as it was in real life if you choose to do so, this would simply an additional feature with no take-away for the players wanting pure historical accuracy.

An interesting thought I had that I believe would benefit both the developers and the playerbase would be to take the approach that a few other modules have in the sense that some features of the module can be disabled in the mission editor (such as the Mirage 2000's Missile warning system). let me give an example Obviously the F1EQ (for example) is not on the horizon or even scheduled, but the Spanish F1EE would make for a very decent substitute for those who would like to re-enact conflicts that the EQ took part in. If Aerges gave the F1EE the combability with weapons such as the 530F (I choose this weapon because it is very iconic for the F1 and it wouldnt be a stretch to see them on Spanish F1s) I think they would reach out to a greater audience of other F1 users and allow us much more range of scenarios to practice in with our F1s. Now what about the realism and the simulation of the Spanish F1 fleet? After all, their EEs never mounted S530s. Well, for those who are wanting to run historical loadouts only, They can check a box in the mission editor that restores the Mirage F1EE to its true state as a simulation of its real life counter-part, weapons included. Now lets say that in the future the F1EQ does role out from the Aerges development studio, I say that they disable the "Semi-historical loadouts" option as a whole and sell the EQ as an upgrade, I know I would gladly pay for it! This approach I think would offer a nice monetary boost to Aerges which can perhaps eventually help them develop the proper versions of the F1's we would be role-playing as. Anti-ship with the Exocet, SEAD with the Martel, I believe this would open plenty of new doors and attract many people to the aircraft while also having the option to retain the historical accuracy I know Aerges is striving for. I know the Fun vs Realism debate in DCS is a hard and never-ending one but im interested in the feed-back of other users and perhaps even Aerges themselves, what do you guys think?

The EQ would be absolutely lovely I agree! It will be interesting to see what balance of reality + fun they go with in regards to loadouts so I could potentially fly as a different nation's F1 and act out various real life situations, seeing as they already made some beautiful skins for them! I think it would be great to be screaming along the floor of the Persian Gulf sneaking up on an unsuspecting Iranian F14 and shooting him down with a Super 530F

Just Spanish for right now, if they get sufficient technical documentation they said they arent opposed to potentially making more down the line

Haha, its great to hear though! Im glad to be hearing from someone who knows so much about this plane. ive known about it for a long time by my extensive researching has only began about 6 months ago with the announcement on this forum. I believe the export F1s could indeed use French weaponry, as for example the F1EQs used only French made weapons, Super 530F, R550 Magic, Exocets, ARMMATs, and what not. Even the Spanish F1 used French made R530 missiles (they opted out of the R550 magic because they wanted US made Sidewinders more, and Sidewinder/magic cross compatibility only became available with the Magic II) and as for "Why would Qatar keep what's a useless weapon without a French aircraft?" I agree that would be weird, but also why would Spain accept the missiles if they also had no intention of using them at some point? I wish the Spanish flew with their planes armed more often so I could see some pictures of their weaponry. During the F1M upgrade they upgraded the radar and systems to be capable of using Exocets despite having none, so it would be weird to not implement Super 530s despite having many of them at the time?

well then that begs the question, why did Spain buy the Super 530F at all when they purchased the F1EDAs? the F1EDAs were bought with the purpose of using them for spare parts so I dont know why they would buy/accept the Super 530F if they had no intentions of using it. Also if they were primarily using Hornets for A-A why did they upgrade the F1 to the F1M many years after the purchase of the F18. Not to mention the Super 530s got delivered well before the F1M modernization was completed. I think for these reason alone we can conclude that at-least the IVM equipped jets should be capable to use the 530F, unless of course the Spanish decided to exclude 530F support from the upgrades (which I dont think they would have since I believe the IVM came with this feature as standard, so they would have had to modify the radar to not support this missile for seemingly no gain in other aspects). And thank you for the dates of the deliveries!

Some Mirage F1s could indeed carry ARMAT and Martel Anti-radiation missiles, however I dont think the Spanish ever bought these. as for what SEAD the Spanish did have for their F1s, they used Syrel ELINT pods and Barax jammers. No anti radiation missiles I believe.

@Zachrix you accused my friend of TKing the F-5, just thought you should see this

I would check all your missions, all 3 of the ones I played the Gazelles had no missiles (Mistrals or HOTs)

yeah I really dont see why they would pass up an opportunity to use the best missile in their arsenal.

