TripRodriguez

As I stated in that post, I was only discussing the real helicopter behavior, not DCS. Sorry if I cause additional confusion in a thread that is already rife with it!

Alright I tried real quick to estimate cyclic travel in DCS (using VR I've gotten excellent estimates of dimensions the last few days) but it was very difficult without doing some careful setup and spending a lot more time. That said, I will say that my feeling is that in game longitudinal displacement is somewhere in the ballpark of 7 inches vs. 11.46 inches RL and maybe6 inches lateral vs 9.45 inches IRL. Please note, these are not much better than wild guesses. If anyone wants to argue the point I will have to take an hour and set up to get an accurate measurement. I should be able to get it figured out quite accurately but it will take some work.

I'm pretty sure stick displacement is very small in DCS. I am going to go check that my memory isn't exaggerating this before I say any more but in the meantime here is the real info on the real Gazelle:

Yes I have found in my own "research" that different individual Gazelles have significant differences in the cockpit. Probably from upgrades being performed by different countries etc. Back to the "Servo" switch, would this normally be simply left in the on position at all times, including when shut down/parked etc.? Thanks again for the excellent information sir! Trip

@docwilly I have one more question for you. Can you give me any idea how much "spring" tension there is on a real helicopter cyclic? Does it vary a whole lot from one heli to another? I know it may be difficult to answer since it's largely subjective, but perhaps something like "easily overcome with one finger, somewhat difficult with one finger, etc. would work? Just a really rough idea will do.

Ramsay, what about the two toggle switches mounted in a dedicated enclosure just left of the fixed left hand grip for the commander? Trip

Chic, make sure you watch your SPAM folder for the reply from microhelis.de nothing every goes into my spam folder but their messages did so initially I thought I wasn't getting a reply. Tell Susanne I said hi =P. Trip

Thank you Ramsay, that is very helpful! Also this means I have plenty of unused buttons for sim controls such as start/stop my motion simulator etc. which is very handy! Funny for the armament button (big red prominent feature) to be unused! Trip

I wish to raise again a point already mentioned that I believe is complicating this. Fact 1: The vast majority of DCS pilots are using cyclics that do not match the real aircraft making it difficult to compare to the youtube video directly. Also there are curve and saturation settings in play. Fact 2: The animation of the cyclic in the DCS Gazelle clearly do not represent the real displacement of the stick, making comparing to the youtube video directly impossible this way as well. My conclusion: All argument about stick position required for forward flight is difficult to discuss intelligently due to these factors. It will be interesting to test Gazelle flight using cyclic with displacement equal to real aircraft (see image) and see if saturation setting tuning is required to get stick travel like in the real video. After this do flight tests to see how handling measures up (and ignoring in game cyclic animations). PS- I suspect the small displacement of the animated stick in game may be that way due to issues with cyclic clipping with avatar legs. I posited this in another thread last night.

@trigen definitely contact Juergen at microhelis.de . I am very impressed with this small company and can't wait to get my controller! It occurs to me that if Komodo does return to making controllers I'll have hijacked this thread. I made these posts about microhelis.de in this thread on the assumption that Komodo is gone and not coming back so my deepest apologies if that turns out not to be the case. I'll be making a microhelis.de thread when I get my cyclic.

I think the pilot avatar uses the top part but I'll check that out thanks. I have decided I think the attachment looks odd is it is a spring tab to allow some movement for comfort.

Thanks Ramsay, I've been reading continuously since posting those questions and have a much better understanding now of the trim functions, though your insight as to how these physically operate are the first I've seen. (Note: The following is Real Life stuff!) My understanding now is that "Mag Brake" moves the "spring center" to the current location of the stick so that you aren't fighting the stick to hold it in a position off center to maintain level flight etc.. My understanding is that the "Trim Actuator" function seems to work more or less like the trim functions I'm accustomed to from fixed wing aircraft, though whether or not using this would move the spring center of the physical stick in the real helicopter is still unknown to me. I'm also not at all sure if the "spring" tension in a helicopter cyclic is purely artificially generated or if there is a natural pressure (like that in old fixed wing aircraft generated by air flowing over control surfaces) and the mag brake artificially overcomes that natural springiness. Trip

First, many thank-yous to @docwilly for the fantastic information given in that interview report! My own comments are related STRICTLY to the animation of the cyclic in DCS: Without ever having seen the RL videos you guys linked and discussed the full throw travel of the Gazelle stick in DCS looked impossibly short. I notice that even with these extremely short throws the stick grip clips through the pilot avatar's legs. I wonder if it's at all possible the animation was kept this way to not make that problem any more disturbing than it already is? This issue with the stick animation is definitely an annoyance in VR, but I'll be honest and say I'd much rather have stupidly short stick travel and clipping with legs than have no pilot avatar! So regardless of my above comments, THANK YOU PolyChop for giving us a pilot avatar even if it is in fact the reason for the super short stick travel.