Would appear the Gazelles are missing HOT missiles

Ive done a bit of research on the Cyrano IV fire control radar (thanks in part to a handy manual I found for it a while ago) and from my findings I THINK this is how it goes Early Mirage F1C designs include the basic Cyrano IV radar which is capable of look-up and co-altitude interception out to 111km and has the capability to support R530 SARH missiles A few years down the line the Super 530F development is under weigh and the French upgrade their Mirage F1C's Cyrano radar to the Cyrano IV-1 standard which is the same but enhances look-down capability, I believe this is the first version to support the 530F. The French later develop the Cyrano IV-2 which offers some limited ground attack capability. The Cyrano IV-2 eventually evolves into the Cyrano IV-M which improves on the ground attack capabilities and improves look-down capabilities and also adds the additional Track While Scan air to air operations. I believe this is the first version to support Sea Search and Exocet compatibility, im unsure if these features came standard with the IV-M By the time the Iraqi's are ordering their F1EQ5/6s they are asking for Exocet implementation, The Cyranos they use are upgraded with sea search and ARMAT/Exocet compatibility. I am unable to find the name of this particular upgrade or if it was just a refitting with a IV-M. although some of the F1EQs were fitted with French provided Cyrano-based radars that were simplified and slightly downgraded although permitted the use of Exocet missiles. The Cyrano IV-MR is the same as the Cyrano IV-M but with the addition of terrain mapping features. The Mirage F1M uses either the best version of the Cyrano IV-M or the Cyrano IV-MR. unsure which. Which ever it is I do know it can support Track While Scan, Sea Search, Ground radar ranging, Exocet capability (But do keep in the Spanish never bought and Exocets AFAIK, would be cool to see in DCS though) I am unsure about its ability to support Super 530s but I believe It can as older versions of the Cyrano could, but I have no evidence to confirm this. by the time the F1M was procured the R.530 SARH missile was REALLY old, so im not sure if this version could still use the R530. Similar situation for the Mirage F1EE, it either had the Cyrano IV-2 or the IV-M as it did feature enhanced ground attack capabilities (but without the fancy Anti-shipping stuff) still unsure on its ability to use Super 530s but it can indeed use the older R.530 SARH. and as for the F1CE and F1BE its a bit more tricky, They could have had any of the radars mentioned above (apart from the IV-MR). ive seen many sources saying that the CE/BEs already had the IV-M, but ive also seen many that say it was upgraded to the IV-M (When they got turned into F1Ms) Hopefully someone who knows even more about this can help me narrow down some of these mysteries. Does anyone know when the Spanish started receiving their orders of Mirage F1EEs? maybe the time frame could help us figure out which radar it used. here is a picture of a Spanish Mirage F1 with a Super 530F but I believe this particular Mirage is an F1EDA (Qatari Model) I really hope that the Super 530F gets put in

its a bit weird for the Spanish to buy these Super 530s knowing that the F1EDAs are only going to be used for parts, and not using the Super 530s on their combat aircraft. But as for the F1EE and its Super 530 capabilities I think it was part of the same radar upgrade package that they bought. I think the M upgrade to the Cyrano IV (making the Cyrano IVM) had better look down capabilities which enabled both improved ground attack and better ground filtering which allowed for Super 530 guidance (Hence why the Mirage F1EE and F1M have enhanced look-down air to air modes) to sum it up shortly the same improvements to the Radar that helped the EE and M in ground attack also improved low altitude and look-down Air-to-air operations, which is what the 530F relied on And for the Mirage F1M over the EE i think the only change in weaponry for air to air was the addition of the AIM-9M (which is why I believe the EE/M can use the Super 530 already)

Sort of. They obviosuly had and used R.530 SARH missiles which had good range for their day but the Spanish actually did acquire 50-60 Super 530F missiles in the 90s when they purchased the Iraqi Mirage F1EDAs. they put the Iraqi jets in storage but I dont see why they wouldnt use the Super 530s on their own jets considering it was the best missile they had by a lot. I havent seen any pictures or heard anything about them actually putting the Super 530s on their own mirage F1s but i hope Aerges decides to allow us to do so (if not on the CE/BE than at least the EE upgrade to make it even more special) (I also think the EE's radar upgrade package permitted the guidance of Super 530s, unsure if the standard Cyrano IV of the CE and BE allowed such operations)

The French Mirage F1C-200s and CR did carry a variety of pods but I do not think laser designation pods were amongst them. ATLIS was used by export nations though for sure

Pretty sure the R530 had a better chance of blowing up the launch aircraft than the target lol but its still one of my favorite missiles no matter how bad it is

Ahah! I found the fuel weight in this old manual https://gyazo.com/03d26992125a3a9c56b207e9a5641a75 7489lbs internal fuel, actually slightly more than the F-16 Turbojet is less efficient yes but keep in mind the thrust values of these two engines, the F16 has to use a lot more fuel (although it uses it more economically)