Hello folks. My questions are two. In the real aircraft what are the functions (if any) of the unexplained (and presumed non-functional in DCS) switches and buttons on the cyclics, collective, and video stick? See list below for details. Are there any functions on the cyclic or otherwise that deviate in the manual from the real world aircraft? List of buttons and switches I'm wondering about: Collective: "Servo" toggle switch Video Stick: The toggle switch just to the left of the video stick, up and down on the center mounted HAT switch. Commander Cyclic: All Pilot Cyclic: Top left HAT, button under large red safety, top right red button, front trigger Thank you for your time and effort, Trip PS- I just realized that a couple of these functions might be labeled on the in-game cockpit controls, but I cannot access the game right now to look and see.

Not to complicate matters further, but I have questions also. Some of these are not specific to the Gazelle, but this is the helicopter I plan to be spending all my time in. There are plenty of (seemingly conflicting) posts in this thread about how these trims work in DCS, my questions are all relative to the REAL aircraft behavior. 1- Real Heli pilots: How much "centering" force does a helicopter have on the cyclic? Under what circumstances (if any) does it decrease or increase? How does oil damping of sim sticks factor into realistic feel? (would force feedback plus oil damping be ideal?) 2- Are the two trim functions in the DCS Gazelle manual (and respective buttons indicated on stick grip in the manual) true to the real aircraft? 3- I think I understand the way the Mag Brake function would work in the real helicopter ("centering" force moves to new location so you don't have to fight it). How does the trim actuator function work? Thank you for your patience and efforts in answering our many questions! Trip

I tried OSVR HDK2 today...... it's bad. Hey guys. Today I tried out the Razer OSVR HDK2 for the first time and I was shocked at how bad it was. The headset suffered badly from the lack of a low persistence display. Any time you turn your head it was shocking judder. Oculus DK2 is much much better than HDK2. I would advise to steer well clear of this one.

Thanks guys! @Thadiun Okona sounds good, but can you give me more detail on how that pedal set is assembled to make sure it is smooth? What's in the middle, hidden from sight? I need the "for dummies" explanation. Also everyone, I've got my 2nd question figured out. How do I build a yoke type link (say building a joystick gimbal from scratch) with nice smooth action (bearings/bushings)? I want to actually physically link my left and right sticks, with the left stick gimbal possibly built from scratch and the link between the two definitely built from scratch. Just bear in mind I essentially don't know where to start. All the builds I find online seem to assume the reader is familiar with this basic stuff! PS- Just FYI main joystick will be microhelis.de cyclic base. Also I want to have pots also mounted on the co-pilot gimbal for when I want latency free control from that seat.

@Chump Thank you for testing that and reporting here! It is very good to hear this news.

I'll be happy to help however I can, but really the settings vary a LOT from one sim to another so mine probably won't be much more than a slightly improved starting point for you when the time comes. I actually meant I was happier with the results in DCS. I'll have to look into what he changed, since I too fly the P-51. I have two Aura ST shakers mounted to the platform and they are very effective with SimShaker for Aviators. I think that isolating the platform would be much more important if I had only shakers instead of all the toys. I also have a JetSeat and the total effect of motion+shakers+JetSeat is fantastic. I don't think the shaking of the Huey comes through on the motion platform but that is partly a matter of how I have it tuned. Since I also have bass shakers and JetSeat trying to get high frequency effects from the motion sim (which is not ideally suited to this) was not a priority. Currently I can't imagine the Huey feeling much better than it does for me right now. Soon I'll be doing all I can to try to make the Gazelle settings perfect! For racing and fixed wing airplanes I am really wanting the G-seat, but for several reasons I've decided to focus on helicopters for now instead of making the G-seat top priority. If you ever find yourself in the USA, I'm only 2 hours drive or so from New York City and you are welcome to spend a few hours flying on my rig =) Trip

They say it will ship Feb. 22nd. Not bad!

Thank you @Icebear . MicroHelis.de were very responsive and friendly, and I have now ordered my cyclic! I'll be reporting back with a detailed review once I receive and test the controller. https://shop.microhelis.de/Cyclic-Stick-EC-135/145

@Chump , seeing as my rig is now all taken apart for the multi-crew build might you guys do a test for me? Would you see if after going through your normal routine and both players are in the cockpit, if you fully shut down the Gazelle and then do startup again does it work or break things? I'd like to know myself and this also might help the devs get this fixed. No worries if you don't have time for this test. Trip

All the more reason for someone to come up with a mod to fix it.

Thanks @swissMAG , glad to hear good things about microheli. I did send a message a few hours ago and I'm looking forward to a response. I don't do facebook, but if I must I can get on the crappy laptop we have and sign on. swissMAG, can you link the heli sim group you mentioned? I'll be sure to come back and link a full report on the microheli.de cyclic if I do indeed get it, which I expect I will. Force trim sounds great, I'm all for anything that adds realism. Odds of me both being able to fit it to my rig and be able to afford it after all I've spent recently is another matter!

Hey guys, I'm working on building some custom controls for my helicopter pit and my lack of familiarity with bearings and the ways different types are mounted is making things a bit difficult for me so I was hoping some of you might be able to very easily tell me what I'm looking for. The first thing is for the pedals: What I need looks like what I know as a "pillow block" except instead of mounting to a flat surface it mates with a tube. In my appication I need the cross tube to be fixed, and the pedal portion to rotate freely on it. I need to know what to type into ebay to search for this part. See the marked part in the attached image. I'm probably going to have at least one other similar question, once I know what the question is exactly I'll post it here as well Thanks for any help